VDO Speedo Gurus, please chine in... - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old May 2nd, 2013, 11:01 PM
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Nick
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VDO Speedo Gurus, please chine in...

I have a 95 NAS D90 with the VSS box on the frame rail. In installing the speedo, I ran the wires per the VDO instructions for an inductive sensor (power to pin 4; ground to pin 3; and signal wires from VSS to pins 7 & 8).

The speedo works and I was able to calibrate it, but the needle jumps 10-15mph and is VERY ANNOYING.

QUESTION 1:
Does anyone know why the needle bounces this much?

Also, I am considering running the YBE10040 for a more accurate reading and am hoping this will cure the bouncing needle. However, I am not sure how to run the YBE10040.

QUESTION 2:
Does the YBE10040 plug directly into the TC bypassing the OEM VSS and plugging directly into the speedo at pins 7 and 8? Or do I connect the YBE10040 after the VSS box and then run the electrical wires from the YBE10040 to speedo on pin 7 & 8?

Sorry for the long post...
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  #2  
Old May 2nd, 2013, 11:36 PM
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John B.
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I would suggest, instead running power to one side of the sender and signal from the other. Pin 2 and pin 8 to the sender. This is the more correct setup for that sender.

Is the VSS disconnected from the EFI ECU?

The YBE mounts directly onto the t. case and the speedo cables are not used. You can run it either 2/8 or 7/8 if it is used by itself.
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  #3  
Old May 2nd, 2013, 11:59 PM
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John,

Can you clarify what you mean by "pin 2 and pin 8 to the sender"? What I think this means is that I should run the two wires from the VSS (green and yellow) to pin #2 and pin #8? Is that correct? Also, which wire would go to #2 and #8 (i.e., green to #2 and yellow to #8)?

The VSS is NOT disconnected from the EFI ECU. I spliced into the connector as opposed to bypassing the unit in hopes I would not have any trouble codes. Is this okay to do?

In terms of the YBE, it sounds like the VSS is completely bypassed. Is this accurate? Would I not get trouble codes if this is the case?
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  #4  
Old May 3rd, 2013, 06:35 AM
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Chris Murphy
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I've had similar results from the speedo install on my 94, and spoke with VDO by phone about it as well. They didn't mention using different pins on the back of the gauge other than the instructions that came with the gauge, so I'd also be interested in seeing if this works.

I do know, however, that removing the framerail VSS signal input to the EFI ECU will result in a trouble code and a check engine light every time you exceed about 50mph and kicks the car into a poorly running limp-home mode. When I first bought my car, the VSS wiring connector plug that hangs near the top of the transmission was disconnected, and this would happen to me.

I, too, understand that using the YBE method does bypass the ECI signal, so you'll have these issues.

The stock mechanical gauge used to bouce a tiny bit, too as the drive cable and transfer case speedo drive gear wound up a little and unwound, etc. I just figured this was a similar effect on the VDO, shown a little more extremely due to the VDO voltage-read being more sensitive. I even replaced the drive gear, short cable (t-box to VSS) and VSS while troubleshooting, and still had some version of bouncing needle, especially at slower and/or varying speeds. In truth, the biggest difference in variation seemed to follow how tight I made the knurled collars on the short cable to VSS and VSS to speedo sender.

Although also annoyed by it, I eventually got tired of screwing with it and put it on the back burner as my truck otherwise ran great.

None of this applied in my 97 (GEMS), as I just used leads from the original spedo and all worked perfect from day one.

Murph
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  #5  
Old May 3rd, 2013, 07:57 AM
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I plan to use a ybe to feed a vdo and the ecu. Any reason why this wouldn't work?
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  #6  
Old May 3rd, 2013, 09:54 AM
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John B.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzanc View Post
John,

The VSS is NOT disconnected from the EFI ECU. I spliced into the connector as opposed to bypassing the unit in hopes I would not have any trouble codes. Is this okay to do?

Ahh, that is completely different. The ECU supplys power to one side and takes a signal from the other. splicing into it with pins 7 and 8 on the VDO could do some weird things and I'm surprised that you did not damage something in the ECU wiring....

You need to determine which side is supplying 12V to the sender and leave that side alone. The other side is the signal side and that should have a parallel wire to pin 8 of the VDO. Nothing should go to pin 2 or 7.

If you install the YBE, it would be wired in exactly the same as the current sender.
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  #7  
Old May 3rd, 2013, 10:12 AM
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Diagram time!
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #8  
Old May 3rd, 2013, 10:32 AM
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The generic wiring diagram for the ECU is here: http://www.gomog.com/allmorgan/HotWireEfiWiring.jpg

Item 10 is the VSS. The right side shown as a white wire is switched 12V power. The left side shown as yellow is the speed signal to the ECU. The signal is a pulsed 12V signal as described in teh workshop manual. Tap into that wire and wire to pin 8 of the VDO speedometer. The YBE should be able to replace the VSS as it works the same, although the pulse rate will be different.
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  #9  
Old May 4th, 2013, 01:44 PM
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Ybe100540 is just a magnet on a spindle actuating a reed switch embedded in epoxy. The pulse rate will be exactly the same as a 95 VSS
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #10  
Old May 5th, 2013, 09:56 AM
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Sorry for the ensuing hijack, but my question managed to be a thread killer on I think two different threads... looks like this one might be promising tho:

Have the VDO wired in on a 97. Running 4.37 gears, so every time I go over 50 mph, I get the VSS speed sensor A fault code. Done a ton of research including contacting one person from an old thread that's since sold his truck who managed to fix the issue, but forgot how. Any help would be insanely appreciated!!

Next step is to pull the check engine bulb!
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  #11  
Old May 5th, 2013, 10:33 AM
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The 97 is a different beast being ODB II. I'm guessing you may tripping a too fast value or something. There are different drive you can put in the transfer case to change the gearing on the output.

Frc3310, frc3311, frc3312 and frc3313 are the part numbers.

You'd obviously have to recall rate the VDO afterwards.
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #12  
Old May 5th, 2013, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuclearmonkey View Post
Sorry for the ensuing hijack, but my question managed to be a thread killer on I think two different threads... looks like this one might be promising tho:

Have the VDO wired in on a 97. Running 4.37 gears, so every time I go over 50 mph, I get the VSS speed sensor A fault code. Done a ton of research including contacting one person from an old thread that's since sold his truck who managed to fix the issue, but forgot how. Any help would be insanely appreciated!!

Next step is to pull the check engine bulb!
Josh (crash303) had a similar issue... if I remember right he actually still has the stock speedo stashed away somewhere to feed the ECU, since the VSS signal goes to the speedo and then over to the ECU. He may have reached a more final fix than that, I don't know.
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  #13  
Old May 6th, 2013, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navydevildoc View Post
Josh (crash303) had a similar issue... if I remember right he actually still has the stock speedo stashed away somewhere to feed the ECU, since the VSS signal goes to the speedo and then over to the ECU. He may have reached a more final fix than that, I don't know.
I did read about someone doing that (I think in the same thread where the other guy figured how to fix it within the wiring configuration itself). I was trying to avoid that route, but if all else fails, I may go for it anyway...

Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
The 97 is a different beast being ODB II. I'm guessing you may tripping a too fast value or something. There are different drive you can put in the transfer case to change the gearing on the output.

Frc3310, frc3311, frc3312 and frc3313 are the part numbers.

You'd obviously have to recall rate the VDO afterwards.
Thanks for the part numbers... I'll try and look into this option further and see what I can come up with. Quick question - how complicated is it to change the gearing output on the t-case?
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  #14  
Old May 6th, 2013, 08:28 AM
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http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=14601

looks like you just pry out the retainer and pop in a new one ...
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #15  
Old May 6th, 2013, 05:47 PM
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Nick
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UPDATE:


John was correct. I was able to get the speedometer to work properly by connecting the signal wire from the VSS to the speedo at pin 8 while disconnecting the 12v lead from the VSS at pin 7, so to recap:

Pin 8 = VSS Signal
Pin 3 = ground
Pin 4 = 12v supply

I have yet to take it over 30, but if there is any problem, I will reply to the thread.
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Old May 6th, 2013, 06:09 PM
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What about feeding the ECU?
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #17  
Old May 6th, 2013, 07:21 PM
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I left the connection in tact and spliced into the signal wire coming out of the VSS and ran that to the VDO
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  #18  
Old May 6th, 2013, 09:12 PM
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That is great! Dd you pull the speedo cable? Let us know how it does
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Old May 6th, 2013, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzanc View Post
I left the connection in tact and spliced into the signal wire coming out of the VSS and ran that to the VDO
perfect thats my plan for this weekend
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #20  
Old May 6th, 2013, 10:58 PM
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Feel free to shoot me a pm with any questions

------ Follow up post added May 6th, 2013 10:01 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by don View Post
That is great! Dd you pull the speedo cable? Let us know how it does
The upper portion was disconnected and removed. The lower portion from the transfer box to the VSS was left connected and in place
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