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  #1  
Old March 17th, 2006, 01:48 PM
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Exclamation what size Winch, Brand ect....

I'm trying to decide which winch to add to the truck.
I will have someone make me a custom mount
since I don't want to give up my wrap around bumper.
I know Warn is a popular winch, I am just not familiar with the size
I would need for my 1994 D-90.
Any other winches that rival warn !?
What should I look for before purchase!?
What kinda cable, eas of use etc...
$ is no issue, gimme the best
Thanks and happy ST. Patrick's day..
( gonna get tanked tonight )
Christine
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  #2  
Old March 17th, 2006, 01:55 PM
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While you'll get 743 different opinions on the subject, I'd say get the biggest you can afford (you never hear anyone say "gee, I never use that last 1000 lbs of strength on my winch" but you do see 8000lb winches not doing the job), put synthetic line on it for safety's sake. I love my warn 10K, and warn's support is fantastic. I'd suggest staying away from T-max as getting parts for my dead one has proven to be complete hell.
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Old March 17th, 2006, 02:29 PM
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You dont need a custom if you want to keep the factory wrap around, just get the LR genuine winch bumper. Its the stock bumper already set up with a hidden winch tray and the brush bar mounts to it the same way it does now to yoru bumper.

As for winch sizes, the 8K is smallest you should go but works well for a D90 however at least a 9K or higher would be better especially for winching other heavier trucks out.
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  #4  
Old March 17th, 2006, 02:55 PM
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One quick comment on the TMax thing- I've been running those for awhile and I'm impressed with the bang/buck ratio. Never had a problem getting parts for them- I got replacement gaskets easily.
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  #5  
Old March 17th, 2006, 03:03 PM
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MANDY STRINGER
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Warn 8274 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  #6  
Old March 17th, 2006, 03:16 PM
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I agree! The 8274 is one of the coolest winches ever! It's fast, it's tuff, they last forever and the motor is separated from the drum so if you use synthetic rope you don't have to worry about melting it.

But Christine how often will you be winching? 8274s are a bit pricey new, and they move fast so for someone without allot of winching experience they may be a bit of a challenge. a warn 9000 series would also do the job well.

Oh and the stock winch tray for the wrap around bumper sucks! Here it is on Ken's 90

http://www.defendersource.com/trail/...s/DSC00026.jpg

As you can see it hangs WAY too low!

http://www.defendersource.com/trail/...s/DSC00330.jpg
http://www.defendersource.com/trail/...s/DSC00496.jpg
http://www.defendersource.com/trail/...s/DSC00495.jpg

Those are all in the same spot, My 90 and Jimmy's old D2 made it through there mush easier due to better approach angle.

I say Stay away from the stock winch carrier!
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  #7  
Old March 17th, 2006, 03:39 PM
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I went with the Superwinch Husky 10... It is a 10K winch, it is slow, but you can use it all day with out damaging it. Also, it is a worm drive, so the spool will not get hot, and you can use plasma without any concerns.


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  #8  
Old March 17th, 2006, 03:44 PM
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Mike,

That's the hidden winch tray not the stock. The stock one after the hidden winch tray above looks very similar to the Mantec bumper.

Christine,
The stocker is very expensive and offers no advantage other than it was offered thru the factory. The Mantec available trhu RN is very very similar looking but stronger and should fit the OEM brush bar. Measure the mounting holes and call them to ask. But for the price you could get a Rockware bumper brush bar combo which is way tougher. I like the Superwinch Husky 10k.
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  #9  
Old March 17th, 2006, 03:50 PM
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I think I'd go for the Husky as well- on a Rockware bumper. The Bearmach bumper is solid if you want a "plain Jane" bumper.
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  #10  
Old March 17th, 2006, 05:44 PM
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Here is a Superwinch 10,000 installed on my Defender
http://www.pbase.com/robisonphoto/image/55752929

