Defender 90/110 Rear Wheel Liners - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old August 19th, 2014, 07:21 AM
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Defender 90/110 Rear Wheel Liners

Ok...so I've had my NAS D90 for a couple years now. I still love it...though I often refer to her as the "money pit".

Well, my latest project was a complete LED upgrade.

And while installing the tail lights...I found myself asking, why, after all these years has someone not designed something besides mud flaps to keep water, mud and debris off the frame, seat box, roll cage, and tail lights, etc...

So did some searching...and the only solution I found is Gwyn Lewis in the UK has designed some "mud barrier" plates and also quick detachable mud flaps that come in a kit. The system looks pretty cool and I would have already purchased, if they had completed the design for the D90 (D110 system is ready to ship).

So I continued to ponder alternate solutions...and then it hit me. Why hasn't someone just used injection molded plastic? And then I found a US company called "Rugged Liner" that already makes these things for numerous trucks and they're called Rugged Liner Rear Wheel Inner Liners. You can find them on sale at Summit Racing and Youtube has videos for installation.

So the discussion I'm hoping to generate is do you agree that these would be great for the D90/110? If so; post some comments so we can show the company it would be worthwhile to make it happen. I believe these things would sell like hot cakes all over the globe. But honestly, I just want a set on my Defender.

Last, if there are any Defender owners in Michigan near Owosso...get your truck over there for them to look at, and let's get these things rolling...Ha!
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  #2  
Old August 19th, 2014, 08:00 AM
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Look like the Gwynn Lewis shields do fit a 90. Have you spoken to them?
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 08:11 AM
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Sure have...I've got propshafts, sumobars, and an A-Frame link coming from Gwyn. Yes, the shields work on the D90...they haven't completed the design of the quick-detach mud flaps to go with them for the D90 yet...but soon.

But these still wont keep the mud off everything else. Just the aft end. A cad designed molded plastic liner would keep it off everything.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven81 View Post
Sure have...I've got propshafts, sumobars, and an A-Frame link coming from Gwyn. Yes, the shields work on the D90...they haven't completed the design of the quick-detach mud flaps to go with them for the D90 yet...but soon. But these still wont keep the mud off everything else. Just the aft end. A cad designed molded plastic liner would keep it off everything.

Just creating the mold would be insanely expensive ... You might get away with a vacuum form but unless you were going it yourself it's going to be costly.

Are you thinking full wheel arch liners like a modern car?
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 08:28 AM
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To be honest...I'd like a liner that runs from the front wheel well all the way back to the rear well too. The sill design on these things is the silliest thing I've ever seen. So far, my Defender has only seen sand. But I can't imagine trying to pressure wash mud packed into the bottom of this thing. Not to mention I have about a 1/4 inch gap in my sill when I open the door and look down...that's gotta be great in the mud...not!

------ Follow up post added August 19th, 2014 04:31 PM ------

Yes, full arch. And I'm no expert...but with cad and injection molding; I don't think it's that costly compared to the number of folks that would install them. Looking closer at the design of these things...I don't how anyone would take a $100K D110 or a $50K D90 in the mud...without having something better. But that's just me...and I'm a newbie )
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Old August 19th, 2014, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven81 View Post
To be honest...I'd like a liner that runs from the front wheel well all the way back to the rear well too. The sill design on these things is the silliest thing I've ever seen. So far, my Defender has only seen sand. But I can't imagine trying to pressure wash mud packed into the bottom of this thing. Not to mention I have about a 1/4 inch gap in my sill when I open the door and look down...that's gotta be great in the mud...not! ------ Follow up post added August 19th, 2014 04:31 PM ------ Yes, full arch. And I'm no expert...but with cad and injection molding; I don't think it's that costly compared to the number of folks that would install them. Looking closer at the design of these things...I don't how anyone would take a $100K D110 or a $50K D90 in the mud...without having something better. But that's just me...and I'm a newbie )
In more than 25 years of production land rovers have survived with out it ... Tooling costs to design and build would be very expensive. Spray copious amounts of WD40 on the underneath before you go off road and that will help keep it clean.
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  #7  
Old August 19th, 2014, 09:04 AM
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I hear ya...and understand your point. But that doesn't mean there isn't a better way )

If it's so expensive; then why are they already made for so many US truck models? Just thinking out loud is all.

But yes, I will contact the company and inquire...why speculate right.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 09:37 AM
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Machining a mold for a part as big as this would be veerry expensive..
There are more us pickups sold in a year than there are defenders in the us by far....

I've been half-assedly working on a rear wheel well splash guard for a while now, I'm leaning towards a plastic/rubber sheet cut to fit and then mounted to some brackets or something like that..

~Steve

Just cuz rover hasn't done it, doesn't mean it's not a good idea! No wonder rear crossmembers rot out in 5 years..
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Old August 19th, 2014, 09:52 AM
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Steve...nobody's talking about just the US market. I'm not even in the US. Back to previous post...25 years production of D90/110s of basically same design all over the globe. Now lets talk numbers.

And you make a great product that's endorsed by all the 4x4 shops in UK, Australia. Africa, etc... And all the Land Rover forums...they couldn't make them fast enough.

It's just tough to pitch a product by email, from overseas, when I'm nobody. But someone on here...i.e. ECR, might want to at least present the question to this company. Just my 2 cents )
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  #10  
Old August 19th, 2014, 09:58 AM
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I don't think they machine moulds for this sort of thing. You can make them out f wood or fiberglass. They then vacuum form the plastic to the mould. There are a lot of low volume flares and such being made and they are not super expensive. It could be done.

