'97 no power upon acceleration, backfire at intake - Page 3 - Defender Source
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  #41  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 07:00 PM
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mike hall
'97 alpine white sw # 0127
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that would be fantastic Jake! just let me know. i'll hold off on pulling the trigger on the other one. AEL I believe, little canister on the frame below the fuel fill.
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  #42  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 07:22 PM
psykokid
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Have you changed out the VSS that you ordered yet? My friend that works at the dealership said that he read your thread and it sounds to him like the VSS is the culprit. They get filled up with oil and no longer read correctly and since the VSS, CKPS and CMPS all figure into the amount of fuel that gets delivered. If one of the items in that chain is fubard then you get rough running..
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  #43  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 07:33 PM
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mike hall
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VSS hasn't arrived yet, should get it by the time I pick up the truck on Friday.
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  #44  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 07:56 PM
psykokid
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Change out the VSS first, and if that isn't the problem I'll ship you an ecu to try out. It does look like your ECU has been changed out at some point. The other # you referenced on your ECU, 80772A, on the stock ERR6937 97 Defender ECU should be 80742A
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  #45  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 10:45 PM
Departing90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psykokid View Post
CKPS and CMPS all figure into the amount of fuel that gets delivered. If one of the items in that chain is fubard then you get rough running..
The misinformation in this thread is perplexing. The CMPS & CRPS do not regulate fuel delivery. What they do is to send a signal to the ECU to indicate the position of the crankshaft & camshaft for firing purposes only. The signals are used by the ECU to set ignition timing, supply the RPM rate and determine engine speed. Thats all they do. A faulty CMPS or CRPS will exhibit the same symptoms at all RPMs and not only at higher RPMs and they do not cause backfires!

OP,
I posted up earlier about an electrical enomoly in the ECU prohibiting the coils from firing. The culprits are either one or both of the O2 sensors. Disconnect them from the harness to confirm.
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  #46  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:11 AM
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Nathan Garnand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Departing90 View Post
The misinformation in this thread is perplexing. The CMPS & CRPS do not regulate fuel delivery. What they do is to send a signal to the ECU to indicate the position of the crankshaft & camshaft for firing purposes only. The signals are used by the ECU to set ignition timing, supply the RPM rate and determine engine speed. Thats all they do. A faulty CMPS or CRPS will exhibit the same symptoms at all RPMs and not only at higher RPMs and they do not cause backfires!

This is correct about what those sensors do.


OP,
I posted up earlier about an electrical enomoly in the ECU prohibiting the coils from firing. The culprits are either one or both of the O2 sensors. Disconnect them from the harness to confirm.
A faulty O2 sensor or faulty O2 sensors on a GEMS do not change the driveabilty at all. You will only notice they have failed when the check engine light comes on. Thats it.

Has the OP tested fuel pressure again after new pump was installed? No such thing as a good new part.

And change the VSS. You need it anyway. Then test drive it and report back.
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  #47  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:50 AM
Departing90
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Sasha
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSGINC View Post
A faulty O2 sensor or faulty O2 sensors on a GEMS do not change the driveabilty at all. You will only notice they have failed when the check engine light comes on. Thats it.
Thats why its an "anomaly"!
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  #48  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 02:26 AM
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Nathan Garnand
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GEMS Generic engine management system. It was well behind other manufacturers OBD2 systems. It was the best land rover could do when BMW bought them. It is simple and fairly robust. An O2 sensor or all of them don't cause it not to accelerate. The OP has a fuel, VSS, or an computer problem.

Coils or hoses with holes will create faults. Misfires and lean faults. It good to look there first. But that's not it.
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  #49  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 02:45 AM
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Chris
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Humor me on basic suggestions but I'm a check cheap stuff first.
Are the battery and alt ok. Crazy or bad voltages do a number on these trucks
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #50  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 04:05 AM
psykokid
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Jake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Departing90 View Post
The CMPS & CRPS do not regulate fuel delivery.
In my post I didn't say that they regulated fuel delivery. I said they work into the whole grand scheme of spark + fuel = boom.. If something in that chain isn't happy then either no boom or partial/weak boom..

ANYHOW.. I've checked my spares and I've got one that should suit. ERR6738. Lets see how the VSS plays out and go from there.

