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  #21  
Old October 12th, 2009, 04:47 PM
Tyler Wirken
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Tyler Wirken
1997 Defender 90 LE
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On 97's the abs rings on the cv's and on the rear hubs are indeed rough road sensors. I was told they are only on there to prevent the check engine light from illuminating while off roading. The 4.0 engines have many more sensors than the 3.9's. When the truck is offroad the engine will have minor miss fires and hicups thus triggering the check engine light. So the rough road sensors sense a difference in wheel speed and tell a little computer to ignore the minor engine faults and therefore not illuminating the check engine light for the duration it is off road.

Pretty silly to me as the reason I know this is the computer on mine got wet, thus turning on the check engine light! So the dealer told me years ago to ignore it. So in essence it is useless.

I agree that I would not even bother trying to put abs on a defender.
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  #22  
Old October 13th, 2009, 08:22 AM
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Sterling M Archer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij
Because rover is retarded.
Ron, will you mind if I use your quote???

Peter, thanks for the refresher in breaking. You are right about the difficulty in using the technique in panic situations.

I have BFG ATs, but they do not stop as well as I would like.
I guess I will forgo the ABS idea for now because it would be cheaper and easier to buy an old RR.

Jim, I use ABS in our other cars more than I would like to admit!
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  #23  
Old October 13th, 2009, 08:30 AM
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ECR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_Winningham
I guess I will forgo the ABS idea for now because it would be cheaper and easier to buy an old RR.
Oh yeah it would.
We are doing ABS in a NAS 110 right now and I can tell you it is not worth it, IMO. Warned the customer in advance but his wife wanted it and that was the only way he could get the truck. It'll be on the site in a few weeks. Its a NAS 110 going Willow Green, ABS, etc.
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  #24  
Old October 13th, 2009, 09:45 AM
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bart
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the po replaced the tires on mine with original Michelin X tube tires (maybe the only man that did that). but he did put a rear disk brake kit on it. he said it greatly improved things.

i havent locked them up once.
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  #25  
Old October 13th, 2009, 10:14 AM
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Peter Stolz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zimm
the po replaced the tires on mine with original Michelin X tube tires (maybe the only man that did that). but he did put a rear disk brake kit on it. he said it greatly improved things.

i havent locked them up once.
Hey Bart,
That tells you two things: first, you're looking well down the road and not getting surprised by anything. But, it also tells you that you haven't pushed them hard enough to know how hard you can push them. In other words, you don't know how hard you can push to GET lock up. Maximum brake efficiency (called threshold braking because we're on the threshold of lock up) is just before the point of lock up. In an emergency stop, we need to have an idea of what kind of pedal pressure is possible in order to stop the truck ASAP.

Maybe you meant that you haven't locked them up in an actual emergency situation, but if not, go out in a big parking lot and practice it a few times. Don't JAM on the brakes or you'll get lock up before the weight is transferred to the front. It's still fairly quick, but not a stab. Then push hard enough to get lock up. When you do, modulate off that brake JUST ENOUGH to get the fronts rolling again, but still keeping the nose of the truck down.

The hardest part (and most important thing we do as drivers) is using our eyes properly. Sounds like you're doing a good job with that. The braking thing does take some practice to get the feel of the weight transfer, but you could save a kid's life.

I am available for personal engagements, bachelor/bachelorette parties, weddings, bar mitzvahas, etc.
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  #26  
Old October 13th, 2009, 11:19 AM
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Scott
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peachyracer

I am available for personal engagements, bachelor/bachelorette parties, weddings, bar mitzvahas, etc.
I was just going to ask if you were a driving instructor... Or if you worked at Midas.

Very helpful info...
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  #27  
Old October 13th, 2009, 12:14 PM
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Dave Lucas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ECR
We are doing ABS in a NAS 110 right now and I can tell you it is not worth it, IMO
Mike, are you adding traction control as well?
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  #28  
Old October 13th, 2009, 01:16 PM
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bart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peachyracer
Hey Bart,
That tells you two things: first, you're looking well down the road and not getting surprised by anything. But, it also tells you that you haven't pushed them hard enough to know how hard you can push them. In other words, you don't know how hard you can push to GET lock up.
how the heck did you get this from a quick point i made about disk/disk vs disk/drum?
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  #29  
Old October 13th, 2009, 01:31 PM
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The wheel sensors in the 1997's are so thet the OBDII computer could differintiate engine fuel knock from unequal off road wheel spin and jarring. I don't know if you could "share " the sensors with an ABS unit or not. I doubt the Disco's have separate sensors for off roading and another for the ABS system.
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  #30  
Old October 13th, 2009, 02:53 PM
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Peter Stolz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zimm
how the heck did you get this from a quick point i made about disk/disk vs disk/drum?
I should have clipped the quote down, but it was because you said you haven't locked 'em up once. That's the part that tell us the good and the possibly not-so-good things I was talking about. It reminded me of something my boss said once. He said, "I have mixed emotions about that. It's like seeing your teenage daughter come home with a Gideon Bible."
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  #31  
Old October 13th, 2009, 03:51 PM
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Charles Galpin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimC
I want to add crumple zones.
Easy. I'll bring my sawsall next time I come up and we'll make a few well placed cuts
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  #32  
Old October 13th, 2009, 09:32 PM
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Ian Gregory
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I am not sure this would be that difficult on a 97 given that you had the right parts. The rough road system on a 97 D90 and the ABS system on a 96-99 D1 are pretty much the same except that the modulator is missing on the 90. I haven't checked the part #s but the ECU under the 90 pass seat looks exactly the same as a D1 ABS ECU.

I woud hazard a guess that if you sourced a modulator and the ECUs are the same, then you woud just need to mount and tie the modulator into the brake lines and add the wiring from the ECU to the Modulator. If the ECUs are different (90 has the outputs disabled maybe) then you would need one of them as well.

The disco has exactly the same problem as the 90 with respect to the knock sensors so the ABS system acts as the rough road system as well. The tie in to the GEMS ECU is the same for both, for the same reason.

Suggest you do a little research with the circuit diagrams for the D1 and the 90 and check some part #s, but I don't think its going to be that difficult as the worst parts of the system are already in place in the hubs. D1 ABS parts should be readily available.

Woudn't do it myself as ABS is a PITA off road but if you drive mostly on road in slippery conditions then it would be handy I guess. Or you coud save the money and practice cadence braking as others have suggested...

HTH

Ian

Follow-up Post:

Whoops, just relized the OP has a 110. Thought he had a 97 D90 for some reason. Scratch everything I said above. It's a PITA to do.....
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