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  #21  
Old May 16th, 2005, 09:48 PM
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"Use an ethylene glycol based anti-freeze (containing no methanol) with non-phosphate corrosion inhibitors suitable for use in aluminium [sic - and I know it's British] engines to ensure the protection of the cooling system against frost and corrosion in all seasons. Use one part anti-freeze to one part water for protection down to -36°C (-33°F) ..."

From section 9 of the workshop manual.

"At two year intervals or at the onset of the second winter, the cooling system should be drained, flushed and refilled with the required water and anti-freeze solution"

From section 10.
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  #22  
Old May 16th, 2005, 10:23 PM
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Nicholas Orros
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This is too good...
All I'm saying is that it's 2005, and what worked then or even what was written then, may not be true to this day. Think about it.
It gets pretty hot down here and all I know is that this stuff works, and on top of that it is environmentally friendly, meaning it won't kill dogs & cats. Ever had a dog die from drinking coolant ? It's not a pretty sight.
And we're not talking about whether green or orange is 'ok' for aluminum engines, it is... It's just that Amsoil is better. I'm not just saying it's better, it's CHEMICALLY better. I'm not going to waste my time trying to convince you of that... Amsoil is the oldest synthetic manufacturer anywhere. (I do get $$ everytime I mention Amsoil...)


Yes, I work at an Advertising Agency, but I don't do advertising... I'm a computer web master, so it makes no difference what is on the billboards, on tv, magazines, etc... So, take some time before you buy... whoever it is... go to GOOGLE.com and do a search on coolants, and see what the REAL EXPERTS say. But 'some' may know better right ?

I mean really, maybe an extra $25 a year... doesn't seem like much to me.

Cheers,

Nicholas
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  #23  
Old May 16th, 2005, 10:37 PM
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I think the non-phosphate part is was makes it a little more difficult to find. I believe most older green antifreeze used in american cars actually called for phosphate corrosion inhibitors. I know most green found in autoparts stores has Silicates. Which apparently in the manual isn't a problem, but I thought wasn't good. I'd be curious about the non-phosphate of the 'normal' green. Honda coolant has neither phosphate nor silicates, so I feel good about it.

Also, distilled water should be used when mixing, not water from the tap. (the pre-mixed stuff is like de-ionized or some crap...?)

Just found this on Prestone's site:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prestone
Q: Does Prestone® Antifreeze/Coolant contain phosphates?
A: Some European automobile manufacturers request that a phosphate-free antifreeze be used in their vehicles. This issue is related to the extremely high mineral content of the water in Europe. If you were to mix an antifreeze that contained phosphates with the type of water they have in Europe, it may produce deposits that can settle in the cooling system and promote corrosion. However, in North America we do not have this type of water problem. Typical North American coolants have contained phosphates (which is part of the corrosion inhibitor package) for many years. Therefore, the question of phosphates is a non-issue here in North America. Prestone® Antifreeze/Coolant is completely safe for use in both foreign and domestic vehicles. For those consumers who would feel more comfortable using a phosphate-free antifreeze, our Prestone® Extended Life 5/150 Antifreeze/Coolant is phosphate, silicate, and borate free. This coolant uses a special chemistry and technology that extends the life of the corrosion inhibitor package so that it lasts for five years or 150,000 miles (whichever comes first), and is safe for all cars and light trucks (old or new). Prestone® Extended Life 5/150 Antifreeze/Coolant has been approved by General Motors under their DEX-COOL® specifications and is compatible with other DEX-COOL® approved coolants.
That Extended life 5/150 is the orange stuff which I don't want to run.... but according to this I guess the argument is really moot if distilled water is used to mix with the green you buy anywhere. I feel more educated now
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  #24  
Old May 17th, 2005, 07:27 AM
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Oh boy, dare I say this...

OK, I run Amsoil fluids for the most part. It's fine to use the "environmentally friendly" argument for the unused fluid you store in your garage, or accidentally spill on the floor, but once it runs through the engine, it gets contaminated just like normal anti-freeze. It will NOT be safe for drinking at this point. You must follow the same disposal procedures for both kinds of anti-freeze. It's advantages from an environmental standpoint primarily apply before it is used.

And my background is an undergraduate degree in Chemical Engineering and I used to live in one of the most tree-hugging hippie areas in the west.
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  #25  
Old May 17th, 2005, 09:59 AM
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Just so there are no tragic misunderstandings....
The "environmentally friendly" stuff will still do a fine job of croaking-off your pet. Its main advantage is that it doesn't taste sweet like the green stuff, so your pet is less likely to taste it.

And my background is I sleep with a veterinarian.... and I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night!
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  #26  
Old May 17th, 2005, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rod Hayward
Just so there are no tragic misunderstandings....
The "environmentally friendly" stuff will still do a fine job of croaking-off your pet. Its main advantage is that it doesn't taste sweet like the green stuff, so your pet is less likely to taste it.

And my background is I sleep with a veterinarian.... and I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night!

Hey.. We came up with that Holiday Inn Express line... We do ICHotelsGroup (the mother ship...lol)

Yeah, I've slept with a veterinarian myself...haha... and actually a member of the humane society in Tallahassee, we rescue 'old dogs'... like myself.

OH... From the Web:

"...And unlike conventional ethylene glycol based products, which are highly toxic and even fatal, AMSOIL Antifreeze & Coolant is formulated with propylene glycol. It is biodegradable and requires no special disposal costs or procedures in most areas. Above all, its low toxicity presents no threat to children, pets or wildlife..."



