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  #21  
Old February 18th, 2016, 01:46 AM
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  #22  
Old February 18th, 2016, 12:40 PM
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Ok, I found the manual for tuning the carb. Started by setting the timing to 0degrees at idle. (No tach to set it under load). Made sure that the choke was functioning. Set idle speed to 6-700 RPMs (estimate) and started to adjust the mixture screw. No change. I'm beginning to think that this is a carb issue. Like I need a new carb issue lol.

Also noticed something that seems weird. So I pulled off the top elbow to look down the barrels. One of the barrels looks completely unused. It I press the throttle, no fuel squirts in there. The butterfly is closed and the barrels looks clean and brand new. Playing around with levers, there was no way that I could get the butterfly to open at all. Someone please educate me if this is normal or not!


I spoke with some guys at my work who built hot rods. Their thoughts were that if the mixture set screw was not changing the RPM, that the jets are stuck open and causing the rich running mixture. Either a rebuild or replacement is required. Do all of you concur?


*as for the butterflys not opening, the weber manual says that the secondary opens around 70% throttle *
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  #23  
Old February 18th, 2016, 12:48 PM
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if you have a 2bbl carb and only running on one I think you have already answered your own question. I like Weber carbs and a 32/36 seems like a good choice but finding one already properly jetted for your 2.5 might be a trick.

Series Land Rover FAQ - Weber dgv conversion
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  #24  
Old February 18th, 2016, 12:53 PM
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I doubt you will find anybody on here with specific experience on that carb. 2.5 petrols are not common. You either need to learn or find somebody in real life that can look at it for you. Some secondaries have mechanical linkage, some are vacuum actuated from air flow. should all be easy to rebuild. You just need a live person that knows what a carb looks like.
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  #25  
Old February 18th, 2016, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Douglas View Post
if you have a 2bbl carb and only running on one I think you have already answered your own question. I like Weber carbs and a 32/36 seems like a good choice but finding one already properly jetted for your 2.5 might be a trick.

Series Land Rover FAQ - Weber dgv conversion

I've been looking into swapping/upgrading carbs, even if it's just a quick fix for now. is there an adapter or conversion kit that you need? I'm looking around and like everyone says, knowledge on the 2.5 is pretty scarce
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  #26  
Old February 18th, 2016, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocB View Post
Ok, I found the manual for tuning the carb. Started by setting the timing to 0degrees at idle.
The timing spec for the 2.5 is 6 deg BTDC, NOT zero (TDC).
So out of the gate you're already retarded (6 deg).
If you're using a stroboscopic light, you have to unplug the vacuum advance.
If you had it connected when you set it, now you are even more retarded (about 18 to 20 deg).

Assuming you have the Weber 32/34 DMTL, the 2 screws are for air idle mixture at idle ONLY and idle speed.
To change the mixture requires disassembling the carb to replace the jets, so your mixture setting screw only effects idle and early progression, NOT overall mixture.
The clean side is most likely the secondary of your progressive 32/34.
There is an accelerator pump with a diaphragm that could be split and not pumping fuel.

The best stateside replacement for your 32/34 DMTL is the 34 DMTR from Pierce Manifolds in CA.
Make sure you have them install a viton tipped float needle and seat as the brass ones will overflow frequently.
This will get rid of all those fuel shutoff and other pollution control solenoids that eventually fail and render the 32/34 DMTL useless.
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  #27  
Old February 18th, 2016, 01:33 PM
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I feel like you just need to get a local series guy to look at it with you.
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  #28  
Old February 18th, 2016, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
The timing spec for the 2.5 is 6 deg BTDC, NOT zero (TDC).
So out of the gate you're already retarded (6 deg).
If you're using a stroboscopic light, you have to unplug the vacuum advance.
If you had it connected when you set it now you are even more retarded (about 18 to 20 deg).
it is zero static by the manual.

Quote:
Ignition timing dynamic @ 2000 rpm ........................16 degrees B.T.D.C. using 90 octane fuel with vacuum pipe disconnected.

Static, if no dynamic equipment available .................. T.D.C. with vacuum pipe disconnected.

Centrifugal advance range ..................................... 0 - 1 deg at 500 Distributor rpm and 18 - 20 deg at 2250 Distributor rpm.
So that means...
0 rpm - 0 degrees BTDC
1000 rpm - 0 to 2 degrees
2000 rpm - 16 degrees
4500 rpm - 36 to 40 degrees

If you rev it up with the timing light, you should see the timing advance and then max out around 40 degrees. You had a picture of your advance weights in the other thread. The number on there is the max advance in distributor degrees (half engine speed).
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  #29  
Old February 18th, 2016, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
it is zero static by the manual.



So that means...
0 rpm - 0 degrees BTDC
1000 rpm - 0 to 2 degrees
2000 rpm - 16 degrees
4500 rpm - 36 to 40 degrees

If you rev it up with the timing light, you should see the timing advance and then max out around 40 degrees. You had a picture of your advance weights in the other thread. The number on there is the max advance in distributor degrees (half engine speed).

I'm confused how you could possibly measure that? The timing marks only measure -6 through +6.

5 marks being...

-4
-2
-0
+2
+4

I've always been under the impression that it's 0 degrees at idle with vacuum disconnected, and timing it last night, that seems to be where she feels at home.
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  #30  
Old February 18th, 2016, 02:18 PM
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You can measure and mark some rough angles on the crank and make sure the advance is working correctly.

It will probably run better with a bit more static advance than the manual states.
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  #31  
Old February 18th, 2016, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
You can measure and mark some rough angles on the crank and make sure the advance is working correctly.

