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  #21  
Old April 28th, 2015, 06:50 AM
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Phillip
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you guys take yourselves way to seriously. 1995 should have the relocated ignition module, is there a vin range that has the module on the distributor?
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  #22  
Old April 28th, 2015, 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by rlynch356 View Post
everything points to spark..... Coil, Ignition module, wires, plugs and timing.. I had an intermittent cut out which was the the distributor, now CEL 45... hopefully a new O2 sensor coil and ignition module will fix it... pretty much nothing left at this point (already did the clean out, new TPS, ACL, and the normal culprits, truck runs fine on a CEL too,
To diagnose the ignition you really benefit from an oscilloscope. I got one off craigslist for $150. Within 10mins I had identified a faulty ignition lead ( it told me what cylinder ) ,,,
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  #23  
Old April 28th, 2015, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Davis View Post
Did you read your code yet?
I don't have anything to read the code with? Can you recommend one? Didn't get to work on her last night and probably won't get to her until Wednesday night. But I do have a check engine light and I'm sure it's one of the 3 things mentioned here. And not bad gas. Is their any chance it's timing?
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  #24  
Old April 28th, 2015, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by snow686 View Post
I don't have anything to read the code with? Can you recommend one? Didn't get to work on her last night and probably won't get to her until Wednesday night. But I do have a check engine light and I'm sure it's one of the 3 things mentioned here. And not bad gas. Is their any chance it's timing?
There's a red digital display down by the passenger side footwell that will give you the codes that are being thrown...it's primitive OBDI stuff (not II), but it's better than nothing. You won't need a code reader, just look and see what number is displayed (usually like 44, 45, etc).
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  #25  
Old April 28th, 2015, 10:48 AM
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Actually on my '95, the code display is under the passenger seat (inside the seat box). Very very easy to see and access.

------ Follow up post added April 28th, 2015 10:51 AM ------

BtW, not sure I saw that there was any code.... If you have a code, then the ECU runs in limp-mode and should ignore all the sensors (that helps with ruling out sensor-related issue... I disconnect the MAF sensor sometimes for that reason and to force the limp mode).
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  #26  
Old April 28th, 2015, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by D90Overkill View Post
Very true about driving without O2 sensors. But if they are failing and sending a bad signal, it screws with the engine management, and is worse than no signal. I don't have a ton of knowledge about engines, and I don't mean to lead on that I do, I'm just speaking from an experience I had that was exactly as the op described.

Wouldn't he have a code by now?
When O2 sensors fail they stop sending voltage. ECU is looking for between 0 and 5V positive. If it fails to get that info it just ignores the input and runs in full-rich mode for safety ( lean condition being dangerous to piston health). The purpose of the O2 sensor is to detect rich-lean condition of the exhaust gasses. This info allows the ECU to adjust injector bandwidth for higher or lower air/fuel mix.
So proper functioning O2 (proper term is HEGOS for heated exhaust gas oxygen sensor) only tell the engine how dense the fuel ratio should be, and only after the engine has reached full operating temperature.
If one or both are kaput, there will be a code and the CEL will come on. Replacing faulty O2 sensor, and disconnecting the battery for a few minutes, will restore inner peace.
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  #27  
Old April 28th, 2015, 11:23 AM
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Well said. There ya go! Code 44. Worked like a charm for me.
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  #28  
Old April 28th, 2015, 10:14 PM
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Charles Galpin
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I have chronic code 44 right now on my 94. It seems it will come on after idling for any amount of time. Fine if driving without stopping. I'm going to swap out the left O2 sensor for another used one I have to see if it stops, but these O2 sensors are only a couple of years old so I'm thinking if it turns out this sensor really is bad, then something is killing it. I am running rich for sure, but I am not sure if that's a symptom of the bad sensor, or the cause. Next I guess I'll start with a multimeter on the ecu pins, or I'll be borrowing an ocilliscope.
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  #29  
Old April 29th, 2015, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by cgalpin View Post
I have chronic code 44 right now on my 94. It seems it will come on after idling for any amount of time. Fine if driving without stopping. I'm going to swap out the left O2 sensor for another used one I have to see if it stops, but these O2 sensors are only a couple of years old so I'm thinking if it turns out this sensor really is bad, then something is killing it. I am running rich for sure, but I am not sure if that's a symptom of the bad sensor, or the cause. Next I guess I'll start with a multimeter on the ecu pins, or I'll be borrowing an ocilliscope.
Charles.

