Tune up and no start...umm - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old April 29th, 2011, 01:52 AM
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peter
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Tune up and no start...umm

So seriously not the first tune up I have ever done. But for whatever reason I can't get the 90 to start. What I tuned up:

Plugs (used the washers and LR's 15 ftlb torque, but gave it a bit more)
Wires
Cap
Rotor
Did a compression check while changing plugs (unplugged fuel pump fuse and all the wires from the coil)
Oil change
Installed the ss oil lines
Installed the 97 trans lines and cooler
Fuel filter
Trans filter
New o2 sensors

It looks like i have spark at the coil. I let it ground to the upper intake and a nice blue spark. Checked #2 and it had a nice blue spark. Pretty sure the wires are correct. Cylinder 1 is the drivers side front. Followed the picture in the Owners manual (6&5 next to each other lined up over the vacuum advance). I let the pump cycle a number of times before attempting to start. I did put the fuse back in lol.

So not sure whats going on. All the sensors are hooked up...anything that I'm missing?

Can the 2 single wires on the coil be messed up? I did try switching them and no difference. It seems like its only firing once out of the 8. It will turn over a bit and fire and repeat the seqence. It sounds like i have fhe plugs hooked up wrong, but from the book it looks correct.

Thanks for any suggestions,
Pete
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  #2  
Old April 29th, 2011, 07:15 AM
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Tony Sims
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First thing I would suspect is the wires not being in order. Try setting the engine to TDC on cylinder one, then make sure the rotor is on the # 1 wire, and double check the firing order from there.
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  #3  
Old April 29th, 2011, 09:10 AM
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Chris Snyder
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How did you replace the rotor?
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  #4  
Old April 29th, 2011, 10:38 AM
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peter
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That's an idea. All i should have to do is match up the crank mark and the timing arrow right?

To change the rotor i just pulled the old one off and put the new one on. It's got the slot in it,so i don't think its running backwards.
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Old April 29th, 2011, 10:42 AM
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Matthew
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Sometime if you pull too hard you can pull the shaft that drives the rotor from its seated position. Then it doesn't turn...


idunno
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  #6  
Old April 29th, 2011, 10:50 AM
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peter
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I don't recall it being hard to get off, but it was tight. When i pulled the #2 and grounded it the spark wasnt as fast as the coil spark, so it would seem to me that it is turning. I'll have some breakfast and go make sure everything is on number one and go from there.

Edit: sometimes these f-ing iPads type some crazy stuff...if you're not watching it looks like your typing is from a 7 year old.
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  #7  
Old April 29th, 2011, 11:52 AM
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Josh Harris
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Is it trying to start at all? I only say this because, I had a similar problem with a friends car when I helped him do a tune-up. It took us two days to figure out that he put the fuel filter backwards and it wasn't allowing fuel to pass by it at all.
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  #8  
Old April 29th, 2011, 12:01 PM
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Check the connections at the coil wire. They get bumped off.

Ron
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  #9  
Old April 29th, 2011, 12:11 PM
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Jake K.
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Check that the rotor doesn't have any up/down movement or very little. Next put the motor to TDC and see which wire the rotor points at. That should be #1 unless somehow you got it 180 degrees out....but it doesn't sound like it. Fuel,spark,and timing is what makes'm go. Do you have a timing gun? It will help.
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Old April 29th, 2011, 01:18 PM
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peter
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So i did the tdc and num 1 method. I assume the timing fin is the small metal tab directly above the balancer? If it is i put that at tdc, looked and set that as number one ( I was one off) and tried to start. It's trying to start more now, i can hear more firing but not right at all. I'll check the firing order again, but it seems right.

The rotor has a small amount of movement. I can measure when i get back. Have to help the boss move.

I had that thought on the fuel filter also. The arrow should be pointing to the engine right? I don't see why you would filter the return lol.

I do have a timing light, would you use that to find the number one, that what you're thinking?

Ron - can you have the two single wires backwards? Will that cause an issue or do they do the same thing?
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  #11  
Old April 29th, 2011, 01:32 PM
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Also check the trigger wire from the coil to the injectors. I've had mine come loose in the past while working under the hood and it just wont kick.

Coming through Elko this summer with the 5er so I'll keep my eyes open for you. I can't see too many 90's cruising the streets of Elko so you should be easy to spot. We're staying at some casino and RV park for the night.
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  #12  
Old April 29th, 2011, 05:04 PM
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Jake K.
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1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2 counter clockwise from #1. The Play up and down on the rotor should be little if any. Can't use the timing gun till you get it running. Is the cap seated correctly? Check the direction on the filter. Just check'n...is the coil wire going to the center-post on the cap?
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  #13  
Old April 29th, 2011, 06:25 PM
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peter
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Yep have the order right (well i have it going clockwise if you're looking down at the dist)
And the fuel filter was good.
Play was about 1/32
Cap is all good. It can trick you though!

Ok so found a pic of a coil on the forums and I had the single white wires upside down.
Turns out I did have 7 and 2 backwards after all, but the cute part is that most of the 90 deg plugs were not pushed in all the way. I guess I got gun shy when I was testing my connections and pulled the clip off the wire when i took it off. So pushing on the majority of the 90 deg connectors it fired right up.

So causing factors:
1. Having the wires all off sequence by one (looks a bit different in the owners manual)
2. Fixing the sequence after i did the TDC trick to find number 1
3. Fix the 7 and 2 being backwards
4. Fix the coil wires to the right spot
5. Push on the wires.....

I've actually rebuilt engines....and they worked just fine lol. Good old ford 2.9L. 351w. So i know whats going on. Guess i didn't pay enough attention while disassembling.

Andyrad - for sure man give a email or pm when you're coming and i can send you my cell. Lol and yep only 90 in town.

Thanks for all the help guys!!!!!! It was awesome being able to get it out and on the dirt again! Everyone really helped me dial it all in.

Pete
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