Advance tdi timing... wow - Page 3 - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #41  
Old December 9th, 2012, 08:34 PM
Red90's Avatar
Red90
Status: Offline
John B.
1991 Defender 90, 200TDI
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Calgary
Posts: 9,242
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manimal View Post
You mentioned a plunger lift of 1.6MM but nothing about where or how to adjust it. How is that done?.
I'm too lazy to look for you, but I'm sure it is up in this thread. You use an adapter with a dial indicator on the end of the pump to measure plunger lift. It is more accurate that the pin method.
__________________
Pissing people off on the "net" since 1983.

Land Rover. Turning owners into mechanics since 1948.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #42  
Old December 9th, 2012, 10:46 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
I've combed the thread. It has been mentioned but no description on how it's done. So the dial with adapter goes into the same hole as timing pin?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post

I'm too lazy to look for you, but I'm sure it is up in this thread. You use an adapter with a dial indicator on the end of the pump to measure plunger lift. It is more accurate that the pin method.
__________________
Land Rovers. A loosely associated collection of parts, generally traveling in the same direction.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old December 9th, 2012, 11:08 PM
Red90's Avatar
Red90
Status: Offline
John B.
1991 Defender 90, 200TDI
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Calgary
Posts: 9,242
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manimal View Post
I've combed the thread. It has been mentioned but no description on how it's done. So the dial with adapter goes into the same hole as timing pin?
No. It goes into the pump itself from the other end. Google Bosch VE timing and read up on it.
__________________
Pissing people off on the "net" since 1983.

Land Rover. Turning owners into mechanics since 1948.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #44  
Old December 30th, 2012, 10:25 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
I finally got to making another round of adjustments and I think I found the sweet spot. I still have black smoke puff at start up and had some blue smoke when cold but it went away after the test drive. It seems more snappy now and no noticeable excessive knocking whether at idle or while driving.

It appears a very small advancement did the trick for me. I reset the timing again and used the timing pin which is 9.39MM. I replaced it with a 9.15MM drill bit so only a very minute (if at all) advancement.
__________________
Land Rovers. A loosely associated collection of parts, generally traveling in the same direction.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old March 2nd, 2013, 02:38 PM
navydevildoc's Avatar
navydevildoc
Status: Offline
Neill Thornton
1984 D90 300 Tdi / 1965 Series IIA
Site Team
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,586
Registry
OK gents, I decided to try this out since my motor seems to be running OK for the moment.

I have the normal timing pin in, loosen the three bolts, and put in the smaller drill bit. However when I go to turn the pump nut it really won't move. The three bolts are loose enough that I can twist them with my fingers, so I don't think that's it. I can't turn it enough to even make the bit snug.

How easy was it for you guys to turn the nut? I don't want to get a breaker bar on there and heave over and then snap something.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old March 2nd, 2013, 09:46 PM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
You won't snap anything with the breaker bar. You need a breaker bar to get enough force just be gentle with it and increase force gradually. You're not just turning the nut, the whole pump pulley will rotate along with the nut. Push with breaker bar counter clockwise until it touches the smaller drill bit. Hold it in place as you tighten the tree bolts. Mine took several (small) adjustments to get it just right.
__________________
Land Rovers. A loosely associated collection of parts, generally traveling in the same direction.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old March 2nd, 2013, 11:33 PM
navydevildoc's Avatar
navydevildoc
Status: Offline
Neill Thornton
1984 D90 300 Tdi / 1965 Series IIA
Site Team
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,586
Registry
Carl.... Counter-Clockwise? I have been trying to move it clockwise. I think I am actually up against the end of the adjuster window of the bolts on the pulley.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old March 3rd, 2013, 12:00 AM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
Sorry. Clockwise.
__________________
Land Rovers. A loosely associated collection of parts, generally traveling in the same direction.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old March 3rd, 2013, 01:14 AM
Manimal's Avatar
Manimal
Status: Offline
Carl Jonsson
1995 NAS D90 #219
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 3,236
You shouldn't be. What if you reset it and start over? There should be a way to reset/re-align the adjustment window. See my previous posts.
__________________
Land Rovers. A loosely associated collection of parts, generally traveling in the same direction.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old March 3rd, 2013, 10:07 AM
rdavisinva's Avatar
rdavisinva
Status: Offline
Robert Davis
N/A
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 6,798
Question for Steve... White smoke?

