Whats legal? Frame Swaps, Importing, etc - Page 15 - Defender Source
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  #281  
Old February 23rd, 2013, 04:24 AM
jwb
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Jason
1988 110 CSW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zarnet View Post
I'm looking at buying a 1988 Defender with 200tdi engine. The epa forms say that the engine must be original or equivalent, but since the 200tdi was manufactured form 1990-94, half of them would now be eligible for epa exemption (21 years or older).

So my question is can i import a 1988 defender with a 200tdi engine and still be exempt from epa requirements? Will the CBP look for the engine manufacturer date?

Thanks!
I think you answered your own question. As I understand it, code E on EPA 3520-1 does not cover replacement engines unless they are EPA certified (not age exempted, if thats even a category). So legally, no.

Hell, all of the import horror stories about each customs official's interpetation of "unmodified original" has me avoiding comfort (interior) and safety (sliders & NAS cage) mods prior importing my 19J 110 next year. And where does original restoration fit within the spectrum of "unmodified"? All very frustrating, especially for those trying to stay out of the legal grey.
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  #282  
Old March 14th, 2013, 04:57 PM
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Jim Ecker
1964 Series 2/2a bitsa
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I know that Defenders are being closely looked at by the Feds. What about older vehicles like Series 1s? I've been toying with the idea of bringing in an S1 and wonder if a frame swap and LHD would pass the gauntlet.
Jim
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  #283  
Old March 31st, 2013, 08:21 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Matt posted up an interesting take on the EPA 21yr exemption rule in a recent thread.

http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...1&postcount=11

If this is correct he suggests you can fit anything you want to a truck once it reaches 21yrs old as long as the truck is already here in the US and the work is done here. That of course would affect all imported 25yr ROW trucks now, NAS 110s next year, NAS 94 90s the year after and so on. So I think its a really critical rule to check as I am sure there are a bunch of trucks out there that would benefit from an understanding of this rule?

Importation rules aside, does anybody know what the actual interpretation of this rule is and if Matt's take is the right one?

Ian

Edit - My comments regarding Matt's suggestion on the rule is based on my interpretation of what he said of course in that post and others in the thread. He may clarify his position I am sure if I am interpreting him incorrectly. From reading the rules it is murky to me but I can see how what (I think) he said may be correct.
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  #284  
Old April 1st, 2013, 12:38 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Looks like I get to answer my own question...

Based on a phone conversation with EPA this morning we have an response on the 21yr rule interpretation from them. The guy at EPA stated that he was already well versed with the LR Engine Swaps situation and was already primed with the answer.

According to the EPA the 21yr exemption applies to a truck that maintains its original configuration (same as their import rules). If you change that configuration with an engine that is younger than 21yrs then you lose the 21yr exemption. If that configuration is changed (engine change) then the (EPA) age of the vehicle is determined by the age of the engine. That's why the emissions stuff has to be included as the emissions rules for the vehicle will now match those in effect for the model year of the new engine you've fitted. Since you are not allowed to fit an engine that is older than the vehicle then the vehicles (EPA) age would remain the same or get younger depending on the age of the engine you put in. This applies to US Type accepted engines.

When asked about fitting non-type accepted engines that are older than 21yrs to trucks also over 21yrs his response was, you CANNOT fit a non-type accepted engine of a different type to the one the vehicle was originally manufactured with PERIOD. He re-iterated that the 21yr exemption is based on the vehicles original configuration. If you change that configuration, you lose the exemption and the vehicle must then comply with EPA rules.

Ian
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  #285  
Old April 1st, 2013, 01:11 PM
NikosF
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Nick
1995 NAS D-90
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So - does anyone know of any good auto storage facilities in the south of England, so I can buy an original 110 tdi and keep it in storage until it hits 25 y.o. in a few years? At this point the prices are still reasonable (according to LRM), but once they hit 25 years, the Brits will start scalping us.
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  #286  
Old April 1st, 2013, 01:31 PM
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Jason England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosF View Post
So - does anyone know of any good auto storage facilities in the south of England, so I can buy an original 110 tdi and keep it in storage until it hits 25 y.o. in a few years? At this point the prices are still reasonable (according to LRM), but once they hit 25 years, the Brits will start scalping us.
Storage in a dry but not humidity controlled place would be about 20 pounds per week. or about 1000 pounds per year.

3 years storage for $5000 ...
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  #287  
Old April 1st, 2013, 01:51 PM
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1995 NAS D-90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
Have a look in mainland Europe. The steering wheel is on the correct side there.

