R380 : how much 2nd gear crunch can be expected? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old August 24th, 2012, 01:30 PM
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R380 : how much 2nd gear crunch can be expected?

Someone telling me they all do that after 80-100k miles. Is this Accurate? Or jsut glossing over a 1500 dollar repair?
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  #2  
Old August 24th, 2012, 01:39 PM
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I just rolled 124K and have to say 2nd is the crunchy gear, but only sometimes. I am no expert, so take my opinion with half a grain of salt.
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Old August 24th, 2012, 02:11 PM
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215 on my disco and 3rd is the most crunchy. 2nd isn't too bad
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Old August 24th, 2012, 02:30 PM
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2nd gear being the most commonly used synchro is usually the first to go..anything more than a 2-3 second change is considered in need of replacement..I.e..2-3 seconds from 2nd to 3rd..
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Old August 24th, 2012, 02:48 PM
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if you adapt your gear change and don't crunch it it won't get any worse ... you don't have synchro on reverse and you're not worried about that are you?

keep the redline in there ... makes a huge improvement ... let the revs drop between first and second or blip the throttle when in neutral and it will probably last forever.
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Old August 24th, 2012, 03:07 PM
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When I first started driving my 90 I was crunching 2nd gear about 60% of the time. After some time with the vehicle and getting to understand the rhythm of the tranny, it's rare to crunch. Get in synch with the synchro and all will be good.
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Old August 24th, 2012, 03:25 PM
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after helping change a gearbox on my friends truck i'd learn to live with it ...
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  #8  
Old August 24th, 2012, 05:05 PM
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r380 has synchro reverse.

Yes, use the redline. Sometimes I push the lever over to the other side of the H before going up into second. It doesn't really do anything but it provides the necessary pause. Switching to the Redline MTL made the biggest difference though and mostly I do not need to do that anymore.

Be sympathetic to the limitations of the machine and learn to live with the pace it is happiest at, and it will last lot longer than if you treat it like you expect it to be something it is not.

Gearbox changes are doable for the home mechanic but are time consuming and expensive. Therefore most people live with minor gearbox faults and idio-synchro-sies if the unit otherwise has alot of life left in it.





Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
if you adapt your gear change and don't crunch it it won't get any worse ... you don't have synchro on reverse and you're not worried about that are you?

keep the redline in there ... makes a huge improvement ... let the revs drop between first and second or blip the throttle when in neutral and it will probably last forever.
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Old August 24th, 2012, 08:58 PM
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3rd gear can be notch if I am dogging it, otherwise month when it warms up. I attribute it to driving it like a truck and running MTL for the past 50k.
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  #10  
Old August 24th, 2012, 11:19 PM
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3rd crunches for me on occasion.

Higer revs and a longer pause between gears minimizes it...
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  #11  
Old August 25th, 2012, 04:32 AM
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LT77 went out so that was a crunchy 2nd. I finally just got sick of the crunch and it was getting worse. Had no problem with the used R380 I stuck in it until a little piece of casting that holds the 5th and reverse fork in place (I am totally screwing this description up) broke off - it is a plate with 2 bolts and a casting that looks like an upside down U. Anyone else ever had that piece break?
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Old August 31st, 2012, 02:33 AM
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Don't know if you can get Castrol Syntrans 75W-85 over there, but in my experience and most in Oz that have run MTL and Syntrans it improves the shift quality over Redline MTL or the MTL/MT90 blend I ended up with.

Having said that, R380's can be idiosyncratic and the odd 'box still shifts better with something like Valvoline DuraGear 75W-85 or even ATF, so go figure.....