Steve:
Do you know if your fuel had been turned up from factory settings to start with?

We had a 300TDI 110 in the shop last summer that the owner changed the timing belt on and at the same time turned his fuel up. He had the white smoke issue. It was a Disco engine with that extra linkage on the side of the pump. There was a steady fuel leak behind this linkage.

After addressing the leak with new O-rings and having the leak stop and start again, we ended up swapping out the pump. Afterwards, the white smoke was gone. I suspected all along the timing was retarded, but the owner was in a hurry to get back on the road. We did not "adjust" the timing, bit noticed that the replacement pump was not full of fuel so it didn't have that tendency to resist and snap like one full of fuel. So it made setting the pump according to the timing pins easier. Do you think getting all the fuel out of the IP would effect your timing process? make it easier?
__________________
RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old June 21st, 2013, 01:26 PM
D90user's Avatar
D90user
Status: Offline
steve
109/110 ambulance-55 series I
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,447
Hi Rob,
Apologies for the months long delay... just saw this while re reading threads.

I have messed with my fueling previously but I have tried to turning it back down with no change in smoke... I'll try again though.

I'm not quite sure what your getting at with the IP full of fuel.... but I'm interested because my smoke is back.

I'm going to start another thread to hopefully sort this out.
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old September 9th, 2013, 10:43 AM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
For those attempting to use the timing dial gauge (which I am) on the 2.8 TGV IP, per M&D, here is the plunger spec:

"The correct target lift on the 2.8 motor is 1.44mm.
other than the different setting, the procedure is the same as on 300Tdi."
__________________
Mark Kellgren
KM4BOR

ISIL and al qaeda can go F*ck themselves...
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old September 9th, 2013, 12:57 PM
TDI Guy's Avatar
TDI Guy
Status: Offline
Randy
2015 LR4
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: NJ
Posts: 4,573
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
For those attempting to use the timing dial gauge (which I am) on the 2.8 TGV IP, per M&D, here is the plunger spec:

"The correct target lift on the 2.8 motor is 1.44mm.
other than the different setting, the procedure is the same as on 300Tdi."
Good to know. Did they say this will make a significant increase in power?

Now add an intercooler upgrade and you are all set

If anyone is in the market for an intercooler upgrade, please shoot me a pm. I have an order coming in

Randy
__________________
Legend in My Own Mind.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old September 9th, 2013, 01:00 PM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by TDI Guy View Post
Good to know. Did they say this will make a significant increase in power?

Now add an intercooler upgrade and you are all set

If anyone is in the market for an intercooler upgrade, please shoot me a pm. I have an order coming in

Randy
That's the spec for the engine, just like the 1.54mm for the 300 TDI. They also said the timing pin in 9.5mm, just like the 300 TDI. they actually just use a 9.5 drill bit in their shop.

If I didn't mention it elsewhere, the flywheel locking pin hole is threaded differently from the 300 TDI. I'll post the thread size here this week. I had to remove the flywheel access bolt, get another bolt, drill a hole through it, and use that with a drill bit to actually lock the flywheel on mine. Not sure why International didn't just go with the 300 TDI bellhousing style locking pin and location. It's so much more convenient.
__________________
Mark Kellgren
KM4BOR

ISIL and al qaeda can go F*ck themselves...
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old April 10th, 2014, 01:48 PM
aosias's Avatar
aosias
Status: Offline
Alexandra
1995 D90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 1,348
Registry
I am going to try and adjust my timing. I have white smoke when idling with a cold engine and on downhills.

