PLEASE HELP! Door top removal - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old April 10th, 2006, 08:18 PM
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Mike Lynch
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PLEASE HELP! Door top removal

I bought a stainless steel stud kit from Matt and went to go put them on. I removed all of the door top bolts (4) from the inside door panel and the door top won't come off. Is there more nuts or bolts to remove. I don't won't to push up too hard so I thought I might ask before getting to pissed off.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Mike
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  #2  
Old April 10th, 2006, 08:26 PM
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Jeff Sturgis
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Mike,

I just went through this with a set of the same stainless steel bolts from Matt. If you have removed the two threaded studs from each door, then there should be nothing else holding the door tops on but gravity.

Just for clarification, you have removed the nuts (10 mm. 1.5) and washers, and then the studs themelves. I cannot think of any reason that the top would not come right off unless it had some adhesive inbetween the rubber that does along the door top.
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  #3  
Old April 10th, 2006, 08:31 PM
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Take a flat screwdriver and carefully pry them. There should be a couple of notches on either end of the bottom of the windows.

Also, check this... http://www.gulfcoastrovers.com/rover...ions/index.htm
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  #4  
Old April 10th, 2006, 08:48 PM
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Jeff Sturgis
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Phil,

Thanks for posting that link. It explains all the details that I went through including the trick of taking the panel off and using a 15mm wrench & socket tighten one nut into the other.

As they mention in the instructions on panel 11..."Pay attention at this point because there is nothing holding the window in place."
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  #5  
Old April 11th, 2006, 08:47 AM
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Mine stick due to the door rusting slightly over the winter so I have to use a pry bar to pop the tops off.
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  #6  
Old April 11th, 2006, 11:21 AM
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Mike Lynch
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Thanks for all of your help.

Mike
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  #7  
Old May 28th, 2010, 01:14 PM
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Resurrecting this thread because I'm in a very similar situation.

Driver side no problem. - took only 10 minutes

Passenger side will not budge.
I think i've tried all the tricks from doing multiple searches in the forum

Fail 1: Rubber mallet on the studs, door tops, etc - no budge, sledge on wood to stud, broke the wood.
I can't believe I haven't broken the windows yet.

Fail 2: Two guys with all their strength pulling from the top at all angles - no budge

Fail 3: 2 nut trick - started to strip the threads - beginning to think they are loctited on with the industrial grade stuff.

Fail 4: Prybar with full strength - nothing. I got the prybar all the way through and thought this would work, but starting to dent the door top and loosing paint. Taking a deep breath on this for now before I really break something.

Fail 5: Got creative with a hi lift, but decided I should stop before I kill myself.

The studs are not rusty at all, they may be a newer set put on by previous owner.

Any suggestions before I go and get medieval? (although I think i've done this already with the prybar and hi lift)

I might wait and bring in to a "professional" wrencher but I think that would be pussying out. Done for the day, getting some beer and chill for a while

Thanks for any suggestions.

Gery
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  #8  
Old May 28th, 2010, 01:22 PM
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Gery, it is VERY frustrating. I got ONE NUT OFF (dammit that sounded wrong), can't get the others off, but somehow the side that I DID get off budges LESS than the side I was able to remove...it must be Land Rover's Chinese Finger Trap. Perhaps if I exert little to no force they'll just pop off. I'll need to come out your way next weekend or something and we can try sorting this out.

------ Follow up post added May 28th, 2010 01:25 PM ------

PS, mine moved more than yours are showing, but perplexing thing is that the nut next to the door hinge won't come out, but I can raise THAT side about a quarter of an inch. And the side with the nut I removed (back by the door handle) won't budge AT ALL.
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  #9  
Old May 28th, 2010, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rijosho View Post
Gery, it is VERY frustrating. I got ONE NUT OFF (dammit that sounded wrong), can't get the others off, but somehow the side that I DID get off budges LESS than the side I was able to remove...it must be Land Rover's Chinese Finger Trap. Perhaps if I exert little to no force they'll just pop off. I'll need to come out your way next weekend or something and we can try sorting this out.

------ Follow up post added May 28th, 2010 01:25 PM ------

PS, mine moved more than yours are showing, but perplexing thing is that the nut next to the door hinge won't come out, but I can raise THAT side about a quarter of an inch. And the side with the nut I removed (back by the door handle) won't budge AT ALL.
Ha Ha!
Like the "Land Rover Chinese Finger Trap" analogy
Sounds like a possible plan. Perhaps come over and we'll figure it out, then go on the boat and get drunk!
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  #10  
Old May 28th, 2010, 01:50 PM
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Brian
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So here's the problem, and I used to have this when I would do the window thing. The rubber gasket gets fused to the capping and really needs to be released. This also probably means you've got some corrosion and soon to be paint damage on the capping as soon as you pull the gasket away from it. If you can slide something under that gasket and slowly work from one end to the other to release it, you'll probably be able to free the door top from the bottom. I mean if you look at the door you were able to free one window from you can see how simple the design is...Two holes and two studs...

I also used to open the window and tap the top of the frame with a rubber mallet. You may want to try that once you've got the gasket released. you've also got the right idea with removing the door card to get at it.

If none of this is your problem then good luck...hopefully the studs aren't fused to the holes with rust and corrosion...
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  #11  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by specops1526 View Post
So here's the problem, and I used to have this when I would do the window thing. The rubber gasket gets fused to the capping and really needs to be released. This also probably means you've got some corrosion and soon to be paint damage on the capping as soon as you pull the gasket away from it. If you can slide something under that gasket and slowly work from one end to the other to release it, you'll probably be able to free the door top from the bottom. I mean if you look at the door you were able to free one window from you can see how simple the design is...Two holes and two studs...

I also used to open the window and tap the top of the frame with a rubber mallet. You may want to try that once you've got the gasket released. you've also got the right idea with removing the door card to get at it.

If none of this is your problem then good luck...hopefully the studs aren't fused to the holes with rust and corrosion...
I think it's more than the rubber gasket. The other side came off quick with 10% off the effort I've been trying on the passenger side. The door top is not budging at all. I think the studs on the passenger side are somehow fused to the plastic sleeves and are somehow bent/warped making the sliding off very difficult.

There might be a rust on the door top or in the sleeve area, but I cant see any signs of any.
Something is keeping the studs in place.
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  #12  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:03 PM
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I dot eh pry trick with a crewdriver to losen the rubber strip open the window and tap on the frame with my hand. Also be sure to work each side evenly. If one side goes up just a little bit the other side gets jammed and it will not move.
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  #13  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:09 PM
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:Have you tried inverting the truck and pushing down.


Keep spraying breaker bp in and eventually you will be able to work them off.

good luck
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  #14  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craigd View Post
I dot eh pry trick with a crewdriver to losen the rubber strip open the window and tap on the frame with my hand. Also be sure to work each side evenly. If one side goes up just a little bit the other side gets jammed and it will not move.
I may buy another small prybar and get someone on the the other side and another person holding the door top, pulling the window and making sure it doesn't fly off when it "releases"

I guess I'll be looking for new gasket seals and buying touch up paint after this is all done!
I think it's very important to get even force on both sides to get it off. I just can't believe I can't even get it to budge a little with the prybar.
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  #15  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:13 PM
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Tony Lawson
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I'm drawing from memory here, but IIRCC, there is a nylon sleeve around the stud in the the socket (my ST memory is almost 10 years out, but I recall the sleeve being whitish and looking like nylon). Nylon will swell with moisture(we avoid it's use in subsea applications because of this little issue) - which seems to be in abundance during winter. The ID locks on the stud threads (or some of them), the OD - well, it just gets stuck on the slightly corroded bore surface. But this can make a lock the takes some force to break. I remember shearing little threads of nylon out of the ID every time I had a hard removal - which was always in spring after a wet winter.

Wondering if a day with a hairdryer blowing up under at the stud would help dry the bushing and loosen the lock.
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  #16  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjekogian View Post
:Have you tried inverting the truck and pushing down.


Keep spraying breaker bp in and eventually you will be able to work them off.

good luck
I went through a can of WD but I think I have to wreck the gasket to get enough to penetrate to the stud area.

If you hold the truck upside down, I'll try the inverting method
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  #17  
Old May 28th, 2010, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 16kpsi View Post
I'm drawing from memory here, but IIRCC, there is a nylon sleeve around the stud in the the socket (my ST memory is almost 10 years out, but I recall the sleeve being whitish and looking like nylon). Nylon will swell with moisture(we avoid it's use in subsea applications because of this little issue) - which seems to be in abundance during winter. The ID locks on the stud threads (or some of them), the OD - well, it just gets stuck on the slightly corroded bore surface. But this can make a lock the takes some force to break. I remember shearing little threads of nylon out of the ID every time I had a hard removal - which was always in spring after a wet winter.

Wondering if a day with a hairdryer blowing up under at the stud would help dry the bushing and loosen the lock.
Here are picts of the sleeves from the driver side (which came off easy). Note the grooves on the inner part of the sleeve. Not so bad here, and thats why I think they came off quick. My theory is that the passenger side ones are really embedded, making it more difficult. I might try quick freezing the studs (shrinking it) and try to pop them out after.
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  #18  
Old May 28th, 2010, 03:46 PM
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Well, my truck has been a CA truck it's entire life and the very first time I took the windows off, I was cursing all to hell. It took me forever, they were really stuck on. Believe me, that gasket can really hold the window on, no joke. I'm sure some rust and corrosion on the studs is adding to your difficulty too though. Even mine had a little bit of rust. I think even a stud on each side was missing the sleeve from the factory and it was still hard as hell. Try some PB blaster. The sleeves definitely can be in there tight.

If you put the windows back on, ditch the sleeves and get the quick nuts. Also put something between the gasket and the capping to prevent it from sticking. This is precisely why I've vowed to never put those window tops back on. The Badger windows are the best thing I've ever bought, as I've mentioned before. Makes life a lot easier.
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  #19  
Old May 28th, 2010, 03:50 PM
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Soak with PB Blaster or Liquid Wrench penetrating oil. Hit it a few times and let it soak overnight. You may have to spray it down several times over a couple of days.
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  #20  
Old May 28th, 2010, 04:39 PM
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Thanks for all the suggestions and advice!
I've been spraying it with wd40 for 3 weeks. Trying little by little.
I will spray some pb blaster and see how that works and try again Monday when I return from a trip.

If all else fails --- dynamite!

I'm waiting on badger doortops that a forum member might be selling soon. Said I was first in line
If not this year, Chris at Badger will be getting a call when $ permits.

Gery
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