200td injection pump hydro locked engine.. - Defender Source
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Old December 17th, 2015, 11:18 PM
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shayne young
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200td injection pump hydro locked engine..

Just thought I would share an interesting problem that could easily have been avoided.. Had a customer who brought his 1985 defender 110 to me blowing shoot loads of white smoke and running rough, hard starting, no power etc etc. a little back history..... Just 2 weeks prior he had broken a water pump and driven for a bit before he realized the engine was getting hot..pulled over, let it cool and limped it home...
Found out the water pump had broken the impeller so it wasn't circulating water... So he replaced the water pump, and everything was good, a week later he was showing it off to his friend and clouds of white smoke were billowing out the exhaust..so he brought it to me..
... I do the normal crack open test on the injector lines to do a power balance test and all of them seem to make a difference on the running, the very back one makes the least difference... Still billowing white smoke. Pull the valve cover, all valves appear to be correct clearances.. So off comes the front timing cover thinking that it may have jumped a tooth on the injection pump...all is in timing.. Scratching of head....
Okay, smoke has heavy I burnt diesel smell, so maybe injection pump over fueling on a couple of cold..replace injection pump with known good spare..matter running for a while smoke almost all gone but engine still has definite uneven running.. Off with its head.., once head was removed found # 4 cyliner marks showing lower than others, for some reason didn't check how high the piston was coming up.., but knew the engine had to come out and apart..
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  #2  
Old December 17th, 2015, 11:26 PM
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shayne young
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Once the engine was out started pulling all the Pistons out and #4 wouldn't allow the connecting rod to go through the barrel. Notice there was a chunk missing off the boottom on the liner and then I saw it... The rod had a bend in it...well that explains why the piston wasn't going all the way up..big ends on these are really close to the diameter of the piston bore and the bend was enough to not allow it to go into the bore and up..broken piece already determined that it needed a new engine..
So now to figure out why it bent..after close inspection of the head that chamber was still completely wet, looking carefully at the head gasket it appeared that there was a tracing of cooling path from the np gallery past the head gasket, so I assumed (remember that) that when the water pump stopped circulating the coolant around the block it had developed a hot spot in the back of the block and compromised the head gasket... Cool, now that I figured out why I can rebuild a new engine for it.. Found a good used long block and rebuilt it completely and painted everything lovely as it went back together..note, I reassembled the engine using customers original injection pump...so I could keep my spare test unit...
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Old December 17th, 2015, 11:38 PM
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John B.
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Yep. Always check piston protrusion. Bent rods from a blown head gasket seem not too uncommon.
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Old December 17th, 2015, 11:40 PM
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Slipped the engine back in the truck and left the glow plugs out, cranked it over with the oil cooler pipes cracked open to ensure we had oil flow once it followed the flow and was tightened, crank some more until I see if coming out of the rocker arms...okay, we have good oil circulation.. Prime the air out of the pump with the manual lift valve and then give another couple of cranks with the injector lines cracked open until we have fuel up there and tighten them all up..pop the glow plugs in and wire them up... Couple of cranks and away she fires up...I notice that its pissing diesel over the engine so I shut it down to look for a leak... I find that I had inadvertently left the boost pressure line off the turbo....what..???? Diesels not supposed to be coming out of there, trace the lines back and the 200td has the spill tubing and the turbo boost pressure hose going into the side of the injection pump...WTF...??? So I pop that valve off a spare pump and sure enough there is a rubber diaphragm and 2 springs,.. (Both different if you are going to try this..) so I pop the valve off the one on the engine and sure enough the diaphragm is completely perished.

------ Follow up post added December 17th, 2015 11:47 PM ------

Ahah... As the light bulb goes off...... That is why the engine was blowing lots of smoke, the pump and spill tubing excess was pumping straight up into the turbo and I to the exhaust system causing shit loads of smoke..... AND, most importantly, the end cylinder is lower than the other due to the angle of the engine, excess fuel build up on shut down travelled down the exhaust manifold. Exhaust valve was open and fuel built up in that cylinder, next time the customer tried to start the truck she hydrlocked on the diesel in there... This is why it was kinda firing but not fully, much lower compression ratio on that cylinder..
Bottom line is... That diaphragm cost the customer a good deal of money, if you have the injection pump out,mate place that diaphragm, it can be done relatively easily in situ also..
Hope this saves someone lots of money..