Have you made sure the exhaust manifold is right on that side?
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  #30  
Old April 29th, 2015, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by o2batsea View Post
When O2 sensors fail they stop sending voltage. ECU is looking for between 0 and 5V positive. If it fails to get that info it just ignores the input and runs in full-rich mode for safety ( lean condition being dangerous to piston health). The purpose of the O2 sensor is to detect rich-lean condition of the exhaust gasses. This info allows the ECU to adjust injector bandwidth for higher or lower air/fuel mix. So proper functioning O2 (proper term is HEGOS for heated exhaust gas oxygen sensor) only tell the engine how dense the fuel ratio should be, and only after the engine has reached full operating temperature. If one or both are kaput, there will be a code and the CEL will come on. Replacing faulty O2 sensor, and disconnecting the battery for a few minutes, will restore inner peace.
Bill is it possible to check an O2?
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  #31  
Old April 29th, 2015, 08:22 AM
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Dunno Clay. When I get a code i normally replace rather than check. These things are so cheap now that it's no big thing to toss new ones in. I buy them for about $20 a piece. They have to have the old connectors spliced on but that's like no big deal.
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  #32  
Old April 29th, 2015, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by o2batsea View Post
Dunno Clay. When I get a code i normally replace rather than check. These things are so cheap now that it's no big thing to toss new ones in. I buy them for about $20 a piece. They have to have the old connectors spliced on but that's like no big deal. eBay item number:360897126402
gracias
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  #33  
Old April 29th, 2015, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
Charles. Have you made sure the exhaust manifold is right on that side?
Honestly I haven't done anything other than read a couple of troubleshooting guides and print them out. I am hoping to take a look tonight and will check for leaks - it's one of the first checks recommended. I'll let you know how it goes
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  #34  
Old April 29th, 2015, 01:43 PM
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Not to hijack the thread, but what's the easiest way to check for an exhaust leak?
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  #35  
Old April 29th, 2015, 01:58 PM
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Not to hijack the thread, but what's the easiest way to check for an exhaust leak?
At the manifolds? First check the studs are all in place and correctly tightened.

Your hand will feel the leak ... don't get too close though.

or you can always try this method ..

Find an exhaust leak without burning your hands!
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  #36  
Old April 29th, 2015, 02:44 PM
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Thanks guys.
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  #37  
Old April 29th, 2015, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by o2batsea View Post
Dunno Clay. When I get a code i normally replace rather than check. These things are so cheap now that it's no big thing to toss new ones in. I buy them for about $20 a piece. They have to have the old connectors spliced on but that's like no big deal.
eBay item number:360897126402
Any idea if these are the titanium dioxide type (as opposed to zirconium oxide)?

At the risk of hijacking further, here is where I am. I hooked up the rovergauge on the way home and at a red light about 75% the way home I reset the CEL which had come on at the very first red light i'd stopped at earlier, and the damn thing never came back. I had to run to a track meet right after getting home, with plenty of stop and go, both ways and still no issues. So my troubleshooting was a bit flawed. I did check for leaks by listening and pressing my hand around the manifold with welding gloves on, but didn't see any evidence of a leak. I'll put a wrench on the bolts sometime but I don't think thats the issue. I then removed the cover to the ECU connector and measured the voltage between pins 4 and 23/24 ad got mixed results. When the truck was warm, but had been sitting for a half hour while I helped my neighbour remove his pool cover I was getting voltage readings fluctuating between 0 and 1 volt on both, which is a bigger range than the 0.5 to 1 volt expected. So I took it for a drive to get it up to full temp, and then I seemed to get a non fluctuating voltage - I think something like 1.1 on one and a very low voltage on the other. So not sure what to make of that, other than i'd have expected that to cause the CEL to come on, but it didn't. I think I'll try some of those cheap O2 sensors for giggles, and before replacing them, I'll try take readings at the O2 sensors since I'll be cutting the connectors off anyway. But although I am happy the problem is gone at the moment, I'm sure it will return, which sucks.

I have updated rover gauge on this tablet since i was running a pretty old version and the latest has short term lambda readings and some injector info I haven't seen before. When driving home, I did notice that the lambda trim started at basically 0 after resetting the ecu and at some point I noticed the right trim was at 60%, and the code 44 means left lambda. Not sure what to make of that - I would have thought the opposite. It's going to rain for the next 2 days and I have the top off so I won't be testing this again for a few days.
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