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revor April 14th, 2009 02:05 PM

Random white smoke..
 
Strange but true!! Pure White..

This 300 pours white smoke. This morning the engine was started and it looked like a fog machine!
After about a minute of fogging the neighborhood the truck was moved (still smoking) a few feet to prevent the smoke from killing the bushes and the smoke instantly stopped.

When driving and cold the engine will again pour out white smoke when at minimal throttle (like just a bit more than no throttle) but only letting off the throttle?

When it's warm it pretty much goes away.

It's not overtuned, (no black smoke to speak of) it's not using coolant, the tailpipe is not wet or oily.

It has good torque down low but it's a pig (more than usual) at highway speeds. At the same time however it is making 14psi of boost (on this particular gauge, it has never had a gauge on it before), foot to the floor going up a slight hill at 50MPH.

I have instructed the owner to check the turbo hoses for internal delamination (lack of power) and to have a visual on the turbo (smoke).

I'm going to loan him my spare lift pump to toss on it to see if that helps.

This is a factory 300 installation so fuel pickups and other fuel related things should be right.

Do any of you 300 masters have any thoughts, suggestions or bets?

Should we start a pool? guess what's wrong with the 300? $10 gets you a guess?

jimmy salmon April 14th, 2009 02:48 PM

Turbo. When my turbo went on my 300 TDI it sucks up the oil and blows it straight through the exhaust

bharris April 14th, 2009 02:52 PM

I'm not a betting man so I'm going to say oil leak in the turbo... but rather than ponying up $10 I'm going to sit up and feel all smug if I'm right and hide in the back and pretend I didn't say anything at all if I'm wrong ;)

revor April 14th, 2009 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bharris
I'm not a betting man so I'm going to say oil leak in the turbo... but rather than ponying up $10 I'm going to sit up and feel all smug if I'm right and hide in the back and pretend I didn't say anything at all if I'm wrong ;)


I would have expected as much from you :angry When are we going to get some of those "southern boys" up north to get a beer?

I'm of a mind to think Turbo as well but I've read (not seen) of hoses delaminating and bad lift pumps causing all but the smoke.

bharris April 14th, 2009 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by revor
I would have expected as much from you :angry

:tounge

Quote:

Originally Posted by revor
When are we going to get some of those "southern boys" up north to get a beer?

My office is now in Boulder so I'd be very happy with a Northern happy hour... Longmont is now a WHOLE lot closer than the south side of Denver...


Quote:

Originally Posted by revor
I'm of a mind to think Turbo as well but I've read (not seen) of hoses delaminating and bad lift pumps causing all but the smoke.

I haven't heard that one so I'll be interested to hear the final outcome...

exmod110 April 14th, 2009 06:24 PM

White smoke is unburnt fuel form a cold engine, incorrect injection timing, cracked injector, poor spray pattern or low compression. A turbo leaking oil will cause blue smoke and should not cause poor performance unless it's coked bad. Had a 2.5 na that would smoke white in the hills going down hill only.. turned out to be the pump was out just a bit, that can also cause the poor top end performance along with poor spray patterns from the injectors. Did this "Just start happening" or has it been slowly getting worse? Does it sound like a healthy 300, not overly quiet or noisy?

bharris April 14th, 2009 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exmod110
White smoke is unburnt fuel form a cold engine, incorrect injection timing, cracked injector, poor spray pattern or low compression. A turbo leaking oil will cause blue smoke and should not cause poor performance unless it's coked bad. Had a 2.5 na that would smoke white in the hills going down hill only.. turned out to be the pump was out just a bit, that can also cause the poor top end performance along with poor spray patterns from the injectors. Did this "Just start happening" or has it been slowly getting worse? Does it sound like a healthy 300, not overly quiet or noisy?

I don't claim in any way shape or form to be an expert and I'm sure the above is all correct and true... the experience I've had with mine differs...

-I got blue smoke when my timing was off (going down hill)
-blown turbo got billowing white smoke (ah that was fun)
- cold engine gets me black smoke (but I have a webasto now so no more cold engines)

revor April 14th, 2009 07:17 PM

I can't disagree with you Don. But the wierd thing is that the White (maybe blue?) happens only periodically and not while you are "getting on it" or really working the engine when you would expect this to happen. It only happens at near idle or idle when it is cool. That's not to say a bad injector couldn't be causing the problem, it's just that I would expect to see the unburnt fuel at load as well.
Going downhill when warm there is no smoke, literally none. This is almost a worry to me as we live a 5000 ft and I would expect to see a little.
The engine is at about 60K miles.
The engine sounds just like my 140K overworked beastie, mine currently "blows the doors off" the one in question (you can't imagine what a thrill it was to blow the doors off something other than a bicycle!)