------ Follow up post added December 17th, 2015 11:48 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
Yep. Always check piston protrusion. Bent rods from a blown head gasket seem not too uncommon.
Ahhhh, not so quick there mr cherry pie...all is to be revealed..lol..
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Old December 17th, 2015, 11:49 PM
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shayne young
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Purdy....
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Old December 18th, 2015, 02:41 AM
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Thanks Shayne, good to know. Wouldn't happen to have the part number handy?.........
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Old December 18th, 2015, 09:38 AM
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?? I thought this was about a 200TDI?
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Old December 18th, 2015, 09:53 AM
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Shayne, excellent write up on diesels. I have preached for years about the performance of diesel engines and the damage they can achieve at the blink of an eye, somehow owners desire these engine but underestimate
their capabilities.
a diesel engine is a high performance engine, with capability of high performance failures and damages when not looked upon.

------ Follow up post added December 18th, 2015 09:54 AM ------

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Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
?? I thought this was about a 200TDI?
looks like a 19j.
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Old December 18th, 2015, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
?? I thought this was about a 200TDI?
This is the 2.5 TD...yes, 19j engine.... Not the tdi..
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Old December 18th, 2015, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
This is the 2.5 TD...yes, 19j engine.... Not the tdi..
No shit Sherlock..... The 200td title is somewhat misleading?
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Old December 18th, 2015, 10:26 AM
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shayne young
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When I worked for Land Rover and this engine was released it was often referred to as the 200td.. And seemed to still often be referred to as that in Europe.. And I can't change the heading..

------ Follow up post added December 18th, 2015 10:28 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
No shit Sherlock..... The 200td title is somewhat misleading?
I guess its only misleading if you think the is an I that isn't there after the TD..???..
Maybe an error on my behalf but I have always referred to them as the 200td..old habits die hard, but in future I will try to just call it the 2.5 turbo diesel 19j version engine... I guess I'll just have to find some other way to mislead people...... Terribly sorry if I made someone read it under false and misleading pretenses...
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Old December 18th, 2015, 10:31 AM
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no harm no foul in my book. good write up
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  #13  
Old December 18th, 2015, 10:49 AM
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shayne young
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Can't find a pic of it.. But here is a write up on it... Wish I had have read this before..oh well, hands on experience seems to stick with you better than reading an article..
Replacing 2.5TD boost Diaphram - Land Rover Technical Archive - LR4x4 - The Land Rover Forum
Land Rover probably doesn't sell this part separately... Seems to be a Delphi part number..
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-DELP...-/201179554981
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  #14  
Old December 18th, 2015, 11:00 AM
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shayne young
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John please feel free to modify the heading if you are able to..
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  #15  
Old December 18th, 2015, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
When I worked for Land Rover and this engine was released it was often referred to as the 200td.. And seemed to still often be referred to as that in Europe.. And I can't change the heading..

------ Follow up post added December 18th, 2015 10:28 AM ------



I guess its only misleading if you think the is an I that isn't there after the TD..???..
Maybe an error on my behalf but I have always referred to them as the 200td..old habits die hard, but in future I will try to just call it the 2.5 turbo diesel 19j version engine... I guess I'll just have to find some other way to mislead people...... Terribly sorry if I made someone read it under false and misleading pretenses...
Shayne, well done mate. As for misleading dont think so my old cock sparrow. The Land Rover turbo diesel (TD) engine is what it has (was) always called in the old country. Its just over here people don't feel comfortable without throwing numbers at things. We had one of the first 200Tdi discos and the engine was just referred as the Tdi until the upstart 300 came out.

Glad you got it sorted.
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