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  #1  
Old January 1st, 2015, 04:11 AM
Clarky199's Avatar
Clarky199
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Louis
1989 defender 110 hard top
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Earth problems

Hi all, happy new year to everyone!
Off to a flying start in 2015 already!
Does anyone know of any earth points that can be problematic?
My 110 defender with a 200tdi engine has developed ANOTHER fault! Think it's a bad earth but have no idea where the earths are located.
Does anyone know of any that I can get to easily and clean up?
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  #2  
Old January 1st, 2015, 04:16 AM
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Chris
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There are many throughout the vehicle. You might want to get a workshop manual or Haynes, but lets ask what the issue is you are having.
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  #3  
Old January 1st, 2015, 04:25 AM
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Clarky199
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Louis
1989 defender 110 hard top
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Hi rocky, there are only two main faults that I need to overcome, the first is the choke light on the dashboard, the car starts fine in any weather but at night the choke light on the dashboard still glows very faintly, I've been told that's down to a poor earth, the second fault is my bar lights on the roof. They are wired directly on to the main beam wire from the back of the headlights with an inline relay and earthed straight to the battery but when I put my main beam on they come on fine but won't go back off when main beam is turned off. They sometimes stay on constant other times they just go off after a minute or two.
Any ideas?
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  #4  
Old January 1st, 2015, 09:31 AM
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Robert Davis
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In this case, you're probably OK, but it is a "fire waiting to start" to hook ANY device directly to the (-) battery terminal.
If you were in fact loosing (-) ground, then the current for the entire vehicle would search for a ground through the device you wired off the battery.

Since you have an issue with the lights staying on, that is probably not a ground problem because if high amperage was being grounded through the lights the filaments would simply burn out after having surges in intensity.
You don't mention how many lights you have and how much current is being drawn, but my hunch is you have a bad relay or one suffering from overburden.
Your relay could be overloaded and the contacts inside burnt and or sticking or getting hot and expanding which is keeping the coil inside from releasing.

The dull glow could be light bleeding over from another source or you might have a (-) ground issue, just at the dash.
The fact that the engine starts is prof that it is sufficiently grounded.
You need only crawl under the 110 and trace the cables out of the battery box to start finding the (-) anchor points.

Goof luck.
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  #5  
Old January 2nd, 2015, 04:06 AM
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Louis
1989 defender 110 hard top
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Thank you all very much. I really appreciate all the advice. I'm sorry to say I have little or no idea when it comes to electrics.
The 110 came with 4 roof lights on it, I have no idea what they are or how much power they draw but I will get on the case and have a look today.
I managed to trace all the wiring and it seems that each lamp is wired to the next along the roof then the final lamp is fed in through the roof.
The back cable runs to the back of my near side headlight on the main beam wire, it is then fed back to a relay, an inline fused red wire from the + on the battery then connects to the relay and it seems that a negative is being fed straight from the battery to the relay as well!
From what I can gather is should send the relay a command when full beam is activated and the lights come on, it should then switch off when full beam is taken off but for some reason it seems to either stick on for a few seconds (usually 20-30) or it just stays on all together even though the headlights are not on main beam any more.
I've noticed if I quickly flash the lights to let someone out of a junction the roof lights always seem to stick!
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Old January 2nd, 2015, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarky199 View Post
Thank you all very much. I really appreciate all the advice. I'm sorry to say I have little or no idea when it comes to electrics. The 110 came with 4 roof lights on it, I have no idea what they are or how much power they draw but I will get on the case and have a look today. I managed to trace all the wiring and it seems that each lamp is wired to the next along the roof then the final lamp is fed in through the roof. The back cable runs to the back of my near side headlight on the main beam wire, it is then fed back to a relay, an inline fused red wire from the + on the battery then connects to the relay and it seems that a negative is being fed straight from the battery to the relay as well! From what I can gather is should send the relay a command when full beam is activated and the lights come on, it should then switch off when full beam is taken off but for some reason it seems to either stick on for a few seconds (usually 20-30) or it just stays on all together even though the headlights are not on main beam any more. I've noticed if I quickly flash the lights to let someone out of a junction the roof lights always seem to stick!
Most likely the relay is at fault. Try a new one.
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  #7  
Old January 2nd, 2015, 08:24 AM
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Robert Davis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarky199 View Post
The 110 came with 4 roof lights on it...
I managed to trace all the wiring and it seems that each lamp is wired to the next along the roof then the final lamp is fed in through the roof.
The back cable runs to the back of my near side headlight on the main beam wire, it is then fed back to a relay, an inline fused red wire from the + on the battery then connects to the relay and it seems that a negative is being fed straight from the battery to the relay as well!
From what I can gather is should send the relay a command when full beam is activated and the lights come on, it should then switch off when full beam is taken off but for some reason it seems to either stick on for a few seconds (usually 20-30) or it just stays on all together even though the headlights are not on main beam any more.
I've noticed if I quickly flash the lights to let someone out of a junction the roof lights always seem to stick!
One can hook anything up any way they like, but in my opinion, those roof lights are hooked up incorrectly.

Do a search on 12V relays and study the leads. Typically they are:
30 Power source (+)
86 Switching (+)
85 Ground (-)
87 Power (+) to device isolated by the relay.

With the above scenario, when 86 is energized with (+), an electric coil inside closes a set of contacts that join 30 to 87.
This is the same way a binary computer worked back in the old days.
The purpose is to prevent all the current required to run the device from being drawn through the switching means.

If all these lights some knucklehead hooked up were powered off the high beams, it would melt the headlight and dipper switch because they are not designed to handle 3X the amperage load.
I suspect the PO only used the relay because in UK auxiliary lighting can only be on when the high beams are powered.

So the PO jackass followed the law to pass MOT as he took a drill to the roof.
Anyway, I suspect he used a single 20 or 30 amp relay that is now faulty.

In most states, you have to have off road lights covered when driving on a public road, so you're better off rewiring them to function from a separate switch, or remove them all together.

If they were wired "correctly" as intended, you'll find:
30 Battery (+)
86 High Beam (+)
85 (-)
87 (+) to ass clown roof lights.

I once drove a 110 in the rain with UD from Baltimore to Philadelphia, then solo down the eastern shore of MD/VA and across the tunnel to VA Beach in the rain with a steady drip on the back of my neck because some idiot had decided to drill a hole through the roof for extra lights.
The first thing I did was remove the lights and get out the alunina-weld and seal up the holes.
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"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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