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Discussion Starter #1
I have been planning the LS swap into my 1990 110 , but like many, time and money have been a stoping block.
So I have the opportunity to swap a Bike I have for either an 6.2 LS with six speed or an L86 Gen V with an eight speed.
Both are from trucks or suburbans and have around 30K miles.
I will be wanting to delete the AFM/DOD with cam and lifters what ever the choice.
I have not found a stock cam replacement company for the L86 yet. Everone seems to be making some sort of performance cam that will require additional programing of the computer.
420 hp is plenty, I dont need anymore power, so factory cam specs are what I am looking for. Reliability not a hot rod.
Iam reading alot of things about the 8 speed being problematic and not such a good product.
So.... Nick at RW Performance has the fantastic products to pull off both of these choices with a little price difference.
I feel like the Gen V is the way to go, newer tech , direct injection, single line from the gas tank with no return, get a new converter for the trans and flush it out... hope for the best and enjoy 2 extra gears.
While the LS platform is a solid performer with plenty of proven aftermarket products to get the job done with little problems, this is a pretty solid choice if I want to go that way.
Alright gearheads point me in the right direction with all the good and bad news.
Cheers
 

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what I don't really understand is why you're looking for a reliability and turning off one of the best features of the Gen 5 motor which is the cylinder deactivation? Might as well go with a cheaper Gen 4.

That being said why don't you just put this in the LS thread?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
As far as the AFM . Iam weary of the lifter failure issues. Is this less of an issue with the GenV's? , these are the things Iam trying to figure out.
It sure seems to be problem and popular conversion with many LS owners.
I could change my mind on this if convinced that the lifter failure issue is not as problem matic as some claim.
I agree the milage thing is real positive.
These are the things Iam looking for others with experience in these areas to chime in.
I just would want to perform as much engine teardows (if I choose to ) while the engine is out of the truck.
Perhaps the LS thread would be a better place I dont know , somtimes its a good thing to start fresh and focused on the questions presented, If the moderators want it moved , cool.
 

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Hi, I'm also right now on it, but going for Gen IV. Of course theorically as newer engine better but there is things to solve with the Gen V that are totally unclear for me. In my opinion, beyond decisions as deleting DOD I prefer to see things such as how easy or not it can be to install a Gen V instead of Gen IV. The Gen IV thread in this forum is the most complete and detailed instructions manual to do a swap in a LR I've seen in all my life, and result is excellent. With Gen IV we have available Y-Pipe, brackets for alternator and AA among others... and a very detailed BOM, this is a lot of hours of reverse engineering... I dont know if this exists for the Gen V + 8L90 swap. Maybe we could start with a part of list than already are available, as far as I know we have this:

-LT 230 adapter for 8L90 ( RW )
-engine supports ( RW )
-can bus for Puma ( RW )

If Gen V becomes same as Gen IV, in terms of ease of assembly, parts supply and cost doesn't skyrocket, I could go for Gen V too.
 

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I'm doing an L83 right now. The problem with the 6.2 is premium gas. I have a gen 4 LS in my Jeep and I just programmed off the DOD and traction control which is very easy, no lifter problems after9 years. I'm going to keep it on the L83 and try it out, the gen 4's seemed to have a bit of a lag coming out of it that I didn't like and the fuel savings weren't noticeable to me because it idles along in 6th gear and about 1500rpm anyway. I want to see if it's any better on the new engines and if not I'll probably just delete it and not worry about the lifters.

Wiring Harness-Speartech of course. They will program it for PWM fuel pump and rad fans.

Gas pedal-corvette one, Speartech has them

Gauges-Dakota Digital has everything CANBUS signals

Fuel pump-I used a 2017 Silverado pump on a custom fuel tank, I think Bowtie did the same on his stock 90 tank.

Rad Fans Choices:Do not buy aftermarket if you want the Spals (new originals should be Spals). Good news is PWM fans are slim, around 2.5" but you'll have to build a custom shroud or get creative with some cutting.
-Camero-19" might be a bit big but very powerful (I might roll the dice on this one)

-Corvette-15" more than adequate for a supercharged 6.2L

-Chevy Volt-12" a pair of these will be over 3200CFM

Brackets-http://www.kwikperf.com/lt.html, includes power steering and AC.

Hyd pump block off plugs-common with a google search. 2 bolts for $20 lol.

