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  #21  
Old June 17th, 2019, 03:02 PM
MaineOverland
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I didn't know that! Awesome. Do I need a Maine driver's license?
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  #22  
Old June 17th, 2019, 04:11 PM
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john
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaineOverland View Post
I didn't know that! Awesome. Do I need a Maine driver's license?
nope just an address. truck doesn't even have to be in state.
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  #23  
Old June 17th, 2019, 04:50 PM
Vedrover
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There are 2 important dates for any CKD vehicle:
1) JLR Manufacture Date - confirmed by the British Heritage Museum certificate. In the case of a CKD this is still a date when the kit was crated. There's also a "Despatch Date" - this is when the kit was put on the loading dock at Solihull ready to be shipped to ZA or anywhere else for final assembly.
2) The final assembly date - this is the one that's very hard to prove. Unless you can get a record from a company assembling the CKDs, the most accurate date, accepted by all regulators, is the date the vehicle was registered (plated) for the first time. These at times, could be made available from the in-country versions of DMV. Sometimes, you are lucky enough to get an in-country version of Carfax that can go far enough back in history, and is accepted by the regulators.
In theory, the latter is the date that CBP should be going by to determine the actual age of a vehicle (because there could be months or more between the time CKD kit was crated and a vehicle was actually assembled from it), but not all CBP Officers are sophisticated enough to know this.


Which date are you trying to prove to DMV?
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  #24  
Old June 17th, 2019, 04:51 PM
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A lot of out of state classic car guys register their vehicles in Montana. When I lived in Denver there were companies with fleet vehicles that would register them in Montana to avoid the taxes and emissions.
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  #25  
Old June 17th, 2019, 04:54 PM
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Montana is a tax haven, buy a po box, save thousands. That, I hear, is coming out of style.


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  #26  
Old June 17th, 2019, 06:49 PM
Naplm00
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yea its a well known loophole. Here in California they are impounding cars and charging back taxes, fees and fines to those who get caught. mind you they have stated publicly they are only going after the worst offenders. AKA dudes with Bugattis who dont wanna pay tax
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  #27  
Old June 17th, 2019, 11:41 PM
mitherial
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My 1989 ROW Ninety was originally imported via Florida, so I can't help you with registration per se (getting it titled via another state sounds promising). On the bright side if you are a South Carolina resident, the South Carolina DMV (in Anderson County) only assessed its value at $800, which under SC's pleasant tax rates, works out to about $18/year for automobile property taxes.

God d*** pity I am about to move to the tax hell-hole of Michigan...
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  #28  
Old June 18th, 2019, 06:13 AM
MaineOverland
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Vedrover, the final assembly date. I'm afraid if I explain that his is a CKD they won't understand and I'll really be screwed. I didn't have any problems with CBP, the import process went fine.
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  #29  
Old June 18th, 2019, 07:36 AM
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Sounds like Maine or Montana is the way to go. There should be a company that helps people get their imports titled and registered in their states. I would pay for that in a heartbeat.
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  #30  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:02 AM
Vedrover
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Alex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaineOverland View Post
Vedrover, the final assembly date. I'm afraid if I explain that his is a CKD they won't understand and I'll really be screwed. I didn't have any problems with CBP, the import process went fine.

How did you confirm the 25-year age to CBP? Did they just trust the "model year"?

Do you have the British Motor Heritage Certificate?
Do you have the original ZA title (AFAIK, they have the date of first registration on it)?
Have you checked the ZA version of Carfax to see how far back in history it goes for your VIN?

Your options are to either persuade DMV that the "manufacture date" on the British Heritage Certificate is the final assembly date, which is not true, or dig for any ZA paperwork or VIN check systems in an effort to find the first record of this car being in use 25 years ago or more.

On the CKD part and confusion: if they are asking you for the "final assembly date" then they already know the car is a kit car (CKD), otherwise they would've accepted the British Heritage Certificate assembly date (if, of course, it was provided).
__________________
From another forum on "what killed the British auto industry":
- "I'm pretty sure it was Joseph Lucas."
- "Ah, The Prince of Darkness with his three position switch: "off, flicker and dim"."
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  #31  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:07 AM
MaineOverland
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There is no British Heritage Certificate. I don't think I can get one for a ZA assembled Defender.
As explained in the original post, I have the ZA title, but DMV doesn't like the date of first registration language vs a model year.
Didn't know there was a ZA version of Carfax. Do you know the name of it?
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  #32  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:07 AM
Vedrover
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Here, ZA NATIS certificate of registration for a vehicle, see line 11 (this particular vehicle was first registered in on Jan-24, 2011):
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From another forum on "what killed the British auto industry":
- "I'm pretty sure it was Joseph Lucas."
- "Ah, The Prince of Darkness with his three position switch: "off, flicker and dim"."
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  #33  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:08 AM
MaineOverland
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Yes, I have that. They don't like line 11 because it says "Not Year Model"
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  #34  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:11 AM
MaineOverland
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Here is the pic of my RC1
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  #35  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:13 AM
Vedrover
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Alex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaineOverland View Post
There is no British Heritage Certificate. I don't think I can get one for a ZA assembled Defender.
As explained in the original post, I have the ZA title, but DMV doesn't like the date of first registration language vs a model year.
Didn't know there was a ZA version of Carfax. Do you know the name of it?

