need 2 inch longer end links for front Swaybar - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old October 11th, 2016, 03:41 PM
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Stephan Laputka
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need 2 inch longer end links for front Swaybar

I did some searching on this and I know there are a few forum members that have made them in the past. I unfortunately have zero metal working skills. I have a 2 inch lift and I'd like to try reattaching my swaybar to see if I can stabilize the truck a bit more on the trail. I know AB or RN sells a 2 inch block that mounts to frame attachment points but I'd much rather keep the bar tucked up higher vs dropping it down and using the stock links

I didn't find anyone that sells a longer end link, but does anyone know of a generic link that could work? I know Currie has custom end links but I have no idea what bolt sizes to use or what length to order etc.

Thanks
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  #2  
Old October 11th, 2016, 03:52 PM
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Stephan Laputka
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Has anyone used something like this before?

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-7961/overview/
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  #3  
Old October 11th, 2016, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sflash868 View Post
Has anyone used something like this before?

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-7961/overview/
On other makes and models. Not much to endlinks as long as they are the proper length and don't bend.
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  #4  
Old October 11th, 2016, 04:07 PM
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The radius arm front suspension has a lot of roll resistance built in to it (torsional twist across the axle being absorbed by the radius arm bushings).

Could you describe more about the symptom you are looking to reduce?

Should you decide that extending the links is necessary I would just bring them to any local welding shop and ask them to extend by 2 inches.
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  #5  
Old October 12th, 2016, 01:18 PM
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FYI just by looking you can tell that sway bars on a Defender were an afterthought, and somewhat counterproductive to the benefits of the design.

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  #6  
Old October 13th, 2016, 02:08 PM
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Stephan Laputka
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My truck suffers from being incredibly unstable and tippy off road. I have numerous threads about it on Dsource. I'm simply looking to try different setups to see what I can to improve it. I've tried many different radius arm bushings and made tons of adjustments but it's still too tippy. It's tippy sitting still. if I park it on an off camber street, I can visibly see the truck leaning even on the smallest of grades. So static lean like that removes out variables such as shock valving, bushing bind, unretained springs, etc. and basically brings it down to spring rate and anti roll rate. I've swapped springs to no avail so I'd like to try the roll bar again and see how it performs.

To be perfectly straight with you guys.. I can live with the tippiness but I'm a new dad and I've been really really close to rolling the truck many times and i don't want to have that happen with my 11 month old in the car. If I have to sacrifice a little flex for some more stability then I feel it's the appropriate dad thing to do.
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  #7  
Old October 13th, 2016, 02:29 PM
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The suspension was designed in the late 60s and no trucks had sway bars until American started buying them twenty years later. It should not be tippy and you should never need sway bars. Especially the later axles like yours with the stupidly stiff radius arm bushings. Sway bars were so people could drive them like a race car on the road without the body roll.
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  #8  
Old October 13th, 2016, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sflash868 View Post
To be perfectly straight with you guys.. I can live with the tippiness but I'm a new dad and I've been really really close to rolling the truck many times and i don't want to have that happen with my 11 month old in the car. If I have to sacrifice a little flex for some more stability then I feel it's the appropriate dad thing to do.
A sway bar is not going to affect when you roll the truck. The only way I could see that you would be really tippy is if you had a ton of weight on the roof.
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  #9  
Old October 13th, 2016, 02:57 PM
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Stephan Laputka
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It's an SW and has a safarigard roof rack on it. I'm going to try retained rear springs as well to see if that helps but honestly my issue is that it seems to excessively lean on small grades so by the time it really has to articulate over something the body is already leaned over 20% more than it should be and exacerbates the effect.