Exhaust Manifolds-https://www.speed-engineering.com/ls-conversions-swaps/universal-ls-lt-swap-parts/exhaust/lt1-lt4-swap-headers/lt1-lt4-conversion-swap-headers-camaro-chevelle-nova-c10-truck.html

Radiator- Ron Davis has Nick's original CAD drawings as well as mine where I put both the Inlet/Outlet on the drivers side and the integrated transmission cooler on passenger side. Both will work, I just didn't want to have to run my coolant lines across the front.

Intake manifold-probably didn't need it but I put an LT1 intake manifold and throttle body on mine for greater hood clearance, throttle performance, and maybe a little extra HP/Torque. From what I hear from Bowtie Defender, you cannot rotate the intake 180 degrees. I haven't seen it and I haven't tried it, I hope someone can prove this wrong as it is very tight up front. One of the members tried the engine 2" rearward but I think the exhaust might be a problem as well as the foot boxes. Interested to see.

It's 6am and I'm tapped out of thinking and wording until my coffee kicks in, I'm trying to get some painting done before I go any further but I post updates here:


A couple of pictures to show the difference of the intakes.

Sean
 

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Just to specify mine's a L83 5.3/6L80. Up to 380hp/416Torque in stock form.

Forgot exhaust-Built my own, too tight in there for a production Y-pipe I think.

Sean
 

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I'm doing an L83 right now. The problem with the 6.2 is premium gas. I have a gen 4 LS in my Jeep and I just programmed off the DOD and traction control which is very easy, no lifter problems after9 years. I'm going to keep it on the L83 and try it out, the gen 4's seemed to have a bit of a lag coming out of it that I didn't like and the fuel savings weren't noticeable to me because it idles along in 6th gear and about 1500rpm anyway. I want to see if it's any better on the new engines and if not I'll probably just delete it and not worry about the lifters.

Wiring Harness-Speartech of course. They will program it for PWM fuel pump and rad fans.

Gas pedal-corvette one, Speartech has them

Gauges-Dakota Digital has everything CANBUS signals

Fuel pump-I used a 2017 Silverado pump on a custom fuel tank, I think Bowtie did the same on his stock 90 tank.

Rad Fans Choices:Do not buy aftermarket if you want the Spals (new originals should be Spals). Good news is PWM fans are slim, around 2.5" but you'll have to build a custom shroud or get creative with some cutting.
-Camero-19" might be a bit big but very powerful (I might roll the dice on this one)

-Corvette-15" more than adequate for a supercharged 6.2L

-Chevy Volt-12" a pair of these will be over 3200CFM

Brackets-http://www.kwikperf.com/lt.html, includes power steering and AC.

Hyd pump block off plugs-common with a google search. 2 bolts for $20 lol.

Exhaust Manifolds-https://www.speed-engineering.com/ls-conversions-swaps/universal-ls-lt-swap-parts/exhaust/lt1-lt4-swap-headers/lt1-lt4-conversion-swap-headers-camaro-chevelle-nova-c10-truck.html

Radiator- Ron Davis has Nick's original CAD drawings as well as mine where I put both the Inlet/Outlet on the drivers side and the integrated transmission cooler on passenger side. Both will work, I just didn't want to have to run my coolant lines across the front.

Intake manifold-probably didn't need it but I put an LT1 intake manifold and throttle body on mine for greater hood clearance, throttle performance, and maybe a little extra HP/Torque. From what I hear from Bowtie Defender, you cannot rotate the intake 180 degrees. I haven't seen it and I haven't tried it, I hope someone can prove this wrong as it is very tight up front. One of the members tried the engine 2" rearward but I think the exhaust might be a problem as well as the foot boxes. Interested to see.

It's 6am and I'm tapped out of thinking and wording until my coffee kicks in, I'm trying to get some painting done before I go any further but I post updates here:


A couple of pictures to show the difference of the intakes.

Sean
Very clear explanation, for my it's better to stay at Gen IV, the swap is well known and there is key parts as Y-pipes than I prefer to buy it plug and play to look as much as professional construction possible, you can't imagine the nightmare to legalize a swap like this here... You mentioned than problem with 6.2 is premium gasoline, I don't understand, 6.2 can't run with 95 ron gas? :oops:

thanks

Joan
 

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Oil pan stays for now but I have a 2" lift. I will drop it to the bumpstops eventually, Manny says it's not a problem though.
Not sure what 95 RON is but they suggest 91-93, the 5.3 and 6.0 can run on 85. If I was doing a Gen 4 I'd go with the 6.0, got it in my truck, the torque is good, not as good as the new 5.3 apparently.