FWIW I run Motul Gear 300 these days anyway.
Much better at high ambients/high loads than MTL or Syntrans and still shifts well at just under 0*C. (it has a huge VI of 222)
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  #13  
Old August 31st, 2012, 04:26 AM
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Hi Guys, I have a 110 pick-up that also has the 'crunchy' problem. What puzzles me is that it is an intermittent fault, mostly crunches, but sometimes not?
My issue is i live and work in an area that only has deep sand. A suggestion was made to live with it, or to work with it. Unfortunately by the time I've waited a couple of seconds between shifts,I've come to a stand still. It just seams wrong to let it continue to crunch like that. The motor and clutch have only done 6200km since it was redone.
Any suggestions for the confused newbie?
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  #14  
Old August 31st, 2012, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandy View Post
Hi Guys, I have a 110 pick-up that also has the 'crunchy' problem. What puzzles me is that it is an intermittent fault, mostly crunches, but sometimes not?
My issue is i live and work in an area that only has deep sand. A suggestion was made to live with it, or to work with it. Unfortunately by the time I've waited a couple of seconds between shifts,I've come to a stand still. It just seams wrong to let it continue to crunch like that. The motor and clutch have only done 6200km since it was redone.
Any suggestions for the confused newbie?

High range or only in low range ?

If you are only beating the synchro's in low range, the fluid used can make a difference.

I've tried these different fluids and variations thereof (MTF94, ATF (Castrol Transmax Z/NEO 7wt blend), Castrol Syntrans 75W-85, RL MTL (baulky on the upshift) RL MTL/MT90 3/2, Castrol VMX (bloody awful) Torco RTF, Motul Gear 300) and the Gear 300 is the only fluid that has stopped the crunch in all gears in low range and eliminated it high range.

Even Syntrans would occasionally beat 3rd in high range and I pretty much always beat second and third in low range.
Never had a problem with 2nd in high range, ever.

The gearbox has about 295,000km on it.
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  #15  
Old August 31st, 2012, 06:45 AM
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tdi-rick. Thanks for that. I will try to get an equivalent locally.
I got under her this morning to see if there my be any loose linkages or something and found the transfer case with a severe case of the runs, checked the level and she was on the low side. Could a badly leaking TC cause this?
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  #16  
Old August 31st, 2012, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandy View Post
tdi-rick. Thanks for that. I will try to get an equivalent locally.
I got under her this morning to see if there my be any loose linkages or something and found the transfer case with a severe case of the runs, checked the level and she was on the low side. Could a badly leaking TC cause this?
No.
They are separate compartments when running an LT230 t/case.

Just quickly, which 'box is in yours ?

The LT77 or the R380 ?

Can't remember what type of gear for the pump is used in the LT77.
If steel, any of those fluids I've listed are fine, if fibre, I wouldn't go heavier than MTL.
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  #17  
Old August 31st, 2012, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ren Ching View Post
r380 has synchro reverse.

Yes, use the redline. Sometimes I push the lever over to the other side of the H before going up into second. It doesn't really do anything but it provides the necessary pause. Switching to the Redline MTL made the biggest difference though and mostly I do not need to do that anymore.
Same with me, I used Amsoil's Manual Trans fluid and that difference alone made it much more tolerable.
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  #18  
Old August 31st, 2012, 02:21 PM
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Derrick Wardhaugh
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Thanks for the advice guys. I'll change the fluids for now.
I tried all combinations of gear shifts today to see if maybe my habitual change is wrong. What i found is that when i change from 1st to 2nd,(I have a RHD) i come out of 1st then far right and back left right 'against' the left. There seams to be a very slight notch, when pressed left, then directly into 2nd it crunches far less. This however has no effect when engine revs are on the high side.
Sand driving is much trickier than it looks.

------ Follow up post added August 31st, 2012 12:27 PM ------

tdi-rick. I'll check the box type tomorrow and post. I was lucky enough to get the 5 book repair manual with when i bought her. this will help i'm sure.
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  #19  
Old October 15th, 2013, 12:57 AM
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I've been having issues shifting from 1st to 2nd as well. If I don't wait two or three seconds or double clutch, I grind the gears 90% of the time. I'm running redline MTL also. I take it my only options are to live with it or shell out for some pricey repairs.
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  #20  
Old October 15th, 2013, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zooraya View Post
I've been having issues shifting from 1st to 2nd as well. If I don't wait two or three seconds or double clutch, I grind the gears 90% of the time. I'm running redline MTL also. I take it my only options are to live with it or shell out for some pricey repairs.
Double clutching is cheaper than replacing re gearbox with the added benefit of strengthening your left leg...
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