Any tips or pointers on brakes? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old January 5th, 2016, 08:04 PM
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Virgil Broussard
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Any tips or pointers on brakes?

I'm going to be changing my rear pads and rotors and possibly bearings. I've read plenty of threads on it and watched some videos. Just wondering if there is any other advice out there. Like when removing the rear caliper, is there enough play in the line to move it off of the disc or should I disconnect the brake line? Thanks.
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  #2  
Old January 6th, 2016, 06:48 AM
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You should be able to manipulate the caliper enough to get it out of the way so that you can remove the hub. Be careful not to pinch the line. If you are replacing the bearings I would use Timken, "set 37" is the part number if I recall correctly. I was getting mine from Summit Racing. If you are in there I would also replace the seals.
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  #3  
Old January 6th, 2016, 08:16 AM
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Bill Adams
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The other thing is that the pistons on the brake calipers get awfully janky over the years. They rust and pit. If you are on the original calipers, you may be in the market for new pistons and seals.
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  #4  
Old January 6th, 2016, 08:23 AM
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One trick I use: Unbolt the caliper and just gently wiggle it to back it off the disc then use a short bungie cord to hang it up out of the way. I hang it off the rear coil spring with a 8" bungie.
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  #5  
Old January 6th, 2016, 08:28 AM
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Mark Garrenton
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19 year old calipers... replace them while you're in there. I just did this on my kid's '99 DI. New calipers, hardware, Ferodo pads, rotors and ss/teflon flex lines. I upgraded to the bigger front calipers too. The braking performance was greatly improved. Got most of my stuff from Trevor at Rovahfarm.
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  #6  
Old January 6th, 2016, 09:34 AM
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Couple of tips here:

Of course, ensure the vehicle is stable as it sits on the jack stands. Top tip: throw a tire under the rear axle as an extra bit of security. Oh and nitrile gloves. Not telling you how to live your life, but if you are going to pull the bearings, these will prevent misery.

1. Check the brake fluid reservoir. If it is nearly full, remove some fluid. This can be done simply by taking a clean paper towel and soaking up some fluid, then removing it. DO NOT LET BRAKE FLUID GET ON THE PAINT. Brake fluid eats paint, and this is a bad time.

Why would you do this? Well there is fluid in the caliper...you are about to push the fluid out of the caliper...guess where it has to go. Eggzactly.

2. Stick a small pry bar (usually ends up being a stout slotted screw driver) into the caliper between the brake pad and the disc. Start working the pry bar in there and prying. You'll need to do this to both pads.

3. Once there is some "play" in the brake pads, you can unbolt the caliper and remove it. As said before, get a bungee and move the caliper out of the way.

Wheel bearings and discs is where things get sporty. Depending on your level of knowledge and tools available, this can be a pain. I'm going to assume you are a novice and that you'd like for this to all be done like...quick instead of being a monkey with a football. For this, I suggest removing the hubs and having a machine shop install new wheel bearing races and the disc. Usually this runs about $25/hub. However it'll all be done in like, an hour.

4. Place an oil catch pan under the hub...because when you remove the drive flange, oil is coming out.

5. Unbolt the drive flange. Use a small pry bar to pry the flange away from the hub. This is when the oil happens. Remove the flange and axle shaft (they are attached).

6. You need the hub tool. Now you can buy the annoying rover hub tool...with the little stick...or you can go buy a 2 1/16" socket. Northern tool has these, they are like, $15. A LOT better than the crappy little crap hub tool. Use a small punch and your ball peen hammer to bend back the axle lock nut washer (oh, get a couple of these when you order replacements!!!). Then undo the first nut. Remove the axle lock nut washer. Then the second nut.

7. Remove the entire hub. BTW. A bunch of oil and other fun nasty things are going to come out. ENJOY!!

8. Take the entire hub assemblies (best to take both from both sides!) to like, a NAPA or other reputable machine shop. Get them to install the new rotors (top tip, get them to install new wheel studs while they are in there, super easy to do and then you'll have piece of mind), new bearing races, pack and install inner bearing, and the new hub seal. This basically renews your entire hub assembly quickly.

9. Clean up the spindle. Take your scotch brite (this is how I know I'm old...I'm recommending scotch brite...) and clean the spindle. Then take a bit of grease (BTW, get high performance synthetic wheel bearing grease, its like, an extra dollar and its awesome in a can) and apply it to where the hub seal will ride. This will prevent leaks.

10. Wipe down the new rotor with brake cleaner. The shop may have done this...but just do it again. Rotors have a thin film of greasy crap on them. You need to remove this.

11. Re-install hub. Then pack and install outer wheel bearing.

12. Look up how to do the hub nuts on a Dana 60 axle. That is what I do. Works just fine and easier than the convoluted rover way of tightening the hub nuts.

13. Re-install drive flange. Clean both mounting surfaces (scotch brite again, FTW) and use RTV here. Then re-torque to factory specs. YES USE A TORQUE WRENCH FOR REAL.

14. Lulz, back to brakes. Take your channel locks and push the caliper pistons back into the caliper. Remember the fluid reservoir? Yeah, be checking that to ensure it doesn't overflow.

15. On the BACK of the brake pad (the side that touches the caliper pistons), coat with anti-seize. Then install into the caliper.

16. Install the caliper onto the vehicle.

17. Once both sides are done and the wheels are installed, pump the brakes a few times. Check brake fluid in reservoir.

18. Test drive. But be careful, start slow.

19. Enjoy celebratory beverage.

Not saying this is how you should do it, I'm just saying this is how I do it.
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  #7  
Old January 6th, 2016, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LR Max View Post
Couple of tips here:

Of course, ensure the vehicle is stable as it sits on the jack stands. Top tip: throw a tire under the rear axle as an extra bit of security. Oh and nitrile gloves. Not telling you how to live your life, but if you are going to pull the bearings, these will prevent misery.

