Stainless nuts on a Aluminium bellhousing - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old March 4th, 2009, 01:21 PM
tomaco1's Avatar
tomaco1
Status: Online
T.mac
83 110
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Long Island, New York
Posts: 3,693
Registry
Stainless nuts on a Aluminium bellhousing

Any possible Negative affects of using stainless nuts and washers on a aluminium Bellhousing? I had a bunch laying around.
I remember hearing something about stainless on aluminium body panels, wondered if the issues would be the same.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old March 4th, 2009, 01:58 PM
Hans's Avatar
Hans
Status: Offline
Hans Haase
The D-90.com Lab Rat
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,381
Yes, definite issues there of whatever the electrochemical process is called. Use regular steel, and coat the living hell out of it with anti-seize.

Stainless nuts and bolts, as pointed out by some other forum members to me in the past, are also not as strong as regular steel in fastener applications. Stick to grade 5 or grade 8 regular steel on all important hardware.
__________________
My oil line fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
My 100k stopped odometer fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Brace for impact, I'm in a "modifying mood". Massive thread count inbound.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old March 4th, 2009, 01:59 PM
landrovered's Avatar
landrovered
Status: Offline
S. Smith
72 Series III 109 Diesel
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Under my truck!
Posts: 753
Galvanic action is the term
__________________
72 Series III 109 SW Diesel, 03 RR, 98 Porsche 986, 01 Porsche 986 3.6 L
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old March 4th, 2009, 02:03 PM
dave_lucas's Avatar
dave_lucas
Status: Offline
Dave Lucas
None
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CO USA
Posts: 3,126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans
Yes, definite issues there of whatever the electrochemical process is called. Use regular steel, and coat the living hell out of it with anti-seize.
I thought Stainless would have less reaction than standard steel?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old March 4th, 2009, 02:07 PM
landrovered's Avatar
landrovered
Status: Offline
S. Smith
72 Series III 109 Diesel
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Under my truck!
Posts: 753
Yes it still has galvanic effect but less than mild steel and aluminum. Check this out about half way down the page.

http://www.azom.com/details.asp?articleid=1177
__________________
72 Series III 109 SW Diesel, 03 RR, 98 Porsche 986, 01 Porsche 986 3.6 L
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old March 4th, 2009, 05:07 PM
Hans's Avatar
Hans
Status: Offline
Hans Haase
The D-90.com Lab Rat
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,381
Huh, I always though that stainless/aluminum combos were worse than steel/aluminum combinatiosn for the galvanic corrosion.

Either way though, stainless hardware does usually have much less tensile and sheer strength than grade 5 or grade 8 standard steel. As we're talking nuts, not bolts, either grade 5 or 8 should be fine in this application, with 8 being stronger. If you were talking bolts, I'd probably stick with grade 5 due to the better sheer strength than grade 8.

And since it's a New York truck now, anti-seize is your friend. Use it, use it, use it. Almost all the rain and humidity around here has some degree of salt in it, with the associated PH, and that's what causes all our corrosion issues around here. Driving on the beach is a death sentance for trucks, and road salt doesn't help either.

-Hans
__________________
My oil line fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
My 100k stopped odometer fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Brace for impact, I'm in a "modifying mood". Massive thread count inbound.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old March 4th, 2009, 05:21 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Your best friend:

http://www.wurthredlabel.com/product...cat=249&page=5

"I put that sh*t on everything" just like http://www.franksredhot.com/
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old March 7th, 2009, 01:36 AM
Rocketman's Avatar
Rocketman
Status: Offline
Scott Y
95 D90 SW, 2003 Disco II, 93 D110
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 163
According to the table at this site -- http://www.ssina.com/corrosion/galvanic.html. You would be better off not using stainless steel in contact with aluminum. Best to use zinc plated or cad plated steel.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old March 7th, 2009, 09:19 AM
pushngo
Status: Offline
Randy Williams
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Lancaster PA
Posts: 287
Yes Bricklan comes to mind
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old March 7th, 2009, 02:28 PM
ajh
Status: Offline
Andrew J. Hutton
1993 Defender 110 200TDI
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocketman
According to the table at this site -- http://www.ssina.com/corrosion/galvanic.html. You would be better off not using stainless steel in contact with aluminum. Best to use zinc plated or cad plated steel.
I've been contemplating just zinc plating the stainless myself when it comes time to re-assemble everything. It won't last on the exposed surfaces but those in contact with the other surfaces should last just fine.
__________________
--

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- Parts & Accessories Imported Weekly

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- Like us on Facebook for a discount on parts!

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
- Handmade Soap ideal for Mechanics!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old January 4th, 2010, 11:51 AM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
I think I am more confused now than before I started reading this thread.

I bought stainless screws to replace the galvanized bracket that sits at the bottom of the rear door entry (and holds down the rubber seal). The screws holding that bracket had corroded to the point where two of them wouldn't come out. I was going to paint the screws and the bracket black and use anti-seize just in case. Is this advisable?

Are the holes on the rear tub (that hold the rear entry bracket) threaded? Can I just drill out the broken screws?

