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  #1  
Old March 20th, 2011, 06:45 PM
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Weeping Water Pump

So, I have a weeping water pump in my 110. How long can it survive like this?

Just FYI a little history on the beast:

In Feb we had some super cold days. I drive the truck one day when it was -20 ish. Truck was fine at first, then overheated. I drove it longer than I should have since I had an infant and toddler in the truck and wanted to pull over somewhere warm. Had the truck towed home. Coolant was everywhere under the hood. Took the hoses off the radiator and pump- frozen solid. The pump actually was a solid block of ice from all the hose openings. Got the thing defrosted, slush out of the houses, etc. Filled it up with new coolant and ran it, drove it around the block and around town. Drove to Denver and back, has some coolant drips. I tightened up some hoses just in case and then it sat for a few days. Drove it around town- about 45 minutes and it had sprayed coolant inside again, but no overheating since the frigid day.

As of now I have replaced the gasket for the water pump, the pump doesn't have any shaft play and the impeller looks great (the pump itself is brand new- it was two months old when it froze). I replaced the thermostat and gaskets there too. Filled it up and it just drips from the weep hole at a steady rate.

Any way to fix this or is it just a new pump? I do have a new pump but I can't get the expansion hose fitting off the old pump to put it on the new one. I tried heat, beating it and swearing at it. The new pump has the 3 hose openings it just needs that coupling.

So- can I stop the weeping or do I need to source a new coupling?

Thanks,
Alex
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  #2  
Old March 20th, 2011, 07:18 PM
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Typically when a water pumps starts leaking from the weep hole it is a sign that the water pump is on its way out and needs to be replaced.

In your case since it is a new pump maybe the internal seal was damaged when the liquid froze. I suppose other internal parts of the pump could also be damaged and you could be on borrowed time.

Can you post a picture of the part that is giving you a hard time? I might be free early in the week if you need an extra hand or some additional tools.
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  #3  
Old March 20th, 2011, 07:33 PM
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Offending Part

Here is offending part- heated it, swore at it, begged, hit it with a hammer. Nothing.
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  #4  
Old March 20th, 2011, 09:30 PM
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They can be hard to get off

Leave the pump bolted in place, unscrew the hose clamp and move it out of the way, pull on the hose while moving it up and down. If that does not work you can try a twisting motion.

I have also had good luck using a tool (see picture) to get under the hose and break the bond between the pipe and the hose just make sure you do not puncture the hose.
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  #5  
Old March 21st, 2011, 09:20 AM
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It's not the hose but the actual fitting threaded into the pump that I need to remove. The new pump has a plug that I can remove and my old pump has this fitting that I need to install on the new pump.
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Old March 21st, 2011, 09:37 AM
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Sorry, kind of hard to tell what it is in the picture
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  #7  
Old March 21st, 2011, 09:45 AM
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What's that look like without the hose on it? Is it a hose nipple or is it threaded?
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  #8  
Old March 21st, 2011, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevkon View Post
What's that look like without the hose on it? Is it a hose nipple or is it threaded?
One side is the hose nipple and the other side is threaded and goes into the pump. I think there is locktite on it and I just can't get it loose. I heated a ton and it still won't budge. I know I'm not that much of a sissy.
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  #9  
Old March 21st, 2011, 10:15 AM
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If it's threaded into the pump then it's aluminum corrosion that's probably the issue. That can really be tough to remove without damage. As a last resort you might try cutting the female pump side off past the threads and then make relief cuts in it without hitting the threads.
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  #10  
Old March 21st, 2011, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevkon View Post
If it's threaded into the pump then it's aluminum corrosion that's probably the issue. That can really be tough to remove without damage. As a last resort you might try cutting the female pump side off past the threads and then make relief cuts in it without hitting the threads.
It's only a few months old, I would hope it's not that corroded. If heating mine up some more doesn't yield my desired outcome I'll get to cutting.

I did get the part number, currently on the search for ERC 7313.
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  #11  
Old March 21st, 2011, 11:05 AM
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Ahh.. So you are trying to get the nipple out that threads into the water pump

If I remember correct it has a surface that you can get a wrench or socket on, can you remove the hose and get a large socket on it with a breaker bar? Or the closed end of a wrench?

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  #12  
Old March 21st, 2011, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_lucas View Post
Ahh.. So you are trying to get the nipple out that threads into the water pump

If I remember correct it has a surface that you can get a wrench or socket on, can you remove the hose and get a large socket on it with a breaker bar? Or the closed end of a wrench?

Here is a picture
YES!!!! That's the plan. Heated it up and cand get it to move. Going to try again today. Any issues with doing it while it is on the motor? I've was trying to do it with it off the motor. Haven't tried a socket and breaker bar, was just using a wrench. New plan of attack for nap time this afternoon.
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  #13  
Old March 21st, 2011, 11:28 AM
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seems like a place where teflon tape would have been better choice than loctite.
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  #14  
Old March 21st, 2011, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aosias View Post
Drove to Denver and back, has some coolant drips. I tightened up some hoses just in case and then it sat for a few days. Drove it around town- about 45 minutes and it had sprayed coolant inside again, but no overheating since the frigid day.

