should I rebuild TD5 in Kenya for $9500 - Page 2 - Defender Source
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  #21  
Old April 10th, 2016, 03:09 PM
dlbriller
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Doug
1987 ex-MOD 'Tithonus' Defender 110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by portis View Post
. Iíll take the truck to another mechanic tomorrow for a second opinion.. I just have to find out whoís good here.
I've had good experiences with Bush Rover in Karen, ask for Salim
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  #22  
Old April 10th, 2016, 04:16 PM
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James Wallace
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While there are a lot of good mechanics in Nairobi, I tended to take my stuff for major work to Uganda. They are just a bit more talented and there are a lot more dead vehicles, especially ones from the Congo and Rwanda rotting there in Kampala. It is not like this is a very uncommon engine there. Most of the government vehicles in Uganda where TD5 powered Land Rovers of various models.

Things always where overpriced in Kenya. They have lower expectations in Uganda. Naturally a Mzungu will always pay more for anything. You can always have your driver take it there to get the work done. I always sent my aircraft out of the country to Botswana for overhaul or engine swaps, it was $90K cheaper, per engine, to do it there. Most of that savings was for customs bonds you never seemed to get back, along with personal favors to actually get the container out of customs before you reached the end of your life expectancy.
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  #23  
Old April 10th, 2016, 07:23 PM
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John
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlbriller View Post
I've had good experiences with Bush Rover in Karen, ask for Salim
I have had absolutely terrible, terrible service from the same shop. I personally would never trust that guy again with my truck. I am still living with shite workmanship they did years later.
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  #24  
Old April 11th, 2016, 12:03 PM
portis
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Tyler Hicks
2001 Defender 90 TD5
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I didn't get a chance to access my Defender today because it's an hour drive away. But I asked the mechanic for a detailed list of what's included in the rebuild. Here's what I received. This is what would be done for the $9500:

ITEMS

VALVE SEALS
INLET VALVES
EXHAUST VALVES
TIMING COVER OIL SEAL
EXHAUST MANIFOLD GASKET
INLET MANIFOLD GASKET
VALVE COVER GASKET
SUMP GASKET
CYLINDER HEAD GASKET
REAR CRANKSHAFT OIL SEAL
FLY WHEEL ASSEMBLY
PILOT BUSH
CLUTCH KIT
SET MAIN BEARINGS STD
SET CON BEARINGS STD
THRUST WASHERS
SET PINION & RINGS
WATER PUMP ASSEMBLY
OIL PUMP GEAR SET
VALVE GUIDES
CLUTCH RELEASE BEARINGS
HEATER PLUGS
INJECTOR NOZZLES (SERVICE)
INJECTOR NOZZLES COPPER WASHERS
TURBO TIMER

ENGINEERING:

POLISH, CRANKSHAFT, FIT VALVE GUIDES, FIT CAM BUSHES, LINE BORE & FIT MAIN BEARINGS, CUT VALVE SEALS
COMPLETE OVERHAUL GASKET
HOSE CLIPS
AIR FILTER
OIL FILTER
LTRS DIESEL ENGINE OIL
LTRS RADIATOR COOLANT
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  #25  
Old April 11th, 2016, 03:47 PM
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Omar Alomar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by portis View Post
Iím an American photographer based in Nairobi, Kenya. For the past 5 years Iíve been driving a 2001 Defender 90 Td5 diesel with manual transmission. Iíve had relatively few problems since purchasing the truck when it had 50k kilometers on the engine. It now has 178,000 km (about 110,000 miles).

When I cold start the truck in the morning it takes at least 6 attempts to turn over. When it finally starts it emits a huge amount of white/gray smoke from the exhaust. The smoke fills my whole driveway. Subsequent starts throughout the day tend to be okay but the engine has very little power now. Hills are getting harder to climb and it feels like the turbo never really kicks in.

Thereís a longtime Land Rover mechanic here told me my engine is dying and that it needs a complete rebuild or replace the TD5 with a used one. He said that the smoke is one indicator and also when the oil cap is loosened with engine running it shouldnít dance around. The bounding of the oil cap means that air is being forced into the engine. My cap looks like its going to fly away.