I would bet a good low milage Gen 4 will cost you more than an equivalent Gen 5 and a custom stainless exhaust together. Gen 5's are cheap for those exact reasons, people are scared because it's new so they pay a premium for the old. Don't get me wrong, the LC9 4's are great, I just think the 5's are better suited giving you torque right off the start.

Sean
 

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Oil pan stays for now but I have a 2" lift. I will drop it to the bumpstops eventually, Manny says it's not a problem though.
Not sure what 95 RON is but they suggest 91-93, the 5.3 and 6.0 can run on 85. If I was doing a Gen 4 I'd go with the 6.0, got it in my truck, the torque is good, not as good as the new 5.3 apparently.

I would bet a good low milage Gen 4 will cost you more than an equivalent Gen 5 and a custom stainless exhaust together. Gen 5's are cheap for those exact reasons, people are scared because it's new so they pay a premium for the old. Don't get me wrong, the LC9 4's are great, I just think the 5's are better suited giving you torque right off the start.

Sean
Thanks Sean,
Gasoline quality is measured using different tests. Depending on the test that is done to control fuel quality, we get:

-Research Octane Number (RON) , used in Europe and most of the world
-Motor Octane Number (MON)

In Europe, gas stations describe different types of gasoline based on their RON rating. It is typical to have 100, 99, 98, 97 or 95 RON with prices varying accordingly. In the States the descriptions look a lot like RON, but they are not. In the US gas stations describe the types of gasoline based on the Pump Octane Number (PON). That number is the average between RON and MON. This causes many problems.
If a fuel is 98 RON ( Europe ) then it will be 93 PON -> 93 PUMP
If a fuel is 95 RON ( Europe ) and 87 MON then it will be 91 PON -> 91 PUMP

source: American vs European fuels – Octane rating – eTuners

So no problem 😅 here we don't have 85, but there is some places in north Africa, than I use to travel with the Defender, than only have 95 ( 91 )

About gen IV vs gen V costs, I already noticed this you mentioned... if I lived in US I would not hesitate to go for a GenV.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I'm doing an L83 right now. The problem with the 6.2 is premium gas. I have a gen 4 LS in my Jeep and I just programmed off the DOD and traction control which is very easy, no lifter problems after9 years. I'm going to keep it on the L83 and try it out, the gen 4's seemed to have a bit of a lag coming out of it that I didn't like and the fuel savings weren't noticeable to me because it idles along in 6th gear and about 1500rpm anyway. I want to see if it's any better on the new engines and if not I'll probably just delete it and not worry about the lifters.

Wiring Harness-Speartech of course. They will program it for PWM fuel pump and rad fans.

Gas pedal-corvette one, Speartech has them

Gauges-Dakota Digital has everything CANBUS signals

Fuel pump-I used a 2017 Silverado pump on a custom fuel tank, I think Bowtie did the same on his stock 90 tank.

Rad Fans Choices:Do not buy aftermarket if you want the Spals (new originals should be Spals). Good news is PWM fans are slim, around 2.5" but you'll have to build a custom shroud or get creative with some cutting.
-Camero-19" might be a bit big but very powerful (I might roll the dice on this one)

-Corvette-15" more than adequate for a supercharged 6.2L

-Chevy Volt-12" a pair of these will be over 3200CFM

Brackets-http://www.kwikperf.com/lt.html, includes power steering and AC.

Hyd pump block off plugs-common with a google search. 2 bolts for $20 lol.

Exhaust Manifolds-https://www.speed-engineering.com/ls-conversions-swaps/universal-ls-lt-swap-parts/exhaust/lt1-lt4-swap-headers/lt1-lt4-conversion-swap-headers-camaro-chevelle-nova-c10-truck.html

Radiator- Ron Davis has Nick's original CAD drawings as well as mine where I put both the Inlet/Outlet on the drivers side and the integrated transmission cooler on passenger side. Both will work, I just didn't want to have to run my coolant lines across the front.

Intake manifold-probably didn't need it but I put an LT1 intake manifold and throttle body on mine for greater hood clearance, throttle performance, and maybe a little extra HP/Torque. From what I hear from Bowtie Defender, you cannot rotate the intake 180 degrees. I haven't seen it and I haven't tried it, I hope someone can prove this wrong as it is very tight up front. One of the members tried the engine 2" rearward but I think the exhaust might be a problem as well as the foot boxes. Interested to see.

