95 D90 fuel pump - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old August 6th, 2012, 02:10 PM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
95 D90 fuel pump

Been struggling with dying or just not starting. Had been sitting up a few months for a dash and bulkhead restration and since then has been a paragon of unreliability.

Yesterday at part warmed-up it died at 40 mph and wouldn't fire one lick while coasting down. Once stopped I tried several restarts cyling the key looking for fuel pressure. REalys are new and clik in and out correctly. At one point it cranked to about 200 rpm which I could mainatin by massaging the throttle but it would not really run.

Three hours later it started and drove home- jsut as the wreker pulled up of course. I am ceratin now that the fuel pump was not running when I tried and failed repeatedly. I could hear the pump run when it did start so I am sure it was fuel starved.

Yes, the fuel pump was replaced about 300 miles ago.

The "search- fuel pump" shows as often as not the pump wasn't bad but the "wiring/realted" caused the problem.
  1. What wiring would stop it from running and
  2. is the ecu invloved?
Advice always appreciated. js
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old August 6th, 2012, 02:16 PM
rijosho's Avatar
rijosho
Status: Offline
Joshua
1995 Black ST - Rhinolined edition
Research Assistant/Eagle Eyes
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 16,557
Registry
So you've checked your spark strength, etc.? How old is the coil?

Doubt it's your fuel pump.

Search more for "running rough" "died warm" "dies hot" things like that.
__________________
Quote:
I am talking purely from an aesthetics standpoint.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old August 6th, 2012, 02:29 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Sounds like an ignition module to me.
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old August 6th, 2012, 04:26 PM
Rocky's Avatar
Rocky
Status: Offline
Chris
72 + D1 drivetrain
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colonies Aka Boston
Posts: 8,771
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij
Sounds like an ignition module to me.
Ignition related given the description. Common for coils to fail when hot as you describe. I'd drop a new one in.
__________________
A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old August 6th, 2012, 06:25 PM
leastonce's Avatar
leastonce
Status: Offline
Jason England
D-90 White 95 SW #65
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 6,078
Registry
fuel filter ...

Or just change random parts until you hopefully find something wrong ...
__________________
Quote:
Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
Car Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Cat Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old August 6th, 2012, 07:48 PM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
Coil new. I can't find ecu but would be glad to invest to eliminate.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old August 6th, 2012, 08:14 PM
Grover's Avatar
Grover
Status: Offline
Mike
Birmabright Bread Box/Swagger Wagon
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 1,856
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by red&yellowrovers View Post
Coil new. I can't find ecu but would be glad to invest to eliminate.
Ecu is under the ps seat.
Also, check all wire connections going to/from the dizzy, ignition mod and the coil.
They can work themselves loose.
I had similar problems...ended up being the ign mod.
Good luck
Cheers...
__________________
LR3 sidesteps with rocker panels for sale $400


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old August 7th, 2012, 09:38 AM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
Just put in new distributor with built-in ignition amplifier from D&D Fab. New coil same time. I was able to document with certainty the fuel pump at times does not run. It is new (very few miles) so I suspect either wiring to the pump is hinky or whatever controls the fuel pump is haywire.

It had blown a fuse on the fuel pump before I bought it- burned termianls in the fuse block. This is not however a fuse problem since it died running and then restarted without the fuse being replaced.

Does anyone have a control diagram for the fuel pump? I assume it repsonds to the fuel pressure regulator (one part I have not yet replaced) and the electrical relays. Does it respond to the ecu as well?

Thanks as always.

js
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old August 13th, 2012, 09:39 PM
bhtaco21
Status: Offline
Butch Hamlet
95 NAS Defender 90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Martinsville,VA
Posts: 22
My intermittent fuel pump issue was due to the electrical connector at the top of the fuel tank. The connector snaps in to the pump connector, and mine was not positively connected. Pain to get to because you need to drop the tank down to see it. One alternative is to cut a hole in the bed directly above the pump and then it is easy to check and easy to replace the pump and sender. Good luck. Intermittent issues are soooo frustrating.
Butch
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old August 15th, 2012, 06:15 PM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
Thanks Butch, did you cut the hole and if so could you locate it for me? js
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old August 15th, 2012, 09:30 PM
Capt Milks's Avatar
Capt Milks
Status: Offline
Mike
Defender V-8, Defender 2.25
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1,798
Have you checked the connections on the Inertia switch on the engine side bulkhead? the diagram for the fuel pump relay is ETM A1 in RAV. I did a search the other day and found the whole electrical wiring diagram but didn't keep the link.
__________________
Land Rover 110
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old August 15th, 2012, 09:36 PM
bhtaco21
Status: Offline
Butch Hamlet
95 NAS Defender 90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Martinsville,VA
Posts: 22
Joe,
I didn't cut the hole, but the next time I have to access the pump/sender/connector I probably will cut the hole. Will Tillery (Rover Guy) knows the exact location measurement, but I didn't write it down.

