Terrafirma Castor Corrected Front Arms Test Drive....Disappointed! - Page 2 - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions

Join the Defender Source Community Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #21  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:25 AM
jefhuf's Avatar
jefhuf
Status: Offline
Jeff Huff
'94 D90 ST #655
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Haymarket, VA
Posts: 1,663
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoronos View Post
OK, so before you get too far with your verbal retribution, the very folks who are insulting me on my thread are also actually friendly people (I know some of them in real life and I have no doubt the folks who I don't know in real life are good people I am sure.)

I just recommend dropping the name-calling and to take the high road, which in this case is done by just selectively reading their posts and ignoring the name-calling - and most certainly not returning the favor.

The best way to deal with hurtful / negative comments is by not responding to them. If you feel the behavior persists and/or is targeted at you, just add those folks to your ignore list.
Good advice Kang...I would also add that folks' comments often lose the intended inflection when written in a forum. To those of us who know Dave (aka skinny pete & ren ching) understand his demeanor and wit which may or may not be lost on some folks.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #22  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:35 AM
CavemanDiesel's Avatar
CavemanDiesel
Status: Offline
Eric Smirh
1985 D90
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Vero Beach, Fl, USA
Posts: 685
Quote:
Originally Posted by 89Defender90 View Post
I've finally got the truck back on the road today. 2" Terrafirma lift coils, extended stocks, rose jointed rear arms, 3 degree castor corrected front arms, new steering shock, new ball joints, all new bushes, new bolts, u-joints, brake lines, new 285/75/16 KM2s, etc.

First road test, the truck goes straight down the road regardless of speed, but it does not return to center after a corner. I'm a little disappointed, considering most manufacturers say you can do a small lift without correcting castor. I guess I should have bought the 6 degree, but that seemed overkill at the time. I'm going to take it to an alignment shop to see what it is right now. I would hate to have to buy another set of front arms, I want it to drive well...although that's probably asking too much, considering what it is.

Here's what it's set at:

[*]KMs @ 32 psi[*]front and rear axles parallel to each other, thanks to the rear adjustable arms[*]1/16" toe out, specs say 3/64-3/32

The only two things I haven't done yet are rebuilding the PS pump. I bought a seal kit to fix the slow seep. And rebuilding the front swivel housings. One side will just move with gravity when disconnected and the other side is a little stiff to push. Both are out of adjustment. I have all the parts to rebuild the front end, but didn't figure they would affect the steering that much.

Any suggestions???

For those thinking of installing the Terrafirma Corrected front arms...here's what they don't tell you:

[*]The Terrafirma arms use the wider bushes on them, so after having them installed, the center collar on the bushing is 2 1/8" wide. The narrow bushing is 1 7/8"...so get out the grinder and take off 1/8" from each side, 1/4" total. They fit on the axle with a little more than 1/8" space on each side between the mount....what a PITA!!
Just my .02, I'm no expert, just a lover of Rovers, I had the same experience with steering issues, after replacing almost every part and adjusting preload on the swivels it now drives excellent. I have come to the conclusion that all steering parts work together. When one or more parts are weak and not doing there job it causes problems for the other parts. Yes, I threw my check book at the problem and now happy, thanks to all the forum members that helped.
Parts replaced
Steering box
Swivel balls
All seals and bearings
Pretension pins
All bushing
One hub
All break parts
Return to center steering damper
The truck is 25 years old . I told my self that these were safety items and had to be replaced, good luck,
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #23  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:43 AM
TDI Guy's Avatar
TDI Guy
Status: Offline
Randy
2015 LR4
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NJ
Posts: 4,536
Registry
FYI. I installed a 2" Rovertym set of springs a while back and it also caused the truck to not correct to center. The entire front end was rebuilt at the same time so everything was new. I had RYM make me a set of castor correcting arms for the 2" lift. In turn, the truck handled like stock again and self centered perfectly.
As a defender is lifted, the castor starts tilting forward causing a twitch and also causing it to not self center. Correct with the proper arms and you will be fine.

