200tdi timing mishap - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old October 31st, 2010, 07:28 AM
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200tdi timing mishap

So I took the timing cover off of my engine and got a new belt. Someone got a bit carried away taking things apart and removed the bolts from the injection pump pulley. I had the drill bit in the pulley to keep the timing set, but somehow when I came back the bit was out and Injection pump had been turned about a quarter turn. I just went the rest of the way around and put the drill bit back in, as far as I know the cam or the crank wasn't moved. My question is whether the pump is back in the right place as far as the timing goes?
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  #2  
Old October 31st, 2010, 09:28 AM
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Sounds there is going to be a 50/50 chance that your injection timing will be off 180 degrees. I'd start it before reassembling the front end just to be sure it runs, (just for a few seconds). you will know right away
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Old October 31st, 2010, 09:51 AM
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So even with the drill bit in place at 11 o'clock it could be out 180?
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Old October 31st, 2010, 11:49 AM
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I believe so, this is exactly what happened to a friend with the 200tdi he shipped in. Reconditioners installed the belt with the injection pump 180 degrees off. I'm sure others with more experience than I will chime in to confirm if this is true.
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Old October 31st, 2010, 01:03 PM
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Interesting. I was not aware of this either..
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Old October 31st, 2010, 01:48 PM
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The 180 degree out thing is in reference to the crank as the pump and the cam turn at half the speed of the crank, so if you time it wrong, you could still have the crank at Top Dead Center (TDC) and the cam/pump could be 180 degrees out. If all that happened is that the pump went for a 360 degree revolution it's not affected the cam to crank timing, and by putting it back in the right spot (drill bit) everything should be fine.

Kevin, what probably happened to the other 200TDI is that they lined up the pump based on the TDC markings for the crank. But, since it turns twice for every rev of the pump, you have to make sure you are on the "right" TDC - compression stroke for the 1st cyl (the 1st TDC), and not when the mark comes around for the second time. They did not check to make sure they were at TDC for #1 cylinder, and they screwed up. This is way worse if you mis-time the cam. for obvious reasons.

I would probably go over everything and make damn sure you are right on the mark for TDC for the crank, and the cam has both valves closed and it's in line with the marks, and that you are on the compression stroke.

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Old October 31st, 2010, 02:10 PM
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With a screen name like that I knew I would get a good answer!
So as long as the crank wasn't moved, I should be good?
To be safe, I guess I should check that the crank is at TDC by pulling off the valve cover.
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Old October 31st, 2010, 02:37 PM
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I did this several years back with my old 200. somehow i managed to get the pump 180 degrees out.

The thing ran! quite well in fact, the only change was a slight bit more diesel knock. i ignored it until about 6 months later the crank snapped clean in half.

I figure that there was mucho stress on the crank and away it went.
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Old October 31st, 2010, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_jim View Post
I did this several years back with my old 200. somehow i managed to get the pump 180 degrees out.

The thing ran! quite well in fact, the only change was a slight bit more diesel knock. i ignored it until about 6 months later the crank snapped clean in half.

I figure that there was mucho stress on the crank and away it went.
So how bad was the diesel Knock? I thought it wouldn't run at all?
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Old October 31st, 2010, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomaco1 View Post
With a screen name like that I knew I would get a good answer!
So as long as the crank wasn't moved, I should be good?
To be safe, I guess I should check that the crank is at TDC by pulling off the valve cover.
As long as the crank and the cam did not move in relation to one another you're doing good.

If the pump locking pin fell out but the belt stayed on under tension and nothing else moved I'd probably just do what you did, crank the pump around by the big nut, line it back up, put the pin in, put the bolts back in, and start from there. There is a mark on the cam pulley, a mark on the crank pulley, and the timing pin in the inj. pump. If the cam and crank are still in phase with one another, no problem. You do not want to get the crank and cam out of phase. If all you are doing is turning the pump you're good.

Good tutorial on the 200TDI:

http://www.landroverweb.com/timing-b...e-200tdi-2.htm

One last thing. Based on my experience with VE pumps in Cummins and VW engines, the timing pin method for pump timing is not ideal. It'll get you close, but it's not very accurate. Find the plunger lift at TDC specification (it'll be a measurement in millimeters or thou/inch - should be available in the LR service manual) and then find someone that has a proper dial gauge plunger lift indicator and time your pump so it's 100% on spec. You can pickup the tools on Ebay cheap.
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Old November 2nd, 2010, 06:11 AM
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Thanks JL
So before I put it back together, as long as the Cam is on its mark and the crank is in the proper faze and the pump is on it's lock, I should be good, right?
Any good articles on how to get the pump 100% on spec?
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