The full engine rebuild will cost $9500 usd parts and labor. He said that Iíd basically have a new engine after the 2-week job is done.

Option 2 would be to swap in a TD5 from a 2002 Land Rover Discovery. The engine (now in Kenya) has 46,000 km on it. Iím told it came out of a Discovery with automatic transmission. The engine was recently imported from the UK so hasn't been subjected to Kenyan diesel fuel. I don't know the history of the engine or how it was used. For all I know it was thrashed but who knows. The cost for that engine installed would be $6500 usd and the mechanic keeps the TD5 he pulls from my truck.

Keeping in mind the still import duty for parts from the UK does $9500 sound about right for an engine rebuild? Would you suggest that or should I go with second hand TD5 from the 2002 discovery? If I do the rebuild would I really be likely to get another 170k km out of it?
I had the exact same problem with my 2000 TD5, it was the air bleed valve, after changing it, my truck ran like a dream again.
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  #26  
Old April 11th, 2016, 03:57 PM
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John
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Omero View Post
I had the exact same problem with my 2000 TD5, it was the air bleed valve, after changing it, my truck ran like a dream again.
Had the same issue/symptoms with a tdi jetta (hard to start, tons of smoke for a few min), had air getting into fuel line (same cause), certainly doesnt need a rebuild if this is the only problem.
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  #27  
Old April 11th, 2016, 04:48 PM
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Chris
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Wish you had a better mechanic there....
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  #28  
Old April 11th, 2016, 04:57 PM
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thomas
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I said it earlier in the thread.

The timing need to be checked, I am willing to bet that it is off a few degrees. If the injectors are off the slightest amount you will have the EXACT symptoms you are talking about.


read here: Cam Timing on TD5 - Land Rover Forum in Africa


Have your mechanic verify the cam is in time with the crank. Also at that time ensure that the Rocker is plunging the injectors at the correct time.

This job takes about an hour or 2 beers.
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  #29  
Old May 10th, 2016, 05:31 PM
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atakan
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atakan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by portis View Post
Iím an American photographer based in Nairobi, Kenya. For the past 5 years Iíve been driving a 2001 Defender 90 Td5 diesel with manual transmission. Iíve had relatively few problems since purchasing the truck when it had 50k kilometers on the engine. It now has 178,000 km (about 110,000 miles).

When I cold start the truck in the morning it takes at least 6 attempts to turn over. When it finally starts it emits a huge amount of white/gray smoke from the exhaust. The smoke fills my whole driveway. Subsequent starts throughout the day tend to be okay but the engine has very little power now. Hills are getting harder to climb and it feels like the turbo never really kicks in.

Thereís a longtime Land Rover mechanic here told me my engine is dying and that it needs a complete rebuild or replace the TD5 with a used one. He said that the smoke is one indicator and also when the oil cap is loosened with engine running it shouldnít dance around. The bounding of the oil cap means that air is being forced into the engine. My cap looks like its going to fly away.

The full engine rebuild will cost $9500 usd parts and labor. He said that Iíd basically have a new engine after the 2-week job is done.

Option 2 would be to swap in a TD5 from a 2002 Land Rover Discovery. The engine (now in Kenya) has 46,000 km on it. Iím told it came out of a Discovery with automatic transmission. The engine was recently imported from the UK so hasn't been subjected to Kenyan diesel fuel. I don't know the history of the engine or how it was used. For all I know it was thrashed but who knows. The cost for that engine installed would be $6500 usd and the mechanic keeps the TD5 he pulls from my truck.

