Jeep Liberty 2.8 diesel conversion? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old March 31st, 2013, 05:27 PM
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Jeep Liberty 2.8 diesel conversion?

Has anyone converted a jeep 2.8L into a Defender? If not what would the Pro/Cons be? I know the purist will cry blasphemy, but it seems to be cheaper then a 200TDI and a little stronger in the HP department.
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  #2  
Old March 31st, 2013, 05:29 PM
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Just wait for the new 5 cyl Ford diesel to come later this year
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  #3  
Old March 31st, 2013, 06:01 PM
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Or do the 5cylinder MB now.
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #4  
Old March 31st, 2013, 06:05 PM
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My vote if not doing a LR part would be the OM617. The work done by a board member (perhaps many) is just amazing.

It is perhaps the all time most durable engine.....

jb
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  #5  
Old March 31st, 2013, 06:05 PM
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ford 5cyl

I was considering buying a wrecked liberty, I'm assuming that's what I'd have to do with the ford, or the Jeep 6cyl that's supposed to be in the cherokees??
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  #6  
Old March 31st, 2013, 06:12 PM
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Robert Davis
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Building a conversion is NOT trival...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Korongo View Post
Has anyone converted a jeep 2.8L into a Defender? If not what would the Pro/Cons be? I know the purist will cry blasphemy, but it seems to be cheaper then a 200TDI and a little stronger in the HP department.
It would never ever ever be cheaper than the all mechanical 200TDI which bolts directly to the associated LT77 and R380.

Engine conversions have to take into account a long equation of different variables.
The major considerations are:
1. Mating the engine to the Rover transmission and if this is accomplished, can the transmission take the engine performance.
2. If not than a different transmission has to be adapted to the LT230. Where is the shifter located, how is the gearing, blah blah yada uada.
Then what about the clutch. In scenario 2 the Jeep clutch is used, but with scenario 1, will the LR clutch work, does the jeep flywheel need to be machined or a completely new flywheel manufactured to take the Land Rover clutch, and so on.
3. Where is the sump and will it clear the front differential articulation??? To fit an OM617 in the 90 or 110, it requires a custom oil pan that is both cast and constructed. This is expensive to build.
4. Wiring and ECU... in order to pass current emissions the Jeep diesel is electronically controlled and the ECU is probably tied in with theft controls and would be difficult to adapt to a different vehicle.
Then there are all the other major items like motor mounts, radiator, intercooler, gauge senders, air filter, and so on.

Any one of these can cost multiple times what it would cost to adapt another engine into a Defender where no kit currently exists. Like the Mercedes OM617 I am just about to release. This kit took over 3 years to design and develop and cost more money than will probably be recouped. Then you have to find a QUALIFIED shop to do the work in one off prototypes and later small production runs. I had to wait for one of the shops to finish up making 500,000 pieces for a government order to start on my measly 15 oil pan production run. Then you hear comments like this is the last time we're making these, because it is too much work for too little money or we do this because your projects are cool, not because we make any money on them... then you have to have the QA eo check everything before it goes out and pray the receipt knows how to install everything properly.

Hope you find this info helpful because unlike a lot of forum posts, it is not meant to show that I am smarter or better, just that I have info to share with you on the subject.

Sincerely,
Robert
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  #7  
Old March 31st, 2013, 07:01 PM
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diesels

@Robert
Thank you for taking the time to respond. That was very informative. I guess I should say that I'm having a friend who builds tube chassis to make a new chassis for the 90 so motor mounts aren't going to matter on this. I could make a plan with the transmission or use the jeep transmission as I am looking at buying the whole jeep. That would dictate an automatic. Basically I would be doing is dropping the D90 body on a custom chassis and powertrain. I would like something that is a little more road trip friendly. The computer stuff is what worries me. Mechanical is so much better for a simpleton like me... I don't suppose there is a way to ditch the electrical readers,senders,ecu...? What kind of power does the benz engine have? Thanks for your input it is much appreciated!

P.S. here are a couple images from PP Cages tube chassis' very cool, UK based as I'm sure everyone here knows...
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  #8  
Old March 31st, 2013, 07:03 PM
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I also know that these plans would ruin any resale value, but I have no plans to get rid of it...ever.
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  #9  
Old March 31st, 2013, 08:08 PM
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Questions... and answers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Korongo View Post
@Robert
Thank you for taking the time to respond... I would like something that is a little more road trip friendly. The computer stuff is what worries me. What kind of power does the benz engine have?
Hard to tell what engine you have, but will assume it is the Rover V8.

The computer stuff worries most of us, unless you are a real geek with the ability to program an ECU which can limit input programming to fuel/rpm/performance parameters. There are other custom options, but not easily mastered by the novest wrencher.

I am unaware of any mechanical system easily applied to a common rail diesel like those currently sold.

In stock form, the OM617 produces about 125 HP (about the same or a little more than a Rover TDI). With an intercooler and more turbo boost, it goes up. With a larger turbo , larger IP plungers, and a larger intercooler 160 - 190 HP is possible. With more mods, people are getting 300 HP as seen on You Tube (OM617 Drifting).

Very cool project, Cameron.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #10  
Old March 31st, 2013, 08:29 PM
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We own a '06 Lib w/ the 2.8 CRD engine. It has a lot of complexities that a 200 or 300 Tdi does not.
There are many issues with this engine since it is so "electrified", if one component of the system goes down, you're SOL unless you have a code reader and the electronic replacement part with you. On trips, I'm sure to bring my code reader, my lap top with a factory service manual on pdf and tools. Dealers have few personnel that know anything about the engine as they were only offered in 05 & 06, production was about 11,000 units here in the USA.

On running, the thing jumps like a race engine, but if you behave yourself, you can come close to 30 MPG.

IF you used the entire drive train, engine - trany - transfer case, this system's output is on the left side of the centerline of the frame whereas the D90 is on the right.

Here's a group if you want to read more in depth about this unit & issues.
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=5
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  #11  
Old March 31st, 2013, 10:03 PM
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Thanks for the responses! I have the 2.5 naturally asthmatic... the engine is very simple and reliable. I drive it 6 days a week and it has great fuel economy, but it is seriously lacking in the horsepower department. I guess the best fit would be a 200tdi, OM617 or something "mechanical." Are OM617's hard to come by?
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  #12  
Old March 31st, 2013, 10:18 PM
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i would just go with a 200 tdi, its probably the most cost affective. it literally drops right in.
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  #13  
Old March 31st, 2013, 11:51 PM
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OM617s are cheap and plentiful...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Korongo View Post
Thanks for the responses... Are OM617's hard to come by?
No.

According to the parts guy at the local Mercedes dealer, there were over half a million OM617s imported into the US and since the engines rarely fail are in lots of junk yards and available in good used condition. The local pick-n-pull sells then for around $300.

Often referred to as the most reliable engine ever manufactured, some claim to have taken them over a million miles without a rebuild. The engine has a timing chain and was used in sedans and station wagons as well as military vehicles, tracked vehicles, and G-Wagons.

It is also well known as the most versatile engine regarding alternate fuels able to run on most anything including diesel, fuel oil, bio-diesel, WVO, veg oils, ATF, power steering fluid, gear oil, hydraulic oils, mineral oils, old stale gasoline, and used crankcase oil.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #14  
Old April 1st, 2013, 12:16 PM
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I don't suppose you can get ny extra horse from the 2.5??
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  #15  
Old April 1st, 2013, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korongo View Post
I don't suppose you can get ny extra horse from the 2.5??
I've tried in the past and the design by nature is mostly prohibitive.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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