This did happen abruptly, like right away.

Steps taken so far have been a little ATF in the fuel tank, a change of air, oil and fuel filters, new fuel in the tank. and the tappet clearance has been checked.
This engine has never been "tuned" or opened and in fact it's so clean you can eat off it.

Brad you make me jealous with your Webasto, I will need to have a met and greet at the house so I can gawk at all these lovely things!!!

rover4x4 April 14th, 2009 07:40 PM

the drilling company had a 7.3 Powerstroke and it was puking up a lot of white smoke, I thought they had killed the turbo it turned out to be an injector. Amazing engine that 7.3...

Roadsiderob April 15th, 2009 12:38 AM

Keith,
Is this truck local to you? I have the timing tools if you need to check or adjust the pump timing.
Rob
PS how's the 5.0 doing?

revor April 15th, 2009 09:21 AM

Hey Rob,
5.0? :)

It's right down the street, I really should just buy a set for the quantity of 300's around here. I think John has them as well. Be a lot easier to use than bolts and drills when changing timing belts!

We'll see what he finds today.

revor April 18th, 2009 03:56 PM

UPDATE!!
The #2 and #4 injectors were leaking at the copper washer. All four were changed and so did what the truck is doing.
At the same time the tappets were adjusted (not out really)
Now instead of blue white smoke at start up and idle there's a nice black puff!
But while revving it on the curb it misses and blows loads of blue white smoke. Under load while the truck drove away there was a little blue smoke (very little) and even little random puffs of black smoke while on the throttle. There was no moisture in the white smoke and it did smell strongly of unburnt fuel.
The hoses are all good and turbo is free. The motor sounds fine, no real rattle as compared to mine.
We did notice the crank pulley is wobbling like it's bent (!?) It is unknown if it has been doing this for a long time but there was no end or side play in the pulley.
Next step wil be to change out the injectors from another truck.

revor April 19th, 2009 11:45 AM

Further update!
 
The Crank pulley is trash, as too to seems the lower timing belt pulley. So indeed the timing is probably off a bit.

exmod110 April 19th, 2009 04:49 PM

Check the crank at the key way for damage also. if the damper bolt came loose it can damage the crank, pulley and timing gear.

revor April 19th, 2009 05:02 PM

Both crank keys were shot and needed to be ground out with a dremel type grinder. The crank seems fine but we'll know more in a few minutes.

cgalpin April 19th, 2009 07:25 PM

ROFL. This thread is making me think we need a twitter to vBulletin bridge so we can get realtime updates on repairs.

exmod110 April 20th, 2009 09:45 PM

Updates?

cgalpin April 20th, 2009 09:51 PM

Don, nice avatar. Got any more pictures of your truck?

Sorry for the thread hijack.

exmod110 April 20th, 2009 10:46 PM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/31155366@N08/
This is just a mix of my pics some of mine, my dads and friends stuff... Can try search "exmod110" on you tube, I have 3 short vids there.

revor April 20th, 2009 11:17 PM

Well the truck left last night at about 9:00P and is probably in Prescott AZ tonight (1200 miles) . Report where that it was running much better than it has in a while.

In the end the two pulley's where shot, the outermost wobbling like mad. There was rust like mad in the area under the pulley's but I would almost expect that considering the pressure caused by the damage. The solution was to replace all the parts (the pulleys, seal and such) the biggest part of the job was getting the keys out that needed to be cut out with a burr on a pencil grinder, we cut out the middle to create a hollow space inside that relieved the pressure on the outside, then they came right out.
Cam timing seemed to off but we couldn't be sure but it's sure to be right now.

Long story keep your pulley's clean and tight, if you take them apart make sure that you seal them up with a good non hardening gasket maker like form a gasket (courtesy of Mr. Pendy)

We both hthank everyone for the feedback, and hopefully this adds to the knowledge base.

I'll try and post pics tomorrow.


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