Keeping in mind the still import duty for parts from the UK does $9500 sound about right for an engine rebuild? Would you suggest that or should I go with second hand TD5 from the 2002 discovery? If I do the rebuild would I really be likely to get another 170k km out of it?
hi there!
writing from Kenya too, running a 2001 td5 90, blue as well (you know they are rare here!). not much of a mechanic but 9500$ for a Td5 rebuild sounds steep steep? second opinion?
my truck is at 178,000km and used as a daily driver, issues i recently had was oil in the loom causing a nasty misfire and all that comes with it. i had a slight loss in power at about 140,000km but blanking the EGR seemed to fix this?
i'll pm you my contacts if you ever need to exchange notes!

atakan
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  #30  
Old May 13th, 2016, 03:36 AM
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Thiemo
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Thiemo Ebersberger
1989 4 door pick up 110
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Hi Portis
I live in Nairobi and running a small Safari business we own about 12 Defenders. I say about 12 because there are always some of them in bits in our work shop.
My advice in short. Sell the Td5 engine and get yourself a rebuilt or UK 300 Tdi.
The gear box is the same so it is a straight bolt on job except you need to weld new engine mounts on the chassis.
Td5 engines have lots of problems espacially in Kenya. It will be a constant money pit. Besides as for as i am aware the complxity of the Td5 goes well beyond most mechanics here.
By the sounds of it your problem is with the injectors.
White smoke is unburned diesel fuel.
It is a commen rail five cylinder engine. The injectors are electronically operated by a computer(ECU) which relies on lots of sensors. Some of them well hidden. I.e. in the bell housing, air intake and the engine temp sensor has a say in how the enjectors operate.
So it could just be a sensor fault. You mentioned someone having already replaced one nozzle? Why on earth would you do only one out of five?
The problem might be a wrong repair.
Part prices for the Td5 are astronomic in Kenya. One injector is about 600$ and you need five of them. Also the problem could be in the wiring loom which runs stupidly through the block.
Then you replace all kind of sensors and you are left with a bill of thousands of Dollars.
And really you still have the same old engine.
The previous 300 Tdi hasnt got any of this useless cr... It seriously could run an cooking oil.
A lot of petrol stations up country mix their diesel illigally with cheaper kerosine. The Td5 goes nuts and dies the 300 does not care. It will make a bit of a knocking sound to tell you but thets about it.
So get a good 300 Tdi and you wont have any trouble.
I am just replacing the piston rings on a 300 after 400.000 Miles. First set of rings, first time the engine has been opened.
Cheers T
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  #31  
Old May 14th, 2016, 08:06 PM
DailyDrivenDefende
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Michael
1989 110, 1985 90 200TDI
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Washington State
Posts: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by portis View Post
I didn't get a chance to access my Defender today because it's an hour drive away. But I asked the mechanic for a detailed list of what's included in the rebuild. Here's what I received. This is what would be done for the $9500:

ITEMS

VALVE SEALS
INLET VALVES
EXHAUST VALVES
TIMING COVER OIL SEAL
EXHAUST MANIFOLD GASKET
INLET MANIFOLD GASKET
VALVE COVER GASKET
SUMP GASKET
CYLINDER HEAD GASKET
REAR CRANKSHAFT OIL SEAL
FLY WHEEL ASSEMBLY
PILOT BUSH
CLUTCH KIT
SET MAIN BEARINGS STD
SET CON BEARINGS STD
THRUST WASHERS
SET PINION & RINGS
WATER PUMP ASSEMBLY
OIL PUMP GEAR SET
VALVE GUIDES
CLUTCH RELEASE BEARINGS
HEATER PLUGS
INJECTOR NOZZLES (SERVICE)
INJECTOR NOZZLES COPPER WASHERS
TURBO TIMER

ENGINEERING:

POLISH, CRANKSHAFT, FIT VALVE GUIDES, FIT CAM BUSHES, LINE BORE & FIT MAIN BEARINGS, CUT VALVE SEALS
COMPLETE OVERHAUL GASKET
HOSE CLIPS
AIR FILTER
OIL FILTER
LTRS DIESEL ENGINE OIL
LTRS RADIATOR COOLANT
I am doing all of the above for my 200tdi build plus milling the top deck and $9500 feels high. What is the labor rate there?

If you are going this far, check for the flatness of the head and the topdeck of the engine.

I am buying/importing a block, buying rebuilt head, uprated VNT, overhauling the entire engine. I think I am in about 7 grand.
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