3.5 V8 Timing Chain Renewal - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old December 8th, 2009, 03:07 PM
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3.5 V8 Timing Chain Renewal

Hi Everyone,

I have my truck in pieces from the frame swap and think maybe I should change the timing chain since I have everything apart. I have read about numerous accounts about the chain breaking and causing a lot of damage, but I think this is restricted mostly to the 200 TDI? Is the 3.5 V8 prone to this also? Can anyone who has done this give me an idea if this is a difficult process? Should I do anything else while I am in there? I have looked at the LR4X4 technical archives but it does not list a V8 and the manuals are pretty vague with not a lot of pics for the mechanically challenged. Any info is greatly appreciated. Thanks
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  #2  
Old December 8th, 2009, 06:37 PM
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Gren Thomas
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I have never heard of a chain snapping due to wear, however it does wear and causes erratic timing.
it would be a good idea to change the chain to a good quality after market duplex chain set, as the original uses a nylon coated sprocket that does wear.

regards

Gren
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  #3  
Old December 8th, 2009, 08:22 PM
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not hard to do just really really take your time. to give you a rough idea of what's involved.

-remove all the ancillaries on the engine
-remove the distributor
-front two bolts off of the oil pan
-remove the water pump. this isn't really neccesary but it's easier than finding out which bolts go all the way through and which ones don't. besides if you are this far you might as well change the pump.
- remove the main engine pulley. i think it's a 23 MM bolt that's torqued to like 200 ft pounds or something. easier if you have an impact.
-remove the front cover making sure to keep track of what bolts go where. (take a photo)
-remove oil cooler lines and remove oil pump. someone can correct me if i'm wrong but this procedure will require you to prime the pump with vaseline. I took mine off to change the gasket anyway. it's like another 6 bolts. worth it.
-remove the nut and spacer on the cam shaft that holds in the cam gear.
-make sure the motor is set at TDC and then remove the cam chain and gears. There are a bunch of ways to get the motor to tdc. easiest in my opinion. assuming the heads are on, remove the spark plugs, temporarily fit the main pulley on the crank and use a set of channel locks to rotate the crank until the timing marker meets up with TDC on the main pulley. When I did this my heads were off so if they are on you might want to make sure it's on the compression stroke.
-align new gears and slide them on. make sure not to knock loose/obscure the woodruf key so oil can flow through.
- drench it in oil and then reassemble.

while you are there change:
-main crank/ front cover seal (where the crank comes through the front cover there is a black seal
- oil lines or simply remove them and remove the sandwich plate.
- water pump and seals
- clean everything with brake kleen until it's shiny and new looking
- if not done already, relocate the ignition amplifier thingy on the distributor (in another thread somewhere)

i think that covers most of it.
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  #4  
Old December 8th, 2009, 08:23 PM
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I would not bother. If you blow up the 3.5, I have a couple 3.9s sitting here you could have for a couple hundred bucks.
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  #5  
Old December 8th, 2009, 08:33 PM
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Here are all the photos I took when I redid my top end. Photos include the duplex timing chain installed. These photos made sense to me so don't laugh if it's something trivial. maybe it's use to you.
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  #6  
Old December 8th, 2009, 08:38 PM
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Cloyes dual roller timing chain. Only way to go.
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  #7  
Old December 9th, 2009, 10:23 AM
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Thanks everyone. Seems like a daunting task. I have heard horror stories about getting the oil pump to prime. I have to see if my engine is a suffix B or not and see where the oil pump is located.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 12:20 PM
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The rover V8 is a breeze to work on and set up, the oil pump is easily primed by packing with petroleum jelly(vasaline) or make a tool consisting of a length of tube with a slot cut in the end to match the oil pump drive.

then its a simple matter of spinning it in a drill until oil appears at the rockers.

if you have the block out it is well worth taking the time to give it a clean & decoke with a set of bearings, seals, gaskets & chain.

the last engine i rebuilt was a 3.9 with 120K on it and ran like a dream but it was a different story when stripped nothing like as clean as Stephens motor, that shows its had reguar oil changes unlike mine.
the performance when rebuilt was well worth the time & effort.

the other pic show a mod i carry out to the block to aid oil drain back to the sump via the timing case, this prevents the oil pooling and gumming the front lifters also aids chain lubrication.

regards

Gren
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  #9  
Old December 10th, 2009, 08:38 AM
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If you decide to do the timing chain you may want to check the camshaft for wear...especially if you decide to decoke. The 3.5 I had in my 110 was fairly high mileage when I replaced it with the 4.6. I tore the 3.5 down once I had it out and the cam was worn out but the cylinder bore was good for many more miles. I second the drill method for priming the oil pump. Pack the gears in vaseline, pull the dizzy and with a homemade extension you can prime the pump without any problem and it prevents a dry start.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 10:45 AM
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Camshaft? Gotta look that one up. Can I replace the camshaft by just removing the water pump? And can you elaborate on this drill method? I cannot see it in my mind. If I pull the dizzy won't that throw off all the timing? Thanks, as you can tell I am not a mechanic, just like working on my truck
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Old December 11th, 2009, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDSUX
Camshaft? Gotta look that one up. Can I replace the camshaft by just removing the water pump? And can you elaborate on this drill method? I cannot see it in my mind. If I pull the dizzy won't that throw off all the timing? Thanks, as you can tell I am not a mechanic, just like working on my truck

The front cover and radaiator have to be removed to get the CAM out. I used a socket on a extention and got the system primed up with the drill. It is amazing how long it takes for oil to get to the top end.
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Old December 11th, 2009, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover4x4
......I used a socket on a extention and got the system primed up with the drill....
What did you attach the socket to? And will the CAM just pull out the front? Somehow that sounds too easy.
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Old December 11th, 2009, 02:39 PM
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cThe cam will pull right out, you may have to finesse it a bit. I had a long exstention I for got which size socket I used but it fit down over the top on the oil pump gear. You will see the top of the gear when you pull the front cover.
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  #14  
Old December 11th, 2009, 03:39 PM
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When I did the chain / gearset on the 3.5 years ago...I replaced them with a set for whatever the heck Buick 215 matched. Pretty sure I asked for a Buick gasket set too.

Something like a '64 Skylark.

Cheap parts, breeze of a job if you're familiar with the oily bits inside the engine, plus it's always fun to pull the parts guy's leg
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Old December 11th, 2009, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover4x4
cThe cam will pull right out, you may have to finesse it a bit.
Doesn't the tappets ride on the camshaft? I know as they wear out the lobes of the shaft get worn. So when you pull an old shaft it may be easier to remove? Can I put a new shaft back in without pulling out the tappets? Will it rub on the new shaft?

http://www.v8wizard.com/Camshaft_wear.html
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  #16  
Old December 11th, 2009, 05:21 PM
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You will need to replace the tappets if you do the cam. New Tappets from a 63-64 Buick 215 work just fine. The front cover, intake manifold and valve covers have to come off (the water pump can stay on the cover). Remove the rocker arm assys. to get the pushrods out so you can remove the tappets. Then the cam should come out. Sounds complicated but its basic V8 stuff. The bottom of the distributor on the 3.5 has a piece that mates with the oil pump shaft. The distributor gear is turned by the cam gear and the distributor turns the oil pump. Follow the manual on engine timing but you can basically set the engine in one spot, mark the distributor and rotor position, pull the distributor, prime the pump and then put it back the same and if you haven't moved the engine any - you will be close. Try http://www.aluminumv8.com/ for performance cam etc. if you want to go that route. Those guys helped me a lot.
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