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  #1  
Old February 12th, 2011, 09:21 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Strange temporary loss of Power

97 D90 (GEMS). Has about 140k on her.

Running along perfectly happily at 75mph on the way home after a day on the trail. Running fine, no warning signs at all.

All of a sudden the engine drops power completely. Doesnít stall but the truck starts to slow. Gets down to about 1k revs then holds. Can get it up to about 1.2-1.3k revs and no more. Anymore and she splutters, pops and drops off. If you hold the throttle in the sweet spot at about 1.2-1.3k she runs along at about 30mph OK.

This goes on for about 20 miles. Never stopped or shut it off as I didnít want to risk it not starting again. Went through 2 or 3 intersections. Slowed to a stop, then pulled away. As long as I kept the throttle in the sweet spot or below, she pulled away (slowly) and gradually built back up to about 30mph again.

After about 20 miles or so she suddenly started to speed up and within another couple of minutes everything was back to normal. Revved fine, ran fine, no problems.

Drove the rest of the way home with no issue and running like a top.

Iím thinking it could be a temporary fuel blockage that cleared itself, a fuel pump on the way out, a faulty TPS or a faulty CKPS. No codes or CEL.

Any other ideas? I hate intermittent problems like this as I don't know if it was a warning of something about to fail, an issue that cleared itself like a blockage or an anomaly....

Ian
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  #2  
Old February 12th, 2011, 09:56 PM
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Daniel Chapman
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Fuel Pump.
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  #3  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:01 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dchapman View Post
Fuel Pump.
Your probably right if only because I haven't cut a hatch yet and I REALLY don't want to drop the tank.

I'll put a pressure gauge on it I guess and convince myself of the bad news....

Thanks

Ian
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  #4  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:01 PM
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Scott
1997 D90 ST #1444
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Any chance you have a loose wire to/from the starter?
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  #5  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:05 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woldd90 View Post
Any chance you have a loose wire to/from the starter?
Anythings possible and I plan to check the alt/batt anyway. I'll check the grounds and the starter feeds while I am at it.

What's strange is that it ran fine up to about 1.3k revs. No fluctuation in that number either. Then it just cleared itself and ran like normal.

Dan's probably right with the FP. I just don't 'want' it to be.
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  #6  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:23 PM
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Frank Rafka
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told ya...
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  #7  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:26 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Yeah and you know I am just trying to get out of dropping that bl**dy tank! How about you stop pratting about in Vegas and come do it for me?

------ Follow up post added February 12th, 2011 08:28 PM ------

Anybody know if a 96 D1 pump fits a 97 D90? I got a new one in the spares truck.
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Old February 12th, 2011, 10:28 PM
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Frank Rafka
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bring it to Mike's on Sautrday, hopefully gonna finish his fuel system on the 110 this week and get 'er runnin'
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  #9  
Old February 12th, 2011, 10:31 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Sounds like a plan on both fronts. If the 96 pump fits, thats already down there anyway. I put a new one in I think not long before the trans went. I know the 98 wont fit.

------ Follow up post added February 12th, 2011 09:22 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by ipgregory View Post
Anybody know if a 96 D1 pump fits a 97 D90? I got a new one in the spares truck.
Answered my own question after some research. No, they're not.

Typical. I have a 96, 97 and 98 all with the same engine and fuel system and all 3 have different (expensive) pumps. I hate LR sometimes....
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Old February 13th, 2011, 09:16 AM
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Jason England
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Did you check the air pipe from plenum to MAF sensor / air box ... if't loose it can cause exactly the symptoms you describe!
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  #11  
Old February 13th, 2011, 02:50 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
Did you check the air pipe from plenum to MAF sensor / air box ... if't loose it can cause exactly the symptoms you describe!
Yes I did and its tight.

Decided I am going to pull the pump and modify it so I can replace it with an aftermarket. Will cut an access hatch and carry a spare. Going to throw the TPS, CKPS and MAF off my spares truck on it as well and carry the old ones as trail spares. Will check the electrics and clean/tighten anything I find.

Then I have hopefully covered most of the likley suspects.

Thanks for the suggestions guys.

Ian
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  #12  
Old February 14th, 2011, 02:30 PM
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Daniel Chapman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ipgregory View Post

Typical. I have a 96, 97 and 98 all with the same engine and fuel system and all 3 have different (expensive) pumps. I hate LR sometimes....
The pumps are the same. However, the housing is different. Really, it's not even the housing thats different unless it's evap vs non-evap, but the length of those two aluminum rods is different. The Defender pump sits much shallower than a Discovery/RRC pump, probably 3 or 4 inches. So you could rob the pump from one of your Discovery spares and install it into the Defender housing.

The only difference between an evap and a non-evap pump (the actual pump, not the housing) is the connectors for the positive 12v lead and the ground. Non-evap uses spade connectors and evap has a small wiring harness. Either pump will work with spade connectors.
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  #13  
Old February 14th, 2011, 08:38 PM
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Ian Gregory
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Thanks Dan.

I am going to drop the tank this coming weekend and gather the bits I have (Spare 96 full set up with bad Pump and a nearly new working 96 Pump). Or I may say screw it and modify the 90 one for an aftermarket pump and be done with it. If I cut a hatch and do the mod then I can carry a spare pump and fix on the trail/side of road if I need to. Will throw a new filter and my spare set of sensors/MAF on there as well and then see if the problem reoccurs. In 9 years I think i've put 4 new pumps in my two D1s and I am fed up of paying the price for LR pump units. As it stands the 90 is worse as the pump price is just as bad AND you have the joy of dropping the tank to boot. Dont really want to start cutting holes in it but I have a spare access hatch set up from the 96 D1 so I can probably make it semi presentable at least.

Anyway thanks for the help. I know the differences between the 96 and 98 D1 pumps as I have both and as you say its mostly the electrical connectors but also the pipe unions. Push on on the 98 vs. nut and olive on the 96 if I remember right. Don't know on the 90 yet as this will be my 1st foray into a V8 one with an in-tank set up. I think they are nut/olive type though. My truck is pretty rust free but i will start hitting it with penetrating fluid this week and then drop the guts on the floor at the weekend and decide what to do from there. My local 'zone has the right Master pump in stock at least.

If I get time i'll throw a meter on the Battery/Alt/Starter/Grounds as well to make sure they are playing nice. Need the truck back reliable as its our local club Rally in a couple of weeks and I have TL & TG commitments.

Thanks

Ian
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  #14  
Old February 15th, 2011, 09:22 PM
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Could also be VSS.
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  #15  
Old February 16th, 2011, 02:33 AM
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Ian Gregory
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Hi Ron, thats a new one I hadn't thought about, thanks.

Being a 97 the truck has an electronic speedo not a cable. If the VSS was playing up, wouldn't I expect to see problems with the speedo? I know that at least was working fine as there is little else to do but stare at it and wish it would climb higher when stuck at 30mph on the highway for a while. I'll throw it onto the list of things to check over though.

Ian
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