Also, when you get the truck back, check your grounds. I've see wonky grounds cause all sorts of funky behaviour.
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  #51  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 06:15 AM
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mike hall
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I did check the fuel pressure at the rail after I changed the pump, don't recall the exact #,~ 42 psi w/ a cheapo HF gauge, seems to come to mind.


I also pulled the new o2 sensors, put the old ones back in, then swapped 'em back. no change.


haven't checked the alternator, had it rebuilt a couple of years back, battery is probably a year old Sears Platinum. i'll check 'em both.
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  #52  
Old July 27th, 2015, 05:04 PM
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mike hall
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just changed the vss, no improvement and now the speedo isn't picking up. may not be seated correctly. as soon as the exhaust cools, i'll back it out and try and reseat it. on another note, throwing a code now, p1314, i'm assuming due to the mechanic cutting out the cats.
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  #53  
Old July 28th, 2015, 11:23 AM
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mike hall
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update- pulled the new vss back out and reseated it, speedo is working again and the truck seems to be running better. able to rev up the motor in park without it cutting out(ran it up to about 3000 rpm). ran it down the road and it struggles right before the auto shifts gears. once it shifts, it smooth's out. progress!! thanks all
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  #54  
Old July 28th, 2015, 12:21 PM
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Thanks for keep us posted. I drive a 97 on daily basis and suspect I'll eventually need assistance.
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  #55  
Old July 28th, 2015, 12:46 PM
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mike hall
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ordered new cats/y pipe. not sure it's contributing to the issue, but I wouldn't think it would run properly without them. looks like it'll be a week or so before they get here and I can get 'em in.
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  #56  
Old July 28th, 2015, 06:55 PM
alnaimi50
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Khaled
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Hi, I'm from United Arab Emirates, I'm having Defender D90 1997 NAS, and I dad similar problem but only when I drive it for more than 15 minutes and got hot. It mad me crazy.
I changed the fuel pump and the IACV ( Idle Air Control Valve Stepper Motoring ) in the front , beside the side of the throttle body ( next to Throttle Positioning Sensor ) and every thing got solved.
So could be the IACV ?. Did you replace it. As mine was very dirty.
Have all the good luck to solve your issue.
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  #57  
Old August 4th, 2015, 07:36 PM
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mike hall
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eastern catalytic 40469 from rockauto

Anyone have any experience installing this y-pipe in a '97? mine came in, the bungs for the o2 sensors are 18mm and should be 12mm x 1.25. contacted both the seller and the manufacturer and received the following responses:


I called Eastern about this. They said you will need to change your O2 sensors to the larger 18mm size instead of 12mm. The manufacturer changed the size of these sensors, so Eastern followed suit and created a cat converter that would accommodate them.

Thanks,

RockAuto



Eastern Catalytic


Mr. Hall,


Thank you for your interest in Eastern. Our #40469 was fitted to a similar vehicle, Eastern does not deviate from OE specifications. Check your O2 sensors, maybe you removed a fitting that you didnít realize.


Luis


So today I decided to fit up the y-pipes and in the mean time attempt to locate some 18mm to 12mm adapters for the bungs. I was unable to get the dang thing to fit up(several interference issues). I grabbed the old unit and had it back in in a just a minute. Just thought I would check and see if anyone has installed 40469 in a '97 truck before I went through the hassle of sending this back. Also wanted to say, I appreciate Defender source member "Rock Auto" for the response.
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  #58  
Old August 4th, 2015, 10:41 PM
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Nathan Garnand
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Gems sensors are larger than cux. Are your 02 sensor connectors colored with orange and gray? You may have multiple problems due to your land rover being in shops that know nothing about them. You may have to work through the faults they installed before your vehicle is running correctly.
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  #59  
Old August 4th, 2015, 11:57 PM
Departing90
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Helicoil it. Double up if you have to. Use green thread locker between the helicoils and y pipe. Use anti seize for O2 sensors. Boom!
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  #60  
Old August 5th, 2015, 12:37 AM
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Nathan Garnand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Departing90 View Post
Helicoil it. Double up if you have to. Use green thread locker between the helicoils and y pipe. Use anti seize for O2 sensors. Boom!
This guy must hate you.
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