As of now I have replaced the gasket for the water pump, the pump doesn't have any shaft play and the impeller looks great (the pump itself is brand new- it was two months old when it froze). I replaced the thermostat and gaskets there too. Filled it up and it just drips from the weep hole at a steady rate.

So- can I stop the weeping or do I need to source a new coupling?
From all of this it sounds like there is combustion pressure leaking into the cooling system. It will do this for a while and you will be chasing leaks forever until it finally blows the head gasket. Sorry to say that but you might want to spend a few bucks on a kit to test for combustion gasses in the cooling system.
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Old March 21st, 2011, 11:30 AM
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Its in there with some thread sealant, but there is no loctite or any other product that would make it stick in place. We use large sockets in order to install them. Loctite or any similar locking product where steel and alloy meet would be very unwise.
Loctite is only used in some things like ring and pinion bolts, but never in the cooling system of an engine.

With the pump bolted in place and the proper socket on it, it will spin right out.

------ Follow up post added March 21st, 2011 11:33 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ren Ching View Post
From all of this it sounds like there is combustion pressure leaking into the cooling system. It will do this for a while and you will be chasing leaks forever until it finally blows the head gasket. Sorry to say that but you might want to spend a few bucks on a kit to test for combustion gasses in the cooling system.
Exactly. One of the first tests to do is a pressure test of the system. If there is no obvious leaks but pressure still drops, it is very wise to do a test of for the presence of exhaust gas in the coolant.
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  #16  
Old March 21st, 2011, 03:55 PM
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Good call on the possible exhaust leak.
Sorry Alexandra, I mistakenly thought you were dealing with an old pump.
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Old March 21st, 2011, 05:53 PM
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Pressure tested the system this afternoon. I have a new thermostat installed, and a new water pump gasket but the original water pump. All hoses are tight and the system is filled with water for now- itís about 70 degrees and sunny here today.

Hereís what I did:

Test 1:
Connected the tester to the expansion tank and pumped it up to 10psi- slowly lost pressure and water poured out of the weep hole on the old pump.

Test 2:
Connected the tester to the expansion tank and didnít pressurize it. Started the truck (it was cold) and let it come up to temp. Never created any pressure on the gauge, temp gauge heated up to the middle but never overheated. Turned on heater and the air was warm but couldnít tell if that was heat from the heater or just warmer outside air. Top radiator hose was warm and lower radiator hose was cold. Hose to expansion tank was hot too. There are three hoses off of the water pump.

I havenít been able to get to the auto parts store to get the test for combustion gasses in my coolant, baby has RSV so itís been a rough few weeks.

Does it matter it I have coolant or water in there, will the combustion gas test work just the same or do I need to drain the water and replace with coolant?
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Old March 21st, 2011, 11:39 PM
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clearly the seal on the old pump is bad. system should be able to hold 10psi. I lost the head gasket on my 109 and it took out the radiator too. For me pressure tests were inconclusive, the leak was only there when the engine was warmed up and working.

I don't think it matters what you have in the system as long as the gasses can come up through it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aosias View Post
Pressure tested the system this afternoon. I have a new thermostat installed, and a new water pump gasket but the original water pump. All hoses are tight and the system is filled with water for now- itís about 70 degrees and sunny here today.

Hereís what I did:

Test 1:
Connected the tester to the expansion tank and pumped it up to 10psi- slowly lost pressure and water poured out of the weep hole on the old pump.

Test 2:
Connected the tester to the expansion tank and didnít pressurize it. Started the truck (it was cold) and let it come up to temp. Never created any pressure on the gauge, temp gauge heated up to the middle but never overheated. Turned on heater and the air was warm but couldnít tell if that was heat from the heater or just warmer outside air. Top radiator hose was warm and lower radiator hose was cold. Hose to expansion tank was hot too. There are three hoses off of the water pump.

I havenít been able to get to the auto parts store to get the test for combustion gasses in my coolant, baby has RSV so itís been a rough few weeks.

Does it matter it I have coolant or water in there, will the combustion gas test work just the same or do I need to drain the water and replace with coolant?
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  #19  
Old March 22nd, 2011, 08:30 AM
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It is possible that the pump seal itself was damaged by being frozen and that your best bet is to swap it out with your new one then test for pressure and contaminates.
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  #20  
Old March 22nd, 2011, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevkon View Post
It is possible that the pump seal itself was damaged by being frozen and that your best bet is to swap it out with your new one then test for pressure and contaminates.
That's the plan. Went by Napa and the combustion test needs to seal in the radiator not sure how well it will work since I don't have a radiator cap on the actual radiator. Going to get a bigger socket today to get my old pump apart.
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