Good luck.
Butch
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old August 18th, 2012, 11:41 AM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
I can wiggle the wiring everywhere under the hood when it runs without anything dying. In cldues the inertia switch. I was surprised I could even disconnnect the coolant temp sensor and it didn't die. I thougth that sensor had a role in fuel delivery but apparently not at idle. Of course it may not have been fully up to temp.

I shipped off the ecu yesterday to be bench tested and repaired if required. I will also probably take the fuel tank out to check all the 1 year old work. I have been doing some extensive cleaing an de-rusting anyway (did the dash and bulkhead last winter) and that is a good place to attack.

While I paid $1k for the new fuel pump the guy had to deal with the rusted fasteners so I should have it easier this time.

So with the fuel pump wiring and piping verified and the ecu tested I will be looking at various senors I suppose if problem remains.

Anyone tell me how to measure voltage to the fuel injectors?

Thanks for the input. js
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old August 18th, 2012, 12:16 PM
the rover shop
Status: Offline
shayne young
89,93 & 95 camel trophy 110s 06 130
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ft lauderdale florida
Posts: 5,225
Okay.. disconnecting the coolant temp sensor is not going to make the engine die...it's an NTC (negative temperature coefficient resistor..) meaning the hotter it gets the less the resistance.. so when disconnected it appears full resistance and goes to full rich on the injection..i.e.cold start..may cause check engine light for open cicuit cooalnt temp but wont kill the engine..fuel pressure regulator is mechanical and has no control over anything other than keeping fuel pressure at 35-40, the vacuum line is only there to allow fuel pressure to rise approx 5 psi under acceleration... injectors are 12 volts but have a constant positive fed to them and the ECU does the grounding and based on coolant temp and engine rpm millisecond duration is adjusted...If I recall correctly the main relay supplies power to the injectors and the fuel pump relay but the relay is switched via ecu...if you cant find the wiring diagram I can pull it up and e-mail it to you..keep a can of starting fluid with you..when it dies if you spray starting fluid in the air cleaner and it fires for a moment and then dies you know its getting spark but no fuel, you are going to have to start narrowing it down in order to diagnose accurately..once again when it dies pull the coil wire out of the distributor cap and rest it close to the engine or body, anywhere metal..about a 1/4 inch air gap and crank the engine over..if you get a nice crisp blue spark you have plenty of coil power and verifies all of your ignition system...I have seen the ignition rotor give problems before where they allow the spark to go through to the distributor shaft..its cheap, replace it if you havent already.. you should have a schrader valve fitting on the side of your fuel rail, connect a fuel guage to that and tape it to the w/screen and drive the car..once it startsa acting up see what your fuel pressure is...it should be about 35-40 PSI...if it drops off then you are getting a fuel delivery issue... bench testing an ECU rarely finds an intermittent issue, they test it and it tests fine because it isn't playing up at the moment in time, different temperature, load, vibrations, etc etc..
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old August 20th, 2012, 12:35 PM
red&yellowrovers's Avatar
red&yellowrovers
Status: Offline
Joe Still
95 D90 NAS 3.9l ST AA Yellow #2719
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 86
TRShop, Lots of useful info, especially the insight into the mechanics of operation.

I am going to mount the fuel pressure gage as you suggest. I have not seen the schrader valve but have no doubt it is there somewhere.

Do you have a single operator method for checking for fire? I can't really crank and hold the coil wire near ground at the same time effectively.

I do have a new distributor with built in amplifier along with a new coil. I've tried the starting fluid looking for what you suggest and it will carnk a little faster but not fire. Also there is no fuel smell from the exhaust after cranking.

I started pulling the fuel tank this weekend but its full of fuel and I need to drain it so I can handle it.

Thanks again!! js
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Defender & Series Technical Discussions > Defender Technical Discussions

Tags
90, 95, d90, fuel

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS D90 EFI fuel pump ECR For Sale - Parts 0 June 27th, 2008 02:46 PM
Fuel pump relay 95 D90SW alaskajgg Defender Technical Discussions 32 September 18th, 2006 10:26 AM
Calling all diesel guys - Biodiesel??? cbass Defender Technical Discussions 47 January 31st, 2006 11:18 AM
95 won't start, possible fuel priming issue? jcasteel Defender Technical Discussions 1 March 15th, 2005 09:45 AM
Fuel Pump Sound ronward Defender Technical Discussions 4 January 10th, 2005 07:45 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:05 PM.


Copyright