Chasing the squealing on the 300 Tdi - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old August 20th, 2013, 09:52 AM
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Julien Dalbin
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Chasing the squealing on the 300 Tdi

After my timing belt replacement and head gasket change last year I started to have an intermittent squealing on my engine.

Well, I gradually changed all my bearing in the front engine: belt tensor, water pump, a/c belt pulleys and even the difficult fan bearing (thanks Santiago ).

Believe it or not the squealing still there

After giving it some thought I realized I'm missing one bearing: the A/C clutch bearing
Those are not very difficult to change (you will need a good snap ring pliers) but are not a very common model of bearing.

Anyone been there and know the bearing reference so I can order part before starting the job?
It's probably a ID 30 mm, OD 52 mm, TH 22 or 23 mm but better safe than sorry.
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  #2  
Old August 20th, 2013, 10:18 AM
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Get a doctors stethoscope and pull off the flat bit on the end .... this will give you a super directional listening device .. you'll be able to listen to individual areas in the engine. You'll figure out exactly whats making the noise.
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  #3  
Old August 20th, 2013, 10:41 AM
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Josh Harris
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I had a squealing problem on my 97 and replaced everything that had a bearing up front. Come to find out it was the belt, even though the belt looked to be in great shape and was only a couple years old.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crash303 View Post
I had a squealing problem on my 97 and replaced everything that had a bearing up front. Come to find out it was the belt, even though the belt looked to be in great shape and was only a couple years old.
This is most likely the problem. Also, there are two types of serp belts for the 300TDi. Make sure you have the correct one.

My squeak went away after I had to retap/helicoil the mounting/pivot bolt to the spring tensioner. It's a poor design because it is very easy to overtorque this bolt and the threads on the receiving end are soft cast alloy and part of the timing belt cover. Then again, you could hacve the incorrect belt (I dont' know the exact p/n for the belts, but that's something else to look into).

The reason why the mounting/pivot bolt is important is because there is quite a bit of torsional tension on that mounting point (all of which pivits on that mounting bolt) and if its not square and is the slightest bit loose, the tensioner will become a little cockeyed and the belt will RUB on the tensioner wheel instead of ROLL over it like it is supposed to. Also, the pivot bearing could fail because its out of line. I caught mine before bearing failure, but again, the soft female threads were the culprit on mine.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 02:51 PM
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Julien Dalbin
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Usually, when it's the belt, if you spray a little bit of water while it's running, it will quiet down. Not my case, but I do want to try to put the old belt in place to see if it will change something.
It's quite difficult to aislate the squealing while engine is running but I should use the sthetoscop method.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JFD View Post
Usually, when it's the belt, if you spray a little bit of water while it's running, it will quiet down. Not my case, but I do want to try to put the old belt in place to see if it will change something.
It's quite difficult to aislate the squealing while engine is running but I should use the sthetoscop method.
dont let that test decieve you. Was the same type of thing for me. when the belt dressing or water dried up, the belt was still not squarely running or rolling over the tensioner and there was just enough cross-scuffing to cause the squeal.

Take the belt off and inspect the movement and torque on the tensioner itself. take it all the way off and inspect the bearing and the mounting threads.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 03:24 PM
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also clean the belt. oil in belt = squealling. If belt rib tops are really glazed, might be worth a tad bit of light sanding to expose fresh rubber and get grip back.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
also clean the belt. oil in belt = squealling. If belt rib tops are really glazed, might be worth a tad bit of light sanding to expose fresh rubber and get grip back.

good point Mark. sometimes the simply solutions are the best ones to try first
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Old August 20th, 2013, 04:25 PM
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Look up "penny trick 300 tdi".
This solution worked perfectly for me. If needed, I can snap a picture of the fix latter today.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 06:01 PM
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Julien Dalbin
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My belt tensioner is new and seem to be right on line, the old one was loosing the spring pressure but I kept the pulley, put a fresh 6302 on it and replace the crappy snap ring with a decent one. I recentlly mount the old pulley with his new bearing in it, but still squealing.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 09:37 PM
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Try the penny. I had the same exact problem with new parts. Installed the penny, no more squealing.
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Old August 21st, 2013, 09:41 AM
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Not a big fan of the penny trick, if I have to give the tensor an angle I would prefer to make an oblique shim on the back of the tensor.
I'll check the a/c clutch bearing first.
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Old August 21st, 2013, 09:51 AM
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Why don't you remove the a/c belt and see if the noise is still there?
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Old August 21st, 2013, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Jymmiejamz View Post
Why don't you remove the a/c belt and see if the noise is still there?
I'm traveling tomorrow, but yes, that should be first thing on the list. I'll check if I can find a number on the clutch bearing.
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Old August 21st, 2013, 01:01 PM
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If the penny trick works, you would then know where your problem lies. It would only cost you a penny to try. If it solves the problem, you could then make a oblique shim to solve the problem in a more professional and permanent way.
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Old August 21st, 2013, 01:49 PM
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This may help JFD

I spent considerable time trying to eliminate the squeal after doing a waterpump replacement on a 300Tdi. Did not squeal before and all pullys were in alignment....bearings seemed okay. I would dust it down with talcum powder and it would go away for awhile. Even tried the penny trick, roughing up the belt and pullys, even a new belt. The squeal always returned. Talcum always worked for a short time. The fix for me was to use a Gatorback belt from Goodyear #4070630. The belt is a 7PK1600.
No more problems and that was 45,000 miles ago........we carry a spare.
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  #17  
Old August 21st, 2013, 09:13 PM
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Julien Dalbin
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Believe it or not, I have a Good Year Gatorback already.
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  #18  
Old September 8th, 2013, 02:16 PM
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Julien Dalbin
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Changed the a/c compressor clutch bearing this morning. Engine quiet so far, fingers crossed.
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  #19  
Old October 11th, 2013, 09:17 PM
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FYI I did the penny trick and it worked for about a month. I've been joking that the penny had worn out all week. I finally looked at it today and the penny had totally flattened.

FWIW I had no noise until I put on a Land Rover Genuine belt. It is probably unrelated, since its still noisy with the old belt. I'm not too concerned about it since I'm going to convert to a GEMs 4.6L in the next few months.
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Old July 10th, 2017, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Howsomever View Post
I spent considerable time trying to eliminate the squeal after doing a waterpump replacement on a 300Tdi. Did not squeal before and all pulleys were in alignment....bearings seemed okay. I would dust it down with talcum powder and it would go away for awhile. Even tried the penny trick, roughing up the belt and pulleys, even a new belt. The squeal always returned. Talcum always worked for a short time. The fix for me was to use a Gatorback belt from Goodyear #4070630. The belt is a 7PK1600.
No more problems and that was 45,000 miles ago........we carry a spare.
Continental makes a 7 rib serp. belt "Elite" PK1580 Pt# 4070622, which I have found at Summit Racing.
Note it is the same length as the original Dayco 7 rib, 1580mm in length (7PK1580).
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