I have these options as I see it:

1. Try a sway bar which has the same effect as increasing the front spring rate progressively.
2. Swap to a much heavier rear spring to force the front end to compress more.
3. Retain the rear spring at the price of articulation. I have the old Rovertym spring in back and I'm not sure how much they stretch. I doubt anywhere near as much as the cones allow but if that gets me another inch of compression in the front than it might be OK.
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  #10  
Old October 13th, 2016, 03:00 PM
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Something else is seriously wrong. Your suspension should not be unloading on side slopes with only a 2" lift.
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  #11  
Old October 13th, 2016, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
A sway bar is not going to affect when you roll the truck. The only way I could see that you would be really tippy is if you had a ton of weight on the roof.
The truck almost rolls not because I lean it over too far and it flops. I understand a sway bar won't help there. The close calls come from when weight transfers from one side to the other. The body swings over unabated and in some cases has picked the tires off the ground... while taking the exact same line as other defenders, inching myself over obstacles. I've messed with shock valving and tried swapping brands as well. Going to custom valved Fox shocks helped with its on road manners but the effect is still prevalent on the trail.
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  #12  
Old October 13th, 2016, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sflash868 View Post
The truck almost rolls not because I lean it over too far and it flops. I understand a sway bar won't help there. The close calls come from when weight transfers from one side to the other. The body swings over unabated and in some cases has picked the tires off the ground... while taking the exact same line as other defenders, inching myself over obstacles. I've messed with shock valving and tried swapping brands as well. Going to custom valved Fox shocks helped with its on road manners but the effect is still prevalent on the trail.
Lack of droop issue? Tire off the ground == shocks don't do anything.

If not a lack of droop issue, have you tried running el-cheapo gas charged shocks instead of all this fancy stuff you're running?
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  #13  
Old October 13th, 2016, 03:19 PM
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to reattach your ARB with a 2 inch left, go to metaldepot.com get your self a 1.5"×2.5"×12" lenght of ally cut it in half drill 4 holes and slap them on.

with your weight transfer you gots a problem, do you have a ton of crap on the top???
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  #14  
Old October 13th, 2016, 05:33 PM
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with your weight transfer you gots a problem, do you have a ton of crap on the top???
Seems like Steve doesn't carry much on top. Just some camping stuff:

http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ail-72825.html

I'm confused about why his truck doesn't have damping when his truck shifts weight. I've seen this before but only when people were running non-gas charged shocks with fairly light compression and rebound damping. Steve's been complaining about this for literally years...I'd love to just inspect his setup and troubleshoot in person.
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  #15  
Old October 13th, 2016, 06:13 PM
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if you are more incredibly unstable and tippy as this guy, then you gots troubles boyo.

this is the only picture with out a number plate as he knows who he is

but in all honesty I always disconnect my ARB's when wheeling
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  #16  
Old October 13th, 2016, 06:18 PM
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Why all this talk about a front sway bar?
The Rover front end is already pretty stiff. If I hadto guess I'd say a lot of your roll/tippiness is coming from your rear. Put a sway bar out back and make your front end do some work.
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  #17  
Old October 13th, 2016, 06:24 PM
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if he has a 95 it should have rear ASB as std? he is talking about the front as with a 2inch lift the ASB fouls the track rod with out spacers.
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  #18  
Old October 20th, 2016, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoronos View Post
Seems like Steve doesn't carry much on top. Just some camping stuff:

http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ail-72825.html

I'm confused about why his truck doesn't have damping when his truck shifts weight. I've seen this before but only when people were running non-gas charged shocks with fairly light compression and rebound damping. Steve's been complaining about this for literally years...I'd love to just inspect his setup and troubleshoot in person.
Appreciate that. Anytime you find yourself on the west coast you're welcome to!

I can't run a sway bar in the back without completely destroying the articulation. Longest I keep it away from off camber situations, the truck works really really well off road and I'd like to keep that. I've seen the threads about the other forum member who rigged up a Currie anti rock bar on his defender but I don't nearly have the metal skills to put that in myself and I just haven't found a fab shop that I would farm the work out to at the moment. I chose the front simply because it has so little flex to begin with (compared to the rear) that the negative effect of the ARB would be minimized on the front axle. That's the only reason.

I think my next move is to replace all the springs (I've mismatched springs over the years but the current set has 10 years on them), increase the rebound valving in the back, and add an ARB where I can. See how that effects it.
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