Question- I have AC and there is a pulley over the inspection plate. Do I need to remove this plate/pulley to get to the 3 bolts or did this replace that and I need to put a 9 mm bit in the square hole, loosen the bolts, adjust timing and then tighten the 3 bolts?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_4853.jpg
Views:	116
Size:	85.7 KB
ID:	92805  
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old April 10th, 2014, 02:40 PM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
yes. step 1 is to remove that pulley. you need to anyway, because your crank turns twice for every one turn of the IP. so after you pull off that AC 0pulley, get an adjustable wrench out, grab your dognut and turn til the flywheel is lined up on TDC. you would expect to see the ip pulley timing hole on top. if it's on the bottom, then go around again til it's on top. of course, you 300tdi guys have a more convenient flywheel lock hole on the bottom than us 2.8 guys.

once crank and IP are on TDC, that when you loosent the 3 bolts and check with your timing pin, and adjust as necessary. NEVER go counterclockwise on the IP hub nut to adjust the pin and timing. rarely will you ever need to. If that IP nut ever came loose, you'll have to pull the IP and take it to a Bosch shop to have the hub realigned.

almost always, the IP will be retarded when it's out of time, which means you have to turn the IP nut slightly clockwise to get the pin in. no risk of loosening the nut in that direction.

------ Follow up post added April 10th, 2014 02:40 PM ------

ac pulley bolts are 13mm, and the IP pulley nuts are 10mm.
__________________
Mark Kellgren
KM4BOR

ISIL and al qaeda can go F*ck themselves...
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old April 10th, 2014, 03:59 PM
aosias's Avatar
aosias
Status: Offline
Alexandra
1995 D90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 1,348
Registry
where is the dognut? Do I need to worry about cranking on that- like will it start the motor with my hands in there?

Also- I see the arrow for TDC, but I can't seem to see the notch in the pulley to line it up. The YouTube video I was consulting doesn't make it very clear either.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old April 10th, 2014, 04:22 PM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
the "dognut" is the nut on the crankshaft. you aren't going to break that loose on your own. no chance the engine will start with the fuel stop solenoid off. When I am lining up TDC, I just use an open ended monkey wrench on the dog nut and turn it clockwise. I put yellow painted marks on the harmonic balancer so I can visually see when I'm TDC, to make it easier to lock the flywheel.

you need to have a flywheel locking tool, that inserts in the bottom of the flywheel housing. I assume you have that? Tools required are the timing pin and the flywheel locking tool.

------ Follow up post added April 10th, 2014 04:24 PM ------

the only reason to use the mark on the harmonic balancer is to make it easy to get the flywheel locked in TDC. if you can't see the mark on the balancer, then you'll have to look in the hole for the flywheel locking tool and look for the notch, and you can't look in the hole and turn the dognut yourself.
__________________
Mark Kellgren
KM4BOR

ISIL and al qaeda can go F*ck themselves...
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old April 10th, 2014, 06:24 PM
aosias's Avatar
aosias
Status: Offline
Alexandra
1995 D90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 1,348
Registry
Sadly I am not prepared. I do not have a flywheel locking pin or timing pin. Was planning on a 9 mm drill bit. Ideas on where to source these tools locally or a cross reference to something in the US?
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old April 10th, 2014, 06:32 PM
tjfslaughter's Avatar
tjfslaughter
Status: Offline
thomas
Burbon
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 4,563
Quote:
Originally Posted by aosias View Post
Sadly I am not prepared. I do not have a flywheel locking pin or timing pin. Was planning on a 9 mm drill bit. Ideas on where to source these tools locally or a cross reference to something in the US?
Check rovahfarm.
__________________
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions

Tags
tdi

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
200 tdi timing question snowkistdynasty Defender Technical Discussions 4 December 23rd, 2010 11:32 AM
300 TDI timing belt tensioner sundogcwolfe Defender Technical Discussions 7 December 15th, 2009 12:20 AM
300 Tdi Timing Belt Question moose Defender Technical Discussions 11 January 22nd, 2008 03:58 PM
300 Tdi timing belt install roverboy Defender Technical Discussions 2 March 9th, 2006 04:44 PM
1995 SW 300 Tdi neo812 For Sale - Vehicles 6 July 31st, 2005 04:55 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:58 AM.


Copyright