With a Defender most people don't care as the body is all aluminum.
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  #11  
Old August 19th, 2014, 10:17 AM
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You guys are aware the td5 and newer trucks have plastic front inner fenders that even come down low enough to protect the foot well and bulkhead outriggers ? Making something similar for the rear would be great. I agree with John that these would likely be a low tech/cost manufacturing item.
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  #12  
Old August 19th, 2014, 10:17 AM
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Todd, my experience with liners is mixed. We used to alter Volvo 240 liners to fit in the front fenders of BMW E9s (3.0CSi) and while they did keep the sludge and whatnot out of the hiding places, they also kept moisture in there trapping things like pine needles and leaves that just acted as sponges for any moisture. So, unless you periodically inspected behind the wheel arches by removing them you were doing more harm than good.


When you look at the undercarriage (in particular the rear) of a Defender, not only is water and debris kicked up inside the inner arches, but it finds its way up in the center above the fuel tank and rear crossmember anyway. If I imagine my D-110 with rear liners, I can only see this stopping SOME debris, water and salt from getting blasted against either side of the rear crossmember. Sure, you'd stop some of it, but stuff is always going to find its way in there and I'd rather have immediate and constant visual access to everything so it can be sprayed out, cleaned and touched up with Waxoyl when necessary.


It's a good thought, but in my opinion, it's best to leave the entire area easily accessed and open to air out and visual inspection often. It's never going to be a solution where you can simply leave it alone. I could see some value in somehow protecting the front outriggers and battery boxes from being sandblasted constantly.
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  #13  
Old August 19th, 2014, 10:49 AM
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It's a great idea in my opinion, but I think we're forgetting that the Defender has always been considered a "utilitarian" type of vehicle, with the intent of being field serviceable. Adding the wheel arch protection, while easily removable when need be, only adds to the "complexity" of servicing the rig out in the field.

The Defender was never meant to cost $50 to $100K, it's only so I the US due to its limited availability in this market.
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  #14  
Old August 19th, 2014, 11:04 AM
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Uncle D...no, I was not aware of the newer front liners. I think I will hold off on the Gwyn Lewis front wheel well modification and check on the 2014 OEM inner fenders first. I'll let you know how that route works out.
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:22 AM
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Treehorn...Awesome input! Like I said I'm new to the community. I spent 26 plus years traveling all over the world in the military and I fell in love with these things. I'm retired now; but still working/flying overseas. I did a lot of research, and had an NAS shipped here from Japan that has a good VIN...Lord willing and the creek don't rise. But she's in beautiful shape!! And of course I can't stop dumping money into her. So if she get's crushed on her maiden voyage, when that day comes...well somebody is gonna get hurt (

So anyway, like I said....after buying crimpers and spending a lot of time and money crimping pins for waterproof connectors because somebody at the LED factory didn't...that's what got the wheels turning.

And to be honest...my experience with liners is this. I had a 2003 Super Duty...loved that truck. I spend a lot of time in the mountains of Norther New Mexico when I'm home. But that truck had terrible liners. The mud and rocks would be jammed in everywhere...inside bumpers, etc... Bottom line...lots of quarters at the carwash.

Then I buy a 2008...still have it. Same truck...minus newer motor etc... But the best thing about that truck is the wheel wells are completely enclosed. And the clean-up is easy and quick!

And that experience is what drove me down this road.

And cost...well the Gwyn Lewis 4x4 kit for the rear wells is $137 USD and sells like crazy to the rest of the world. The Rugged Liner Kit at Summit Racing is $81 USD and has a 5 star rating. And well...I'm not going to say what I'd be willing to pay for a set to put on my D90.

But as far as the waxoyl...do you have it sprayed everywhere? The frame, chassis, axles, etc... That's an option here as well...so just curious?
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Old August 19th, 2014, 11:50 AM
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At my location the mud is VERY sticky, clay type. In a 1/2 my truck will pick up at least 5 gallons (yes, I have measured) on mud that will require at least an hour to remove with a pressure washer. I do try to drive in a manner that will lessen the "fling" of this mud in accumulating in the wheel wells too.

In post # 6 it is mentioned to use WD40 to aid in mud not sticking. But there is another product that has been out about 1 year that I have not tried. It is Rustoleum's "NeverWet". It's a 2 step spray on application and I've read that it's long lasting but not permanent. Here's a short film to show it's properties.

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Old August 19th, 2014, 01:29 PM
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That stuff is amazing! It's something to look into for sure...thanks!
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  #18  
Old August 19th, 2014, 01:31 PM
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The only thing the rear flaps on my truck seemed to do was hold mud/moisture in and cause corrosion.

I think they are there to protect the rear light electrics. Other than that, not sure what other purpose they serve...
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Old August 20th, 2014, 05:37 AM
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Get some old conveyor belt rubber and cut that to fit in, bolt/screw it either end and up in the "centre" to hold it up, job done.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 09:24 AM
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Or use some aluminum flashing (roof), bent and cut to form (mounted to existing bolts) in the back of the wheel well. I did this to protect an aux fuel pump I have located on the rear crossmember. Does a nice job of cutting down on the mud that ends up wedges between the cage mount and chassis.
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