------ Follow up post added April 1st, 2015 08:44 AM ------

Also, after the arms were replaced, the truck went back to check alignment and it was spot on.
__________________
Legend in My Own Mind.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:28 AM
Arcadeus's Avatar
Arcadeus
Status: Offline
Mark Bichin
97 NAS Station Wagon LE
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,212
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by 89Defender90 View Post
Hey Mark, you're a scientist....which way is it??
Actually I'm not a geologist, physicist, or a meteorologist. (Look those up). Neuroscience is my gig.

You know if you ask a question and people answer you and you don't like their answer, it doesn't mean they are wrong. Why post if you didn't want to hear people's opinions?

Have fun.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old April 1st, 2015, 11:28 AM
89Defender90
Status: Offline
none
none
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: nowhere
Posts: 103
Back from the alignment shop.....just as I suspected, they confirmed that those guys are idiots. If not, he said that they charge a dozen or more people every day to set their cars up improperly and so do the thousands of alignment shops around the world. They're soliciting unwarranted information....making unsubstantiated claims.


Alignment shows 2 degrees camber...guess the arms did work as I thought by correcting the castor from -1 to +2 degrees. For those that didn't know...the factory castor is 3 degrees. I aired down the tires to 28 psi to get a better contact patch and the truck is now trying to self center after a turn, gets about half way. I'll correct the swivel pin preload in the next few days, I've already got a shim kit and adjust the PS pump.


Here's a clip at 50mph, no hands....tracks straight at any speed, doesn't wander, no death wabble, etc.


TDI and Caveman...we must believe what most of the masses think about this subject...


Mark, I'm a little disappointed, from a scientific standpoint, you know you have to have factual knowledge or basis to support what you say, otherwise it doesn't mean anything. References...there are millions out there that supports my way of thinking.....can you reference any to support yours? Maybe you should have your brain checked. I work in heart surgery, cardiovascular perfusionist, I'm going to diagnose your problem with lack of blood flow to the brain. Maybe you have carotid stenosis or low cardiac output. Lay down and turn your O2 tank on, maybe it will clear your foggy mind.




Ed, don't drink their kool-aid, you know what happens!!
Attached Files
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old April 1st, 2015, 11:48 AM
Arcadeus's Avatar
Arcadeus
Status: Offline
Mark Bichin
97 NAS Station Wagon LE
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,212
Registry
So with one degree difference in castor from stock you still had no self centering until you tried different means. Hmmm looks like you need a better control on your experiment. You should attempt those things with the original arms in there.

By the way did you say that you put wide arms into a narrow arm mount by shaving the bushings down?

And as far as O2 to my brain, I would worry about your own blood pressure first... There is a term for those that don't have enough cognitive flexibility to allow a shift in strategy once they have established one... Perseverance. Usually an effect of prefrontal cortex dysfunction. Come to think of it so is emotional regulation.