That's it, I'm done on this topic. Have fun !


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  #27  
Old May 17th, 2005, 11:53 AM
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Jeez, is this thread still going on?

I believe in the "good enough" principle. That means using a product appropriate to a specific application for which it is meant. That does not mean using a minimally acceptable such product. It also does not mean using one overpriced and overspeced for the application.

Let me explain: I used to be a audio nut, of course thinking that I should search for products with the lowest distortion numbers, best specs, etc. before actually doing a listening test. Usually such a test would come after the purchase! Then I was enlightened by Dr. Bose himself in one of my classes. Distortion specs below a certain number are meaningless IN THIS APPLICATION. The application: human listening. Of course, if our target customer was a dog or cat or owl then I am sure these specs are meaningful.

So, my days of visiting Tech-HiFi (anyone remember?) pretty much came to an end and I moved on to lesser known manufacturers and better products. Lesser known to me since those ad guys always pushed Technics, Sony, Panasonic, Hitachi, Onkyo, etc.. Not to say that all of these are bad products - certainly not. But the time came to look beyond the specs.

My point is that the good-ole green stuff (yes, plain old Zerex) was the correct application for Corvettes and/or Camaros with aluminum blocks, heads, intakes. Not Prestone, as per the independent tests. Again, not a minimally accepted solution. In the case of the ZL1 Camaros (al block) these were extremely collectable and the wrong coolant would be catastrophic.

From what I recall the coolant problems with the 215 were using the wrong coolant - alcohol-based. I new two guys with this motor in TR6/MB applications. Again, Zerex and they were driven hard. Another problem was with copper in the radiators reacting with aluminum. I don't have first hand knowledge of this as everyone ran aluminum radiators.

As far as phosphates, silicates, etc. it is a matter of practicality. We now have phosphate-free to save those fools using tap water instead of pure. Frankly, I've always used tap water and never had a problem. We also have 5/150 stuff. Well, again in our application, it is folly to rely on that. For me, it is folly in any application. Is it such a pain to change coolant yearly for God's sake?!

So, we have the green stuff that's "just fine" and the rest which is overkill, never mind overpriced. If we are to adhere to our application requirements - and change it yearly - then there is no benefit to non-green except a false one.

If you think your motor is instantly running much cooler (1/3 vs 1/2) because of Amsoil, well, what can I say - except get a real gauge and then we'll see. But you did then say it reaches 1/2 frequently so hmmm...I say throw in some Water Wetter and you're done - much cheaper but unnecessary.

As for the environmental aspect well, I don't make that my first priority. I don't keep the stuff out and I recycle - what more do you want?

Enough rambling. If you think anything less than 1% THD is meaningful then go for the overpriced orange or pink or yellow. Enlightenment may come your way one day and it will be free. Until then you may live in your own little, overpriced, fantasy world.
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  #28  
Old May 1st, 2009, 09:27 PM
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  #29  
Old May 1st, 2009, 10:32 PM
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Yes. Time for a flush here. I noticed it running a bit warm on the highway.
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  #30  
Old May 1st, 2009, 10:32 PM
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Normal green stuff for me (which is now universal use).
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  #31  
Old May 1st, 2009, 10:53 PM
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This is being (and has been many times) discussed over on DiscoWeb:

http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=58758
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  #32  
Old May 1st, 2009, 11:23 PM
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I put the BMW Blue stuff in everything I own. I've used them all, and its the only one I like. I believe it is the same LR G48 coolant that you buy at the dealer for the 03-05 RR, only when you buy it in the BMW bottle it costs about half!

Anyway, I was having some problems in an old e30 I had where the temp would creep up in traffic on really hot days, esp. with the AC on. So I flushed everything and replaced with the new (at the time) BMW stuff, and from then on the temp gauge always read a little left of center (about 1/8"), and only got up to half on a particularly hot day in traffic. When it was time to replace the stuff in my Jeep I used it again. It has also consistently run slightly cooler than before, and has never moved from its new spot since despite the torture I have put it through ie. heavy trailers in high heat in the mountains

I have always suspected that this stuff must have something like water wetter already in it, but I have absolutely no proof of that! Without a doubt it has lowered the normal temp in both vehicles that I have put it in. I intend to put it in the 110 as well, but I have no baseline for the old coolant in it (or the gauge for that matter).
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  #33  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 12:05 AM
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Andrew, did you do the 110 gauge update from the ECR website? I have a temp gauge out of a 95 D90 and am thinking about doing it, but I want to confirm what sender I need.
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  #34  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 12:19 AM
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I did do it, and from the little I have run it, it seems to be fine without swapping the sensor. I will of course check it out, but the sensor wasn't a priority as the truck only moves back and forth across the street right now anyway.
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  #35  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 12:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stmpede
I did do it, and from the little I have run it, it seems to be fine without swapping the sensor. I will of course check it out, but the sensor wasn't a priority as the truck only moves back and forth across the street right now anyway.
At least yours moves. Mine is in two states.
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  #36  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 02:30 AM
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Only two? Ron, I expect you to have your rovers far more widespread than that! Honestly, I haven't touched it in weeks. Time has been a problem, plus I just added a new "toy" to the arsenal...

(pics to follow next time it's nice out)
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  #37  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 02:33 AM
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I have been consolidating my parts to one location (my parents are sick of my having things in the garage and family hanger--which I keep offering to buy).
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  #38  
Old May 2nd, 2009, 04:24 AM
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Why not put a real gauge in?
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