1. Check the brake fluid reservoir. If it is nearly full, remove some fluid. This can be done simply by taking a clean paper towel and soaking up some fluid, then removing it. DO NOT LET BRAKE FLUID GET ON THE PAINT. Brake fluid eats paint, and this is a bad time.

Why would you do this? Well there is fluid in the caliper...you are about to push the fluid out of the caliper...guess where it has to go. Eggzactly.

2. Stick a small pry bar (usually ends up being a stout slotted screw driver) into the caliper between the brake pad and the disc. Start working the pry bar in there and prying. You'll need to do this to both pads.

3. Once there is some "play" in the brake pads, you can unbolt the caliper and remove it. As said before, get a bungee and move the caliper out of the way.

Wheel bearings and discs is where things get sporty. Depending on your level of knowledge and tools available, this can be a pain. I'm going to assume you are a novice and that you'd like for this to all be done like...quick instead of being a monkey with a football. For this, I suggest removing the hubs and having a machine shop install new wheel bearing races and the disc. Usually this runs about $25/hub. However it'll all be done in like, an hour.

4. Place an oil catch pan under the hub...because when you remove the drive flange, oil is coming out.

5. Unbolt the drive flange. Use a small pry bar to pry the flange away from the hub. This is when the oil happens. Remove the flange and axle shaft (they are attached).

6. You need the hub tool. Now you can buy the annoying rover hub tool...with the little stick...or you can go buy a 2 1/16" socket. Northern tool has these, they are like, $15. A LOT better than the crappy little crap hub tool. Use a small punch and your ball peen hammer to bend back the axle lock nut washer (oh, get a couple of these when you order replacements!!!). Then undo the first nut. Remove the axle lock nut washer. Then the second nut.

7. Remove the entire hub. BTW. A bunch of oil and other fun nasty things are going to come out. ENJOY!!

8. Take the entire hub assemblies (best to take both from both sides!) to like, a NAPA or other reputable machine shop. Get them to install the new rotors (top tip, get them to install new wheel studs while they are in there, super easy to do and then you'll have piece of mind), new bearing races, pack and install inner bearing, and the new hub seal. This basically renews your entire hub assembly quickly.

9. Clean up the spindle. Take your scotch brite (this is how I know I'm old...I'm recommending scotch brite...) and clean the spindle. Then take a bit of grease (BTW, get high performance synthetic wheel bearing grease, its like, an extra dollar and its awesome in a can) and apply it to where the hub seal will ride. This will prevent leaks.

10. Wipe down the new rotor with brake cleaner. The shop may have done this...but just do it again. Rotors have a thin film of greasy crap on them. You need to remove this.

11. Re-install hub. Then pack and install outer wheel bearing.

12. Look up how to do the hub nuts on a Dana 60 axle. That is what I do. Works just fine and easier than the convoluted rover way of tightening the hub nuts.

13. Re-install drive flange. Clean both mounting surfaces (scotch brite again, FTW) and use RTV here. Then re-torque to factory specs. YES USE A TORQUE WRENCH FOR REAL.

14. Lulz, back to brakes. Take your channel locks and push the caliper pistons back into the caliper. Remember the fluid reservoir? Yeah, be checking that to ensure it doesn't overflow.

15. On the BACK of the brake pad (the side that touches the caliper pistons), coat with anti-seize. Then install into the caliper.

16. Install the caliper onto the vehicle.

17. Once both sides are done and the wheels are installed, pump the brakes a few times. Check brake fluid in reservoir.

18. Test drive. But be careful, start slow.

19. Enjoy celebratory beverage.

Not saying this is how you should do it, I'm just saying this is how I do it.
You should do a youtube
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  #8  
Old January 6th, 2016, 11:46 AM
LR Max
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Too much cussing. Also I'm lazy so I'd do like, a 1/4th of it then walk away for 2 weeks.

Besides, who wants to see me go into my machine shop and complain about OBD3 with the guy for an hour while he presses new bearing races in.
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  #9  
Old January 6th, 2016, 12:04 PM
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Brian Jones
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Its also nice to have a Motive Brake Bleeder if your own your own. Makes flushing the lines a breeze. Always good to run fresh brake fluid.

LR Max - you are missing the Beginning Beverage and Middle Beverage.
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  #10  
Old January 6th, 2016, 12:15 PM
LR Max
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I thought the beginning and middle beverages was an unspoken constant.
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  #11  
Old January 6th, 2016, 12:29 PM
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Brian Jones
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Well Played.
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  #12  
Old January 6th, 2016, 01:40 PM
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Bill Adams
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Item 8 skips over the actual fun part of the entire process. You can do these operations on your own in the driveway, in the rain, when it is 40 degrees. After dark.
You only need to put a prybar between two studs and use the ground to brace the prybar against while you wrench the 12 point bolts loose. That's what the Rover jack handle is for: using it as a breaker bar on the end of your socket wrench. Also if the rotor is rust welded to the hub (common) don't have any sympathy for the rotor.
Knock the bearing races out with a big screwdriver. Use the old race as a buffer when driving in the new ones. They only go in one way and they will bottom out on the inside shoulder of the hub with a satisfying change in tone.
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1966 109 5 door wagon 300Tdi "spermaceti fueled"
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  #13  
Old January 8th, 2016, 02:36 PM
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Virgil Broussard
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Wow, thanks for all of the advice! Would you suggest replacing the pistons or the whole caliper?
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  #14  
Old January 8th, 2016, 02:46 PM
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Brian Jones
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Some people rebuild them. I buy the remans. Look for Cardone Rebuilds. Centric does a good job too.
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