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  #1  
Old July 5th, 2017, 11:43 AM
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Alex Searle
2011 puma 110 D/C & 1968 series iia
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2.4 Puma modifications

Good day all. A year ago I replaced my 2014 puma 90 with a 2011 puma 110 double cab (for family reasons). When buying due to it being out of warranty I immediately did a de-cat and blanked off the EGR. After driving a while I realized there were a few things that needed fixing. First up was the transfer case mod to stop an oil leak. In the process we replaced a pretty worn output shaft. (110,000kms) i then did a full suspension upgrade as the original was pretty pup and didn't much like my kudu bar and winch. Shortly after the clutch failed so at great expense I put a new one in. At this point I was getting about 9.5kms per liter. There had always been a whine and backlash even after the replaced output shaft so I ended up doing the front diff. All bearings. Backlash gone. Fuel efficiency down to 9.2kms per liter. Bit odd. I was then told to help power and efficiency I should remove the center box. Which I did. Fuel efficiency down to 8.2. I tried to get a remap after that but was told it shouldn't be done before a larger intercooler was installed. So I did that. Fuel efficiency still at 8.2. Went back for the remap but was told a unichip would be better. So installed that. Fuel efficiency down to 8 (although I've only done one tank) surely all these things I've done should have improved the vehicles efficiency by now? There has been significant power and torque improvements since the remap and the engine sounds and feels much happier but my consumption is pants. There is still an u comfortable whine above 120 kmh but I can find significant play in the transfer case or the diff. Does anyone have any thoughts suggestions or answers?
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  #2  
Old July 5th, 2017, 12:45 PM
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You driving in low gear?
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  #3  
Old July 5th, 2017, 12:48 PM
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That is a mileage drop of almost 16%.
From 9.5 to 8 kms/ltr.
Are you able to confirm the same driving mix of around town and highway?
Mileage varies a lot when highway is compared to suburbia and city driving.
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Old July 5th, 2017, 12:51 PM
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What tires are you running and at what pressures? Is the truck throwing any codes?
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  #5  
Old July 5th, 2017, 12:56 PM
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Alex Searle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
That is a mileage drop of almost 16%.
From 9.5 to 8 kms/ltr.
Are you able to confirm the same driving mix of around town and highway?
Mileage varies a lot when highway is compared to suburbia and city driving.


Yes I've taken averages. I monitor every fill up. I do at least 70% off road. I am heavy footed and I do work with the vehicle but my driving habits haven't changed. The most obvious change was when I removed the centre box.


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------ Follow up post added July 5th, 2017 06:00 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
What tires are you running and at what pressures? Is the truck throwing any codes?


I'm running mud terrains. Cooper STT. They were at 2 bar but been running at 1.8 for a couple of months now. The tyres definitely make a difference but I've had these tyres on since I bought the landy. My traction control is messing around so I've removed the fuse. This occurred recently long after the removal of the centre box. The warning lights are on for that. But that shouldn't make a difference to fuel usage should it? Does the ECU monitor the wheel rotation to manage the engine?


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Old July 5th, 2017, 01:03 PM
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When was the timing last checked? And are the injectors still coded correctly?
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  #7  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:10 PM
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Alex Searle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
When was the timing last checked? And are the injectors still coded correctly?


We had trouble with the injectors when I tried to have them checked. I thought it was a software prob on the mechanics side but perhaps the issue is with my injectors. What problems could this cause? Remember it's being manipulated by the chip too. Incidentally prior to chipping the engine used to hunt a lot.


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------ Follow up post added July 5th, 2017 06:11 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
When was the timing last checked? And are the injectors still coded correctly?


Is the timing not defined in the map now and as such the chip would manage that?


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  #8  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:19 PM
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On each injector there is a set of numbers and letters. They must correspond correctly with the ECU or it will not run correctly (loss of power, bad idle, smoke at start up, etc). You have to program them through the ECU.
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Old July 5th, 2017, 01:23 PM
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Alex Searle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
On each injector there is a set of numbers and letters. They must correspond correctly with the ECU or it will not run correctly (loss of power, bad idle, smoke at start up, etc). You have to program them through the ECU.


Yes. I think I'm going to have another crack at it and see if that isn't the problem. I'll put it on diagnostics too and see if all the sensors are reading properly. I did have troubles with the mass airflow sensor a while back. Funnily enough at the same time as trying to code the injectors.


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  #10  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b_jabu View Post
Yes. I think I'm going to have another crack at it and see if that isn't the problem. I'll put it on diagnostics too and see if all the sensors are reading properly. I did have troubles with the mass airflow sensor a while back. Funnily enough at the same time as trying to code the injectors.


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Make sure you get new copper washers for the injectors.
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  #11  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:26 PM
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Alex Searle
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On the puma? I did look at doing that a while ago and was told it's not necessary.


