4.0 Engine needs replacement... plz HELP! - Page 2 - Defender Source
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  #21  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 01:48 PM
Michael
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Michael
Discovery 1998
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Sell to me so I can put diesel in it!
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  #22  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 02:50 PM
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Keith Kreutzer
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I'd love to drop a gen 3 GM 6L V8 in one. But a Diesel is more practical.. Once you get to the point of building a Big burly Rover motor you've pretty much paid for the Diesel..
I anticipate that my big Burly 5.0L Rover motor sitting on the floor of the shop is going to yield about 8 MPG. My D get's 22 around town.

The stacks are press fit and glued. heat and wiggle.

Or get a Disco 4.0 motor and stick it in.. Bosch or not the blocks are all the same with exception of the crank position sensor mounting plate welded to the block opposite the starter. That means if you are going to hunt for a 4.0 or 4.6 that may have had Bosch injection you will need to take the plate from your old block and weld in it's proper place on a Bosch block. The Plate is the same on all GEMS 4.0 and 4.6's
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  #23  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 03:50 PM
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Treuwer
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Trae Reuwer
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I can't see how a diesel is more practical. They don't sell diesel everywhere, and right now in my area it's 4.29/gal for diesel. I'm patiently awaiting the "summer switch" when diesel is less than gas, but 9 months out of the year that just doesn't happen.

Even at 3.75/gal for premium the diesel engine would have to get 18 MPG to justify the break even point at cost per mile, provided the swap costs are equal and your rover gets 15 MPG on premium.

Hmm... now it doesn't seem so bad.
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  #24  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 04:01 PM
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evilfij
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What exactly is wrong with your truck that the mechanic thinks it needs a new motor?

This is the key question you should be asking. Based on his description of what may need to be replaced, he sounds less than knowledgable.

Ron
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  #25  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 04:25 PM
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Tyler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Treuwer
I can't see how a diesel is more practical. They don't sell diesel everywhere, and right now in my area it's 4.29/gal for diesel. I'm patiently awaiting the "summer switch" when diesel is less than gas, but 9 months out of the year that just doesn't happen.

Even at 3.75/gal for premium the diesel engine would have to get 18 MPG to justify the break even point at cost per mile, provided the swap costs are equal and your rover gets 15 MPG on premium.

Hmm... now it doesn't seem so bad.
22-26MPG versus single to ~15 mpg for gas. I'd rather pay more for diesel and get 300miles a tank to the if I'm lucky and have a tailwind and draft tractor trailers 154 miles to a tank.
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  #26  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 05:48 PM
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Phillip
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Im with the gas burner 4.6, I get so tired of listening to diesels at work.
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  #27  
Old May 2nd, 2008, 08:24 PM
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Andrew Najarian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revor
I'd love to drop a gen 3 GM 6L V8 in one. But a Diesel is more practical.. Once you get to the point of building a Big burly Rover motor you've pretty much paid for the Diesel..
I anticipate that my big Burly 5.0L Rover motor sitting on the floor of the shop is going to yield about 8 MPG. My D get's 22 around town.

The stacks are press fit and glued. heat and wiggle.

Or get a Disco 4.0 motor and stick it in.. Bosch or not the blocks are all the same with exception of the crank position sensor mounting plate welded to the block opposite the starter. That means if you are going to hunt for a 4.0 or 4.6 that may have had Bosch injection you will need to take the plate from your old block and weld in it's proper place on a Bosch block. The Plate is the same on all GEMS 4.0 and 4.6's
The timing gears are different too, and it will set a crank sensor does not match cam sensor fault if you don't use the right ones.
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  #28  
Old May 3rd, 2008, 03:19 AM
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Larry Walton
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Guys, Thanks for the info. This is setting us on the right path.

Evilfij/Ron, about my mechanic and what is needed for the engine. First off he is a top notch guy, master mechanic with decades of experience and is a personal friend.

He has pulled the motor, dropped the pan and removed one head. What has been made clear is that on one of the spots where the connecting rod attaches to the crank an oil channel clogged and the bearing spun and destroyed it self. The connecting rod got sloppy and the piston top impacted one of the valves in the head. One damaged piston and connecting rod. I believe one of the main bearings also went out. Chunks of various metal were found in the oil pan. A lot of sludge was found in the oil pan and in the valve covers. The first 60K miles were put on this motor by the previous owner. It appears that less than stellar maintenance was carried out in the ealry years.

Mechanic tells me that he wouldnt recommend replacing only one piston. All will need to be replaced. possibly all connecting rods too. Crank is seviceable with machining work. We are discussing switching to a 4.6 configuration so all new crank,rods and pistons will be needed. As I am not fond of machining on cranks I am wanting a new one so this goes right along with my thinking.

So I believe that my mechanic friend has my best interest at heart. He is also humble enough to honestly state that he is less than knowledgaeable as to all fo the details needed to affect this conversion. Though performing the various aspects of the work is a piece of cake for him the little details of what are the right things to do are what we are seeking clarification on. I believe in his skills without question....we just need to tap into the wisdom and experience of this D-90 community before we dive into a ton of expensive work.

Stmpede: Thanks for the clarification on the GEMS management stuff. That was one of the biggest things throwing me for a loop. So in my situation... if we simply replace the crank,rods and pistons and use all of the other parts of my existing 4.0 then all sensors etc should stay the same..? is that an accuarate statement?

So many of you have recommended RPI and also D& D for parts and advice that it seems like they are the folks to talk to for additional clarification and advice before we dive into this.

oxcart: About honing....I have always referred to it as glaze breaking so when you mentioned it I thought you may have been suggesting boring out the engine. I now recall the term. DUHH!!


Guys, in general of course we will be replacing ALL bearings and such. New cam is a must with its bearings as well. The waterpump is only a few years old and the radiator was recored about 4 years ago so I am thinking those items are OK. Oil pump is a must as well.

I will keep you guys apprised of the situation as it develops and may post some pix if I can find my camera before we button up the engine. (Just moved to a new home)

THX again guys...your input has been very valuable
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  #29  
Old May 3rd, 2008, 03:58 AM
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Stmpede
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Andrew Najarian
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Yeah, I believe everything else should stay the same. I would probably replace the water pump anyway b/c it is cheap and it is right in front of you when the engine is out rather than ripping stuff apart later. If they aren't pretty new I would replace the T-stat and the hoses and belts while you have it all apart. As for a chip, I agree with Mark that you don't need to jump right into it, but if you want to, there is a guy on DiscoWeb (I think) that makes the 4.6 conversion chip for a couple hundred bucks.

BTW, I think you are aware of this already, but if you do the 4.6l you have to replace the pistons. When the Disco I first came here they had all kinds of quality problems. One of our techs kept getting faults in a car and finally found out that they accidentally put the wrong pistons in an engine at the factory! Yeah LR, way to be on top of stuff! haha
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