It will probably run better with a bit more static advance than the manual states.
By static to you mean at idle? Right now I have it set for a SMIDGE advanced from 0degrees. Almost an unreadable amount. It was hard to get it dead on, and when I got it to where it was everything seemed right so I left it lol. I also don't have a tach so there's no way to tell what it would be under load.

I'm pretty sure this is all a carb issue at this point. Especially now that I know the mixture screw literately doesn't do anything. I would think fuel blockage if it wasn't running rich. I'm guessing that the jets are blocked open or something and it's just pissing gas
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  #32  
Old February 19th, 2016, 11:21 AM
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The 32/34 commonly has a brass needle and seat, notorious for overflowing fuel into the top area of the float that gets sucked into the inlet manifold.
The only way to relieve this is to replace the needle and seat with an upgraded one that has a viton tip.

We have the same issue with the GM 2.5 and 3.0 liter engine conversion we build for the series vehicles.
The late 2.25s and 2.5 land Rover engines I work on that come over from UK, almost always have the timing advanced to the point of pre-detonation (pinging) which is about 15 - 20 Deg BTDC.
This is no doubt an effort to gain more power.
The gross advancement may be also effected by a factory service bulletin that advised the timing to be set at 6 Deg BTDC on both the later 2.25 and 2.5 Land Rover petrol engines.

That was John's post regarding static timing, who is quite knowledgeable and may be able to advise better than I, but will give a try.
In the old days, static timing referred to positioning the engine at the designated timing outcome with the cap off and the ignition switched off.
So if the designated outcome was 6 deg BTDC or TDC, you position the engine at that mark with the rotor pointing at number 1 cap lead.
The hand crank can be used or put it in 4th or 5th gear with the brake off and push the vehicle backwards to the right position, then in neutral once positioned properly.

Then you loosen the distributor clamp and place a 12V light bulb between the distributor low tension lead from the coil and the coil itself.
Next you rotate the distributor so the points close on the same side of the distributor cam as the arrow on the rotor (check the gap first and make sure they are not pitted).
Then switch on the key and the light will glow.
Rotate the distributor until the light initially goes out.
Tighten the distributor, switch off the key, remove the 12V light bulb, replace the cap and low tension lead from the coil and the engine is ready to run.
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  #33  
Old February 19th, 2016, 11:23 AM
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Here's an update for those of you who are interested.


Beer can gasket holding at about 90% lol. There's a small exhaust leak, but manageable until the correct part comes in. Checked with a few auto part, hardware, and exhaust shops and no one could source a copper crush gasket for some reason. When you say Defender everyone get's scared and doesn't want to touch it lol.


For the tuning, I found a Weber 32/34 manual and used it to adjust all the settings and pull the jets. once they were out (the primary wasn't even screwed in all the way, just rattling around) I pulled the jets apart and soaked them in carb cleaner for about an hour. cleaned everything off, put it back together, and started her up.


Literally the first time she's ever had a smooth idle. The mixture adjustment screw still doesn't do much of anything at all so I set the idle and timing (about +1-2deg at idle). Easiest drive to work so far, effortlessly cruising at 65-70 on the freeway.


Now I just need bigger tires than my 205/75/16s. I'm thinking of getting 255/85/16s, that should lower the cruising RPM at 65mph to around 3200, instead of the current 4000+
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  #34  
Old February 19th, 2016, 01:26 PM
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Great news David.
Don't rule out 235/85/16.
Try advancing to 6 deg BTDC if you want slightly more power.
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"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #35  
Old February 19th, 2016, 01:41 PM
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I would suggest getting a carb rebuild kit, getting it apart and cleaned, floats checked and set and at the same time verify nobody has changed jets. The jet sizes are shown in the workshop manual. The carb rebuild and adjustment is also completely shown in the workshop manual.

I would also suggest upgrading to an HE electronic distributor one day to get rid of any ignition worries.
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  #36  
Old February 19th, 2016, 01:44 PM
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David,

if you pm me some dimensions for your gasket, I can cut a copper gasket for you. I need thickness as well.

Ed
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  #37  
Old February 19th, 2016, 01:45 PM
DocB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
Great news David.
Don't rule out 235/85/16.
Try advancing to 6 deg BTDC if you want slightly more power.
I originally was going to go with the 235/85/16 cooper s/t tires, but with my 1.6:1 gears, I'm thinking that bigger will be better

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2016 10:47 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
I would suggest getting a carb rebuild kit, getting it apart and cleaned, floats checked and set and at the same time verify nobody has changed jets. The jet sizes are shown in the workshop manual. The carb rebuild and adjustment is also completely shown in the workshop manual.

I would also suggest upgrading to an HE electronic distributor one day to get rid of any ignition worries.

Only one person will touch it here, and he quoted me a minimum of $380 if I provided him a repair manual and a complete rebuild kit. Then another $150 for a tune.

If it comes down to it, I'll just slap on a new one. I'd like to upgrade, but I cant find much on carb choices or fitting instructions

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2016 10:48 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoronos View Post
David,

if you pm me some dimensions for your gasket, I can cut a copper gasket for you. I need thickness as well.

Ed
I've already got one on the way from the UK, but thanks anyways!
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  #38  
Old February 19th, 2016, 02:00 PM
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This guy is pretty good. Reasonable too. You can source the rebuild kit or he will.


frank@wyocarb.com


www.wyocarb.com
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  #39  
Old February 19th, 2016, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 61rover View Post
This guy is pretty good. Reasonable too. You can source the rebuild kit or he will.


frank@wyocarb.com


www.wyocarb.com
Thanks for the info. That would be nice, but it's my daily driver so I cant afford to have the carb off for more then a weekend
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  #40  
Old February 19th, 2016, 02:23 PM
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Find a used one. Send it out for rebuild. Swap. Sell your old one.
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