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  #12  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b_jabu View Post
On the puma? I did look at doing that a while ago and was told it's not necessary.


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The 4 fuel injectors are located in the cylinder head, between the 4 valves in each cylinder. Each injector is sealed
into the cylinder head with a copper washer. Each injector has an electrical connector for power supply and
connections to the ECM. The fuel injectors are operated directly by the ECM for fuel metering (start of injection and
quantity of fuel injected). The top of each injector is fitted with a fuel return pipe, which allows fuel used in the
operation of the injector to return to the tank.
NOTE: The copper washers that seal the injectors in the cylinder head must not be re-used.

Each electronic injector has a solenoid valve, which when energised, allows a ball valve to lift off its seat. This allows
pressurised fuel to lift a needle valve in the injector nozzle and spray a finely atomised jet of fuel into the cylinder.
Fuel that spills past the ball valve is directed into a return line, which is connected to the fuel return from the highpressure
fuel pump.
Each injector solenoid is controlled separately by the ECM, which provides an earth path to open the injector nozzle
at the correct time and for a calculated period to provide a metered injection of fuel into the cylinder. The ECM uses
signals from other sensors and a programmed fuelling strategy to ensure that the precise amount of fuel is injected at
the correct timing for maximum fuel efficiency and minimum emissions.



http://www.landrovertechinfo.com/ext...rsexml.jsp?XML
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  #13  
Old July 5th, 2017, 01:51 PM
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Alex Searle
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Thank you very much for your help. I'll report back to let you know the outcome


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  #14  
Old July 7th, 2017, 04:22 AM
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You asked for thoughts, so here goes:

First off, the 2.4/2.2 is not rocket science, but it is finicky. That ECU lives to throw codes and find the worst possible tune all on its own! Lol.

What diagnostic software/kit are you using?
What is a "center box"? Do you mean in the exhaust?

I get the backlash issues, and the shit job LR did with output shaft. Good fixes.

But the rest?

Get the 2.4 back to baseline, and running clear with no codes. Factory tune, cats and egr back on. You are throwing mods at mods to clear codes, and will spend yourself out if not careful. Make each change and monitor for a bit. Dyno time would be best.



(South Africa seems to be all about EGR blanking, de-cat and center silencer removal, at least on the LR forums I see. Why, I have no idea. BAS in UK has gotten great results with remap, and intercooler upgrade. Same with Alive.)
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  #15  
Old July 7th, 2017, 05:46 AM
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You could have bought alot of diesel with the money you spent on modifications that didn't help you. I'm glad you are researching.

If my math is correct you are doing about 12.4 miles per US gallon. Thats the kind of mpg I would expect from a V8 not a diesel.

I agree you need to have a mechanic with the correct computer program the Injectors to the ECU. My major concern is that you didn't establish that the engine was operating to factory specs and had no defects before commencing on the modifications.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 07:46 PM
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Ray Wood
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In praise of Old 110s

Having read this sorry tale I give thanks for owning an older 110. My ISUZU 3.9 powered Australian built 110 has just traveled from Vancouver to the Yukon territory and back and turned in 100 Km for every 9 1/2 Litres. With over 350,000 Km it used 1 liter of oil on the 4000 Km trip. Off road in the Atlin district it climbed steep rocky grades to reach old gold mines using its air actuated center differential. As usual with this venerable old beast nothing at all went wrong. Much as it has run for the last twelve years driven it in Africa, Europe and North America. I did have to replace an alternator brush at Etosha (Thanks Tsumeb mine for helping out). I did have to replace the clutch last year when I detected some slippage on steep hills. There are injectors in there somewhere but as far as I know they have never been out and the the head has never been off the block. I did have to make a visit to Rocky Mountain to buy a new indicator switch. The Lucas one is clearly crap it only lasted 35 years.............

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  #17  
Old July 9th, 2017, 03:33 AM
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Alex Searle
2011 puma 110 D/C & 1968 series iia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
You could have bought alot of diesel with the money you spent on modifications that didn't help you. I'm glad you are researching.

If my math is correct you are doing about 12.4 miles per US gallon. Thats the kind of mpg I would expect from a V8 not a diesel.

I agree you need to have a mechanic with the correct computer program the Injectors to the ECU. My major concern is that you didn't establish that the engine was operating to factory specs and had no defects before commencing on the modifications.


Thanks for your input. Your maths are wrong though. It's closer to 18.8 miles per us gallon. Bear in mind it also has the aerodynamics of a brick. However it should be better. I appreciate your concerns but I have enlisted the advice of respected landrover mechanics and we have run diagnostics in the past.


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  #18  
Old July 9th, 2017, 03:50 AM
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Heavy footed, remapped, changed gearing, 70% off road and you get 1:8... you should be happy.

Light footed, totally stock and never off road, I barely make 1:10 with my 110 Puma.
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