You can still get a BHMI certificate for a CKD vehicle, but, after understanding your problem, you shouldn't have to.

In your particular instance you have a knucklehead clerk.

Get their Manager's Manager and explain what that line means.

Anyone should be able to understand the difference between the model year and the year of first registration. In just a couple of months they themselves will be registering a crap-ton of 2020 model year vehicles.
__________________
From another forum on "what killed the British auto industry":
- "I'm pretty sure it was Joseph Lucas."
- "Ah, The Prince of Darkness with his three position switch: "off, flicker and dim"."
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  #36  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:15 AM
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Russell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naplm00 View Post
yea its a well known loophole. Here in California they are impounding cars and charging back taxes, fees and fines to those who get caught. mind you they have stated publicly they are only going after the worst offenders. AKA dudes with Bugattis who dont wanna pay tax
Yep.
Tons of articles on this topic as well.
https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/...-plates-256721
https://jalopnik.com/the-pitfalls-of...cam-1711216059

Uber rich getting worried on the forums:
https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/th...k-down.587351/
the-pitfalls-of-the-montana-license-plate-scam-1711216059

Folks getting busted:
https://www.ajc.com/news/luxury-car-...DX8EuvYzgNo6J/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...=.3c9ca25fe2c3

Yet these Montana firms are still in business:
https://www.mtvehicles.com/
https://www.49dollarmontanaregistere...a-registration
My Montana LLC vehicle registration

And shady attorneys doing the same:
Heggen Law Office - Tax Free Vehicle Registration and Montana LLC

Californa even has a state run narc page:
https://www.chp.ca.gov/notify-chp/ch...tion-violators)
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  #37  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:18 AM
MaineOverland
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Guys, I'm not worried about taxes. I've already paid those

Thanks Vedrover. I'm going to go to the main office in Columbia and take it as high up the chain as possible.

If you have a simple way of explaining the difference between first registration and model year I'm all ears. I'll try anything with these people.
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  #38  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:27 AM
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phoenix37
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john
97 D90 ST / 1957 S1 109/ 1983 LS110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibrouting View Post
Sounds like Maine or Montana is the way to go. There should be a company that helps people get their imports titled and registered in their states. I would pay for that in a heartbeat.
To clarify there are two issues with Maine.

1. They don't require titles on vehicles over 25 years old but they don't issue them either.

2. Tax. You get hit with a hefty excise tax upon first registration of what the MSRP of the vehicle was when new. Not fun on the L322 you paid $9k for but was $82k new.
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  #39  
Old June 18th, 2019, 09:34 AM
Vedrover
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Alex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaineOverland View Post
If you have a simple way of explaining the difference between first registration and model year I'm all ears. I'll try anything with these people.

That part would be easy: as I described above, give them a visual of how they will have 2020 vehicles up for registration in just a couple of months.

However: I just read the entire thread back, and realized that the DMV are questioning the 1990 model year, not the actual date of manufacture.
Looking at your RC1, you still have a 6-digit VIN, and those are not good for VIN checks.

Your only option is to explain to them the vehicle is a kit car, assembled by Leyland in ZA, and that the model year and date of manufacture correspond to the date in line 11 of RC1.
__________________
From another forum on "what killed the British auto industry":
- "I'm pretty sure it was Joseph Lucas."
- "Ah, The Prince of Darkness with his three position switch: "off, flicker and dim"."
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  #40  
Old June 18th, 2019, 02:09 PM
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Davis
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In Colorado, before I can register, I need to get a new compliant VIN for my 1991 D110. I have a letter approving the VIN application and am just waiting on the new tag to be issued/arrive. Then the new VIN will be compliant (in CO) with correct dates and I can get it registered (this is all new this year, btw...).

Soooooo... Maybe apply or see about getting a new VIN?
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