-Jeff
If only I wasn't linguistically challenged!
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  #288  
Old April 1st, 2013, 02:05 PM
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Jason England
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Originally Posted by NikosF View Post
If only I wasn't linguistically challenged!
fortunately for you ... they aren't ...
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Quote:
Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #289  
Old April 1st, 2013, 02:24 PM
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Paul Kennington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikosF View Post
So - does anyone know of any good auto storage facilities in the south of England, so I can buy an original 110 tdi and keep it in storage until it hits 25 y.o. in a few years? At this point the prices are still reasonable (according to LRM), but once they hit 25 years, the Brits will start scalping us.
I was quoted ten pounds per week. That's for a garage. So it'll be dry but not climate controlled. If the LR is prepped correctly, that shouldn't be a problem, so long as it is safe.

That's my plan!
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  #290  
Old April 1st, 2013, 03:50 PM
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Jason England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul K View Post
I was quoted ten pounds per week. That's for a garage. So it'll be dry but not climate controlled. If the LR is prepped correctly, that shouldn't be a problem, so long as it is safe.

That's my plan!
yes it's possible to rent a garage in a block for a tenner a week. Most likely just a garage in the middle of a 'council estate' ... or projects as they would be called in this country.

Are you going over to place it in storage yourself?
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #291  
Old April 1st, 2013, 06:19 PM
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Paul Kennington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
yes it's possible to rent a garage in a block for a tenner a week. Most likely just a garage in the middle of a 'council estate' ... or projects as they would be called in this country.

Are you going over to place it in storage yourself?
Actually, this quote is for a block of garages out in the country, no where near a council estate. My Dad (who still lives in the UK) will have the rig prepared for storage & will take it there.
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Past Land Rovers: '96 Discovery SD, '00 Range Rover HSE, '04 Discovery SE7, '07 Range Rover HSE, '08 LR3 SE7.
Past fleet: '89 Classic Mini, '83 Porsche 911 SC Coupe, '89 911 Carrera targa, '96 911 Carrera 4, '07 Toyota FJ Cruiser, several Minis.
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  #292  
Old April 1st, 2013, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul K View Post
Actually, this quote is for a block of garages out in the country, no where near a council estate. My Dad (who still lives in the UK) will have the rig prepared for storage & will take it there.
if it's in the country don't forget the mice traps ...
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #293  
Old April 1st, 2013, 08:26 PM
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Andrew
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Garages in the UK can be very damp if not wet based on personal experience while I had a Range Rover over there.
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  #294  
Old April 1st, 2013, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by headdamage View Post
Garages in the UK can be very damp if not wet based on personal experience while I had a Range Rover over there.
Whole country is one rainy day away from being a swamp.
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #295  
Old April 1st, 2013, 09:34 PM
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Paul Kennington
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Quote:
Originally Posted by headdamage View Post
Garages in the UK can be very damp if not wet based on personal experience while I had a Range Rover over there.
If I can find dry storage that is kept above freezing, I may go with it.

There's a reason most 25yr old LRs from the UK have rotten frames!
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Past Land Rovers: '96 Discovery SD, '00 Range Rover HSE, '04 Discovery SE7, '07 Range Rover HSE, '08 LR3 SE7.
Past fleet: '89 Classic Mini, '83 Porsche 911 SC Coupe, '89 911 Carrera targa, '96 911 Carrera 4, '07 Toyota FJ Cruiser, several Minis.
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  #296  
Old April 1st, 2013, 10:50 PM
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Rocky
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Chris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul K View Post

I was quoted ten pounds per week. That's for a garage. So it'll be dry but not climate controlled. If the LR is prepped correctly, that shouldn't be a problem, so long as it is safe.

That's my plan!
Only LR museum I know of is Dunsfold. And even their storage is ancient.
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  #297  
Old April 6th, 2013, 06:32 PM
kjva
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Ken Jackson
1985 110 Wagon
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This is a hypothosis and I have no intention of doing it but rather than jack another thread would post here.
The company ITS advertises titles for vehicles up to 1997.
So in theory you could drive a 1997 Rover or any car for that matter from Canada pull off the Candadian plates and get a Maine title.
The VIN would be original.
As US Customs had been bypassed who would figure it out ?
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  #298  
Old April 6th, 2013, 06:38 PM
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They will. Trust me they will.
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  #299  
Old April 21st, 2013, 10:22 AM
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Conor
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Anyone know if you can import an '86 d90 with a 1991 2.5tdi engine already in it? Couldn't find a solid answer yet.
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  #300  
Old April 21st, 2013, 11:20 AM
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Oscar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byrnecc View Post
Anyone know if you can import an '86 d90 with a 1991 2.5tdi engine already in it? Couldn't find a solid answer yet.
I'm sure someone will give you a better answer but as I understand it the answer is no. The truck should be in its original condition/ configuration. There has been lots of talk lately about the CBP and DHS raiding importers and seizing Defenders.

I would have to say that now would not be a good time to import anything other than an original 25 year old truck.
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