1989 110 19J 2.5 TD trouble starting - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old August 13th, 2014, 12:36 AM
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1989 110 19J 2.5 TD trouble starting

I have a RHD 110 with a 19J engine. I cant get it to run. It was running before with some help from starter fluid. After that it ran smooth.

So right now it turns over and seems like it want s to run, but as soon as I stop cranking and let go of the key the engine quits. A little bit of white smoke comes out the tail pipe?

I let the glow plugs warm up for about 15 seconds

I think i just toasted the ignition switch or something in the dash because there was a puff of smoke from the dash

Things Ive checked.
Gets Fuel.
It cranks, so I assume starter is good.
All four glow plugs are good and associated wiring
Injectors seem to be working.
Battery is good. Rated with 700 CCA


Questions:
Is there a starter relay behind the fuse panel? Which one is it?

ANYONE have wiring diagrams and/or drawing of this engine?
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  #2  
Old August 13th, 2014, 02:02 AM
javelinadave
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First off starter fluid and glow