Tips appreciated.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old January 4th, 2010, 12:08 PM
Viton's Avatar
Viton
Status: Offline
Deaf Ember
Smart 4x4
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: La
Posts: 1,231
Stainless against aluminum is a good idea but the problem here is that stainless bolts are considerably weaker than standard steel or grade 8. In this application, bolting the trany to the engine block, the stainless would break, probably even before you got the proper torque on them. This would leave you with a hell-of'a problem of getting them out of the block. Vibration and engine torque would inevitably cause them to fail at the worst time and place. Stick with standard bolts.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old January 4th, 2010, 12:20 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
I understand if its for attaching the transfer case to the engine it is absolutely essential but if its just to hold down a thin bracket on the bottom of the rear door entry you don't think I could get away with stainless?

Thanks!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis
Stainless against aluminum is a good idea but the problem here is that stainless bolts are considerably weaker than standard steel or grade 8. In this application, bolting the trany to the engine block, the stainless would break, probably even before you got the proper torque on them. This would leave you with a hell-of'a problem of getting them out of the block. Vibration and engine torque would inevitably cause them to fail at the worst time and place. Stick with standard bolts.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old January 4th, 2010, 12:36 PM
Viton's Avatar
Viton
Status: Offline
Deaf Ember
Smart 4x4
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: La
Posts: 1,231
As a fastener stainless is fine, but be sure to use an anti seize between a stainless bot & nut. The metal will gall up quickly and you'll end up having to overthighten & bust them to get them off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manimal
I understand if its for attaching the transfer case to the engine it is absolutely essential but if its just to hold down a thin bracket on the bottom of the rear door entry you don't think I could get away with stainless?

Thanks!
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old January 4th, 2010, 12:41 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
Gotcha.

What would you use to avoid galvanic corrosion altogether? Zinc plated screws?
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old January 4th, 2010, 01:14 PM
Captain Spalding's Avatar
Captain Spalding
Status: Offline
Captain Spalding
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manimal
Gotcha.

What would you use to avoid galvanic corrosion altogether? Zinc plated screws?
You'll never avoid it altogether. The purpose of the zinc coating is to sacrifice itself in lieu of the screw or the hole it goes into.

Folks get way too bent up about the stainless strength issue. Look at the fastener you're replacing. Is it graded? Yes? then replace it with the identical hardware, right down to the plating. No? Feel free to replace it with stainless if that floats your boat.

Stainless nuts and washers on plated steel bolts (as in the OP's situation)? No problem. Anti-seize not required.

Stainless on stainless - time for anti-seize.

Steel or stainless on aluminum - time for anti-seize.

High temperature application? Anti-seize.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old January 4th, 2010, 08:27 PM
Hans's Avatar
Hans
Status: Offline
Hans Haase
The D-90.com Lab Rat
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Spalding
You'll never avoid it altogether. The purpose of the zinc coating is to sacrifice itself in lieu of the screw or the hole it goes into.

Folks get way too bent up about the stainless strength issue. Look at the fastener you're replacing. Is it graded? Yes? then replace it with the identical hardware, right down to the plating. No? Feel free to replace it with stainless if that floats your boat.

Stainless nuts and washers on plated steel bolts (as in the OP's situation)? No problem. Anti-seize not required.

Stainless on stainless - time for anti-seize.

Steel or stainless on aluminum - time for anti-seize.

High temperature application? Anti-seize.
You forget....
if you live anywhere in the Northeast US, anti-seize everything. We get some pretty nasty corrosion issues around here.

-Hans
__________________
My oil line fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
My 100k stopped odometer fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Brace for impact, I'm in a "modifying mood". Massive thread count inbound.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old January 4th, 2010, 09:41 PM
Captain Spalding's Avatar
Captain Spalding
Status: Offline
Captain Spalding
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hans
You forget....
if you live anywhere in the Northeast US, anti-seize everything. We get some pretty nasty corrosion issues around here.
Good point. I'm a SoCal boy.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old January 10th, 2010, 11:48 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
Ok, so in this thread I have learned how to prevent galvanic corrosion on screws.

How do I deal with the screws that have corroded shut and won't come out? When I removed the rear door bottom trim 4 out of the 7 screws where completely corroded shut and broke off (see picture). How do I get them out? Are these holes threaded? I tried drilling one out but the hole is small and the bit broke because it was too thin? Is there something I can spray on them? I would like to get these out so that I can re-attach the trim piece and the bottom rubber rear door seal again but I am stumped. Suggestions appreciated.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2180.jpg
Views:	88
Size:	39.3 KB
ID:	24269   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2181.jpg
Views:	79
Size:	29.1 KB
ID:	24270  

Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old January 11th, 2010, 12:09 AM
dave_lucas's Avatar
dave_lucas
Status: Offline
Dave Lucas
None
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CO USA
Posts: 3,126
PB Blaster

I have had good luck with vice grips, if that does not work there are other options

cut a slot in the screw and use a flathead screw driver

Drill the srew out
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bling Master J's Stainless Steel Bolt Kits - Group Buy JimC Misc. Chit-Chat 67 April 11th, 2012 12:47 AM
Stainless Window Studs and Speed Nuts Wolf Fabrication For Sale - Parts 7 December 8th, 2011 11:14 AM
Feed back for stainless steel wheel nuts JFD The Flea Market 1 November 21st, 2008 10:37 PM
Interior Stainless Kits JimC Misc. Chit-Chat 32 December 11th, 2007 11:57 PM
Stainless Oil cooler lines??? Neo Defender Technical Discussions 3 February 3rd, 2004 08:04 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:14 PM.


Copyright