It's 6am and I'm tapped out of thinking and wording until my coffee kicks in, I'm trying to get some painting done before I go any further but I post updates here:


A couple of pictures to show the difference of the intakes.

Sean

did you use the silverado gas guage built into the pump or a sperate sender?
 

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My plan is to use the Silverado sender but I do have one from Dakota digital if I need it, honestly that's so far away from me right now I haven't given it much thought. Speartech could explain it better than me.

Sean
 

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Anyone used the eight speed trans yet? Thoughts, comments love it hate it?
Curious as well - we’ve had a series of GMC Yukon’s including 8 and 10 speed that are dreadful - almost dangerous to drive. We traded 8 speeds for the 10’s and same issue if not worse. It’s the one thing that keeps me from committing to an LS swap b/c I have no experience with the 6L but the 8 and and 10 give me plenty of pause

We originally took the 8’s back to the dealer and were told it’s the design and replace with the 10 speed to correct. Still no bueno
 

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I was trying to find a review that Robbie from Motech did on the 8 but I can't find it again. From what I got he figured the 8 is going to need some fine tuning and he preferred the 6L80 at the time. He's driven hundreds of JK swaps with every configuration you can think of and is extremely knowledgeable with all of them. He seemed really excited about the L83/6L80 combo which was a deciding factor for me. With all the tuning possibilities you have with these transmissions I'm sure any of them can be great given the effort. I've got the 6's in my Jeep and GMC truck and now my Defender with no complaints. My one friend did mention that it shifts too smooth in my Jeep and felt disappointing, that can be tuned but I think it's kind of the point haha.

Sean
 

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Discussion Starter #16
These 8L problems are what worry me, some are saying that a new converter and fresh flushed new version Mobil 1 Synthetic LV ATF HP transmission fluid are the fix. Others say that fixed it for a while and then the problems came back. I have to make a decision in the next few days on which engine trans combo to swap for my bike. He has 6.2 LS with 6 speed and the 6.2 L86 with the 8 speed. I would love the direct inject L86 motor, but man this 8 speed is scaring me.
 

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Wow, looking into this a little more it seems they are worse than initial reviews. I was trying to find the tuner I was talking to a couple of years ago and found this:

"Here is some of what was done.

AFM shut off, Torque Management shut off, Variable cam timing adjusted to performance lift, 1st gear set to hold until 11 mph, higher shift pressure for next few gears, torque converter set to 0% slip, raised speeds for converter lockup especially in 8th. Other parameters were adjusted, but these were the main ones.

Some of what was learned.

The TC was slipping too much when trying to lock at light load (half in half out) causing the shudder. It was also trying to lock at too low of a speed/RPM almost lugging the engine (again most pronounced in 8th). No more shudder in any gear. It does take a decent speed (over 60-65 to lock up in 8th, but once locked it will stay locked below 60 unless I kick it in the pants or the load increases). As most of you experience, 1st gear was trying to get to third as quickly as possible. Now I can move through parking lots without trying to throw a U joint. There were more learnings but these 2 are the big ones."

I think I would avoid it and stick with the 6.

Sean
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Wow, looking into this a little more it seems they are worse than initial reviews. I was trying to find the tuner I was talking to a couple of years ago and found this:

"Here is some of what was done.

AFM shut off, Torque Management shut off, Variable cam timing adjusted to performance lift, 1st gear set to hold until 11 mph, higher shift pressure for next few gears, torque converter set to 0% slip, raised speeds for converter lockup especially in 8th. Other parameters were adjusted, but these were the main ones.

Some of what was learned.

The TC was slipping too much when trying to lock at light load (half in half out) causing the shudder. It was also trying to lock at too low of a speed/RPM almost lugging the engine (again most pronounced in 8th). No more shudder in any gear. It does take a decent speed (over 60-65 to lock up in 8th, but once locked it will stay locked below 60 unless I kick it in the pants or the load increases). As most of you experience, 1st gear was trying to get to third as quickly as possible. Now I can move through parking lots without trying to throw a U joint. There were more learnings but these 2 are the big ones."

I think I would avoid it and stick with the 6.

Sean
Much as I want the direct inject motor I have to agree with you. The LS and 6 speed have many aftermarket options and have been well vetted. I think its probably the smarter and safer option.
 

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Good work, that'll be awesome. I was going to suggest you try to get that set up, you'll have to get the transmission programmed to mate up with the engine. Some guys used to have problems doing that but I'm sure the tuners have it figured out by now. Gonna be a monster.

Sean
 
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