Advice on bleeding brakes - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old May 20th, 2011, 10:01 AM
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Wade Garrett
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Advice on bleeding brakes

Hi all,

I replaced the hard brake line on the rear end last night, now I need to bleed the brakes. I read somewhere that bleeding them by opening the valve & stepping on the pedal can damage the master cylinder. Anyone know of this? Thanks!
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  #2  
Old May 20th, 2011, 10:08 AM
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Chris Snyder
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I have no idea how else you would bleed them... It's the same thing as stepping on the brakes normally.
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  #3  
Old May 20th, 2011, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ollieskins View Post
Hi all,

I replaced the hard brake line on the rear end last night, now I need to bleed the brakes. I read somewhere that bleeding them by opening the valve & stepping on the pedal can damage the master cylinder. Anyone know of this? Thanks!
Had same conversation with Trevor at Roverlab about a year ago.

He recommended a gravity bleed. It works great. I would google Gravity bleed and work your way in order from farthest caliper away from the master cyl to the closest caliper.
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  #4  
Old May 20th, 2011, 10:28 AM
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Tom Rowe
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Never heard about damaging the MC. I've never seen any damage from doing that.
I know the shop manual isn't 100% gospel, but that's one of the ways described for doing it.

x2 on starting from the caliper furthest from the MC, but that doesn't mean furthest in a straight line. It means furthest the fluid travels, which means the one on the left rear.
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  #5  
Old May 20th, 2011, 11:00 AM
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Here is the sequence that worked for me.


1. Start the engine.
2. Jam a 2x4 on the brake pedal
3. Top off the fluid
4. Crack all the valves
5. Keep filling the fluid (need about 2 bottles)... Make sure fluid level does not drop...
6. Let engine run for about 15m minutes like this
7. Tighten all valves in order (RR,LR,RF,Lf)
8. Top off fluid

I would check the manual on the sequence. Trucks may vary on Engine type NAS/ROW...
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  #6  
Old May 20th, 2011, 11:25 AM
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Hi Thomas,

Why do you have to run the engine? To heat up the engine bay to account for fluid expansion?
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  #7  
Old May 20th, 2011, 11:30 AM
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Wade Garrett
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I know this is a silly question, but do you take off the tire to access the valve easier?
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  #8  
Old May 20th, 2011, 11:58 AM
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Tom Rowe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
Here is the sequence that worked for me.
I'm surprised that works for you.
Opening a line then wedging the brake pedal all the way down is the way to minimize fluid loss. You only loose one pedal stroke's worth.
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  #9  
Old May 20th, 2011, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
Here is the sequence that worked for me.
1. Start the engine.
2. Jam a 2x4 on the brake pedal
3. Top off the fluid
4. Crack all the valves
5. Keep filling the fluid (need about 2 bottles)... Make sure fluid level does not drop...
6. Let engine run for about 15m minutes like this
7. Tighten all valves in order (RR,LR,RF,Lf)
8. Top off fluid
Not sure how this method makes sense. The engine and the brakes are not related. This will only work if all lines are free and can flow by gravity. This does not always work.

Either do it the "normal" way. One person pushes the pedal and a second bleeds during the down stroke or get a pressure bleeder.
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  #10  
Old May 20th, 2011, 12:33 PM
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steve
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Buy a power bleeder. You will never go back.
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  #11  
Old May 20th, 2011, 12:33 PM
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You could also invest in the newish brake bleeding tech called "Phoneix" something something. Suppose to work by letting all the bubbles go up instead of down and out through the nipple by the brake itself.
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  #12  
Old May 20th, 2011, 12:39 PM
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correct way of bleeding brakes,
1- top off fluid
2- have a second person pump the pedal 5 to 10 times slowly.
3- open the bleeder farthest away from the master cylinder.
4- repeat 2 and 3 until all air is evacuated from bleeder
5- repeat procedure an each wheel working your self from farthest to closest and a firm pedal is achieved.
on older brake master cylinders damage to seals may occur from bottom out due to prolonged periods of not flushing brake fluid, brake fluid is hydrostatic and if not flushed once a year it will rust and cause pitting in cylinder walls specially at the vary ends.
the pedal bottoms out and the seals go past this pitting and become damaged, a firm pedal will be difficult to achieve and if you keep your foot on the pedal you will feel it loose pressure, thus you may end up needing a master cylinder.
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  #13  
Old May 20th, 2011, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDSUX View Post
Hi Thomas,

Why do you have to run the engine? To heat up the engine bay to account for fluid expansion?

Not sure. What I do know is that the process works.

------ Follow up post added May 20th, 2011 12:52 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by ollieskins View Post
I know this is a silly question, but do you take off the tire to access the valve easier?

It is not needed. On the fronts just turn the wheels to access them. Make sure clean up the mess. the question you asked about how do bleed brakes is like asking 10 grandma's how to make chicken soup.
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  #14  
Old May 21st, 2011, 08:13 AM
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Wade Garrett
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Thanks for the advice guys. I bled the rear brakes & the pedal is firm. At speeds though, the pedal is not smooth, it is jumpy, it seems like every revolution of the wheel, it kicks back. Any thoughts? Perhaps this will be eliminated if I bleed all the brakes?
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  #15  
Old May 21st, 2011, 08:42 AM
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Warped rotor. Nothing to do with hydraulics.
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  #16  
Old May 21st, 2011, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ollieskins View Post
.....At speeds though, the pedal is not smooth, it is jumpy, it seems like every revolution of the wheel, it kicks back. Any thoughts? Perhaps this will be eliminated if I bleed all the brakes?

Hope it's not your rotors. Did it do that before bleeding the brakes?

Looks like we typed at the same time John.
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  #17  
Old May 21st, 2011, 08:51 AM
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No, before I replaced the brake line, the braking was totally smooth.
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  #18  
Old May 21st, 2011, 05:50 PM
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I've got a power bleeder if you want to borrow it. Simple and ALWAYS works
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  #19  
Old March 18th, 2012, 07:06 PM
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I just replaced the 110's front calipers and rotors , bought the Motive power bleeder, I have bleed the lines 3 times and still have a soft pedal ( have to pump it 3 or 4 times to get it firm. The early 1983-1985 Land Rover work shop manual. says to "bleed the front caliper closest to the master cylinder, then the other front brake, then each rear brake in turn" ( this is opposite of the way I have always done it ( farthest first) but at this point I have done it both ways and still cant get a firm pedal any ideas ?
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  #20  
Old March 18th, 2012, 08:03 PM
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Sounds like you have an air leak?
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