These are much more rugged winches than the Warn products. We install both but if you want the best the Warn is not even close to the Superwinch. However, the Superwinch is considerably more money so you're gettin gwhat you pay for and for the occasional use most winches see the Warn is surely good enough.
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Old March 17th, 2006, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYoung
One quick comment on the TMax thing- I've been running those for awhile and I'm impressed with the bang/buck ratio. Never had a problem getting parts for them- I got replacement gaskets easily.
Steve, can you source parts? I called up there and was told no . . . Can't get through in 3 weeks of trying to their parts department and a big vendor of the winches can't get his rep to respond. However, you're right, I've heard great things about them as well. This one's destined for the lwb if I can source the parts . . . any help would be VERY welcome!
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  #12  
Old March 17th, 2006, 07:08 PM
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winch bumper

why dont you guys do what we do?...... make your own! bumper that is!
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b1...7/P1010010.jpg
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Old March 18th, 2006, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robisonservice
Here is a Superwinch 10,000 installed on my Defender
http://www.pbase.com/robisonphoto/image/55752929

These are much more rugged winches than the Warn products. We install both but if you want the best the Warn is not even close to the Superwinch. However, the Superwinch is considerably more money so you're gettin gwhat you pay for and for the occasional use most winches see the Warn is surely good enough.
Wow, thats some serious opinion being thrown as fact there. Put up a poll on any wheeling pbb and there is a good chance that Warn will out-vote superwinch. I've never seen a Warn bust like this, even after 12 years of using them.
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  #14  
Old March 18th, 2006, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckon37s
Wow, thats some serious opinion being thrown as fact there. Put up a poll on any wheeling pbb and there is a good chance that Warn will out-vote superwinch. I've never seen a Warn bust like this, even after 12 years of using them.
David, there are no shortage of broken Warn winches to compare to the broken Superwinch in your photo.

I've installed and used and repaired well over 100 winches and as a result I'd wager that I have more personal experience with how they work and last than most D90 owners. It's been my experience that people buy a product like a winch and if it works for them they'd vote for it again. Few people buy 5-6 models and compare them. Why would they?

I have had the good fortune to rig identical trucks with various Warn and Superwinch models and run them side by side in the course of my work.

As I said in my post, the Warn is a perfectle adequate winch for most people, but if you are using it heavily the Superwinch 10k is a stronger performer in my experience for these reasons:

1 - the worm gear drive does not require a friction brake. The Warn friction brakes are a source of internal drag and when powering down they generate substantial heat, meaning you can't power the winch back down a hill with synthetic line
2 - the motor used in the Superwinch is heavier and heats up quite a bit less in sustained pulling. For example, using a Superwinch in a fixed position to pull 10 trucks up an obstacle you have a lot less heat than the comparable Warn
3 - the Warn winches are a lot more suscepitble to warping of the mounting surface. If a Warn winch is not mounted perfectly square the friction brake will tend to bind the drum and the winch will lose power or jam. This situation can happen when mounting to a new bar that is less than 100%, but it can also happen on the trail as a result of hitting something. That is a significant vulnerability.
4 - when they get to be 4-5 years old I have found Warn consumer winches lose more of their pulling power than the Superwinch 10ks.

The tendency of Warn "consumer" winches to heat the center of the cable reel is a real weakness for those who want to use synthetic cable. Synthetics deterioriate quite rapidly as they are heated up beyond 120 degrees, to the point where the innermost wrap on the drum may only have half its strength under load. This is not usually noticed because most winching does not load the rope to that level but if it happens and the rope breks as a result, that's clearly a weakness. Superwinch models don't heat the drum and therefore don't have that weakness.

This is not obvious because when a weakened rope breaks you tend to blame chafe or "something in the rope" . . . few people would think that the breaking strength dropped below critical level because of the drum.

With respect to the opinions on 4-wheeling BBS, for the most part they are along the lines of "my winch is great" or "my winch sucks." There are very few comparative tests as I've been able to do.
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Old March 18th, 2006, 08:17 AM
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Intresting comments but i think you should come over to LR4X4.COM and have a chat with some of our boys? we have had such a disscussion (which winch is better/best) going for quite some time.
none of the above comments about warns seem to be a problem over here, do we use them in a differant way to you guys?
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  #16  
Old March 18th, 2006, 10:29 AM
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Again, Warn 8274 is the way to go!
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  #17  
Old March 18th, 2006, 11:57 AM
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I have a number of winches and I would never buy a superwinch again(actually did not buy the one I have, came on the 90). Just looking at the specs they are slow, draw a lot of current and heavy.

If I were buying a winch for my 90, which I am thinking about, It would be between warn 9500xp, 9.5ti, 9.5si (mosfet) or a used 8274 I would rebuild with a 6hp xp motor.

Both warn and superwinch have very complete specs on their websites. Compare the winches yourself and the +/- are apparent. There are trade offs.

The MOSFET solid state control is awesome, reliable but the charge for it.

The only superwinches I would look at are the industrial hydraulic winches

HTH
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Old March 18th, 2006, 12:58 PM
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If I were to go with a warn, I'd also go with the 8274. The extra capacity of winch line is one plus, and the spur gear setup is much less of a heat generator so synthetic line is an option. The weight rating is a bit smaller than I would like on the D-90, but when the time comes i'm definitely going with one on my CJ.

I have a hydraulic Milemarker on mine, but it does need some service due to neglect by the previous owner. I like its potential on a Defender, but it does take a more complex installation to get the most out of it, due to the low pressure steering pump we have. Eventually I want to put either a PTO hydraulic pump or second power steering pump dedicated to the winch.

-Hans
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Old March 18th, 2006, 01:22 PM
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I am looking at winches now too, not for a D-90 but my 02 Disco. Great advice here....keep it coming!

Rover-Girl your truck looks simply amazing!
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Old March 18th, 2006, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robisonservice
David, there are no shortage of broken Warn winches to compare to the broken Superwinch in your photo.

I've installed and used and repaired well over 100 winches and as a result I'd wager that I have more personal experience with how they work and last than most D90 owners. It's been my experience that people buy a product like a winch and if it works for them they'd vote for it again. Few people buy 5-6 models and compare them. Why would they?

I have had the good fortune to rig identical trucks with various Warn and Superwinch models and run them side by side in the course of my work.

As I said in my post, the Warn is a perfectle adequate winch for most people, but if you are using it heavily the Superwinch 10k is a stronger performer in my experience for these reasons:

1 - the worm gear drive does not require a friction brake. The Warn friction brakes are a source of internal drag and when powering down they generate substantial heat, meaning you can't power the winch back down a hill with synthetic line
2 - the motor used in the Superwinch is heavier and heats up quite a bit less in sustained pulling. For example, using a Superwinch in a fixed position to pull 10 trucks up an obstacle you have a lot less heat than the comparable Warn
3 - the Warn winches are a lot more suscepitble to warping of the mounting surface. If a Warn winch is not mounted perfectly square the friction brake will tend to bind the drum and the winch will lose power or jam. This situation can happen when mounting to a new bar that is less than 100%, but it can also happen on the trail as a result of hitting something. That is a significant vulnerability.
4 - when they get to be 4-5 years old I have found Warn consumer winches lose more of their pulling power than the Superwinch 10ks.

The tendency of Warn "consumer" winches to heat the center of the cable reel is a real weakness for those who want to use synthetic cable. Synthetics deterioriate quite rapidly as they are heated up beyond 120 degrees, to the point where the innermost wrap on the drum may only have half its strength under load. This is not usually noticed because most winching does not load the rope to that level but if it happens and the rope breks as a result, that's clearly a weakness. Superwinch models don't heat the drum and therefore don't have that weakness.

This is not obvious because when a weakened rope breaks you tend to blame chafe or "something in the rope" . . . few people would think that the breaking strength dropped below critical level because of the drum.

With respect to the opinions on 4-wheeling BBS, for the most part they are along the lines of "my winch is great" or "my winch sucks." There are very few comparative tests as I've been able to do.

Very well said. Problem is the majority of winch users disagree with you. Like evidenced in the above posts. And the problems that you speak of don't stop the majority of even competition winchers from using Warn. I would not have had any issue with your statement if you had said "In my opinion", because its an opinion. Do you have a picture of a new Warn with a broken case like that? I've never seen one, but I don't get around that much. Cheers
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