Seriously though good luck.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old April 1st, 2015, 11:54 AM
TDI Guy's Avatar
TDI Guy
Status: Offline
Randy
2015 LR4
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NJ
Posts: 4,536
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by 89Defender90 View Post
Back from the alignment shop.....just as I suspected, they confirmed that those guys are idiots. If not, he said that they charge a dozen or more people every day to set their cars up improperly and so do the thousands of alignment shops around the world. They're soliciting unwarranted information....making unsubstantiated claims. Alignment shows 2 degrees camber...guess the arms did work as I thought by correcting the castor from -1 to +2 degrees. For those that didn't know...the factory castor is 3 degrees. I aired down the tires to 28 psi to get a better contact patch and the truck is now trying to self center after a turn, gets about half way. I'll correct the swivel pin preload in the next few days, I've already got a shim kit and adjust the PS pump. Here's a clip at 50mph, no hands....tracks straight at any speed, doesn't wander, no death wabble, etc. TDI and Caveman...we must believe what most of the masses think about this subject... Mark, I'm a little disappointed, from a scientific standpoint, you know you have to have factual knowledge or basis to support what you say, otherwise it doesn't mean anything. References...there are millions out there that supports my way of thinking.....can you reference any to support yours? Maybe you should have your brain checked. I work in heart surgery, cardiovascular perfusionist, I'm going to diagnose your problem with lack of blood flow to the brain. Maybe you have carotid stenosis or low cardiac output. Lay down and turn your O2 tank on, maybe it will clear your foggy mind. Ed, don't drink their kool-aid, you know what happens!!
Great. Yeah I never doubt myself. Lol. I just hate when the wrong info is getting posted. It confuses the less mechanically knowledgable.
I had RYM build me a nice set to correct the problem.
On my truck I have a 3 link so I can dial in my truck perfectly no matter the lift. 👍
__________________
Legend in My Own Mind.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old April 1st, 2015, 11:55 AM
Ren Ching's Avatar
Ren Ching
Status: Offline
Skinny Pete
'84 90 "Yamelo"/'88 RRC "Chewbacca"
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Downtown
Posts: 4,571
Registry
You are newbie with no practical experience whatsoever and you come on here asking for advice. You're the one whose truck doesn't drive the way its supposed to, but the rest of us are the dumbasses. Nothing wrong with throwing your checkbook at a problem, if there actually is one. Or you can be like Ed and fix things that aren't broke and create a multiplicity of new problems. You've obviously got a pretty thin skin, must be because your neck is stretched out so far. I give it a year before the truck is for sale again.

------ Follow up post added April 1st, 2015 12:01 PM ------

Randy, we know you are perfectionist. Just out of curiosity, was your caster issue after the installation of the 3 link or before? Did Rovertym make you a set of arms for the 3 link? The Old Man Emu medium lift really only gives 1 1/2 or thereabouts, and that is the 2" that most people are probably referring to. If Rovertym 2" springs gave you an actual 2" that may explain why you noticed the change in handling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TDI Guy View Post
Great. Yeah I never doubt myself. Lol. I just hate when the wrong info is getting posted. It confuses the less mechanically knowledgable.
I had RYM build me a nice set to correct the problem.
On my truck I have a 3 link so I can dial in my truck perfectly no matter the lift. ��
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Present:
1960 SII 109"- "Red Square"
1984 90 Tdi- "Yamelo"
1988 RRC- "Chewbacca"
1987 RRC- "Chewy 2"
2008 RRS SC- "The Supersofa"

Past:
1959 SII 88"- "The Little Green Beastie" last seen in NY
1972 SIII 88"- "GreenHELL" now in NC
1988 90 "Eric the Half a Bee" half a truck, sold for parts
1991 RRC- never got a name- long since recycled
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old April 1st, 2015, 12:06 PM
don's Avatar
don
Status: Offline
Don Bunnell
'86 110 3dr ST
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Rumson, NJ
Posts: 4,075
Registry
I think like Caveman said - the steering seems to work best when all the components are in good shape.

I also think variables like the actual springs, frame geometry (I would guess no 2 frames are the same specs), arms, tires and other configurations can add up to make a big difference. And I think style of driving plays into it. I grew up learning to drive on trucks from the 60s and 70s so a Defender drives great when I got used to it.

I had a NAS 90 with OME 2" springs. I felt it drove fine with no caster correction and I drove that thing a lot and to many places. I put the same springs on the front of my '86 with a lot of worn out stuff and it drove well too. But a different vehicle might need the caster corrected - Soronos, TdiGuy and yours to name a few.

Charlie/89defender90 - I think it's pretty funny that you recently joined, post for help and then when guys (that have been around these vehicles for a long time) question what you've done you start calling them dumbasses. Nice looking 90 - good luck with it and glad you got the steering figured out.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old April 1st, 2015, 12:08 PM
Nomar's Avatar
Nomar
Status: Offline
Jeff B
RR HNTR,RR LWB Tdi
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Central,Virginia
Posts: 3,824
Registry
Skinny Pete, I think you've forgotten you're dealing with a cardiac perfusionist here! Take note!

.
__________________


Real Rovers have round headlights!
Rent my
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
!
Just a few miles from 4x4 access!
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:00 PM
89Defender90
Status: Offline
none
none
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: nowhere
Posts: 103
done
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:03 PM
psykokid
Status: Offline
Jake
1997 Disco
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 510
Quote:
Originally Posted by 89Defender90 View Post
Self centering issue is solved.
So what was the problem causing it to not self center? Inquiring minds want to know..
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:24 PM
89Defender90
Status: Offline
none
none
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: nowhere
Posts: 103
done
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:30 PM
Arcadeus's Avatar
Arcadeus
Status: Offline
Mark Bichin
97 NAS Station Wagon LE
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,212
Registry
Obviously. Even a lowly maniac percussionist managed it. Well actually I guess someone else did. Have anything to do with castor?
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old April 1st, 2015, 09:34 PM
Z.G's Avatar
Z.G
Status: Offline
Zack
300Tdi 95 D1
Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Burlington, VT
Posts: 4,414
Registry
Probably swivel preload.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:05 PM
89Defender90
Status: Offline
none
none
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: nowhere
Posts: 103
done
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:10 PM
Daddymow's Avatar
Daddymow
Status: Offline
Raub A.
1987 D110 Tithonus
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Stuart, FL / Boone, NC
Posts: 3,333
Registry
I have a 2" Terra Firma lift on mine. HD up front and MD in back with 33X12.5-15 BFG KM1 and a Detroit locker in the rear diff. I have driven the snot out of it on many road trips to events. Wheeled all weekend and then the 850+ miles back home. No steering problems whatsoever. Then I put the Tru Trac up front and all hell broke lose - scary all over the road. I have since had some very competent shops/people work on it and they have made it much, much better.


But the problem is still there and it is the TT in my front diff - one mod too many. However, I know guys that run that same set up (Detroit in the rear & TT up front) and have no issues at all. Why? Who the hell knows.


But what I do know is the very guys you are calling dumbasses will be the first ones to crawl under your truck late at night, on the trail, in the muddy water to get your truck back to camp fixed up and back on the trails the next day. Ask me how I know this. A bunch of dumbasses indeed.

------ Follow up post added April 1st, 2015 10:11 PM ------

P.S. add me to your ignore list please.
__________________
You can't polish a turd but you can roll it in glitter - eBay.uk ad for Freelander.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:15 PM
Arcadeus's Avatar
Arcadeus
Status: Offline
Mark Bichin
97 NAS Station Wagon LE
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,212
Registry
Wierd, tru tracs usually tend to self center by nature of the mechanism. I run them front and rear without a problem... I've read the combo you have is quite common.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:15 PM
89Defender90
Status: Offline
none
none
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: nowhere
Posts: 103
done
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old April 1st, 2015, 10:17 PM
Arcadeus's Avatar
Arcadeus
Status: Offline
Mark Bichin
97 NAS Station Wagon LE
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,212
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by 89Defender90 View Post
Rob, you're #8. Is there a limit on the ignore list? It would probably just be easier if I got to pick who wasn't on it.
Keep this up and you will be talking to yourself.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Castor corrected bushings vs. cranked radius arms RiftRover Defender Technical Discussions 17 April 17th, 2015 11:23 AM
castor corrected bushings for control arms Davis For Sale - Parts 5 April 21st, 2010 10:15 AM
Castor corrected radius arms ... Retrofit Defender Technical Discussions 4 October 20th, 2007 09:58 PM
Castor Corrected Radius Arms - who'se got 'em? Tawayama Defender Technical Discussions 19 August 29th, 2007 03:51 PM
QT Services Castor Corrected Arms FS SafariHP For Sale - Parts 3 August 22nd, 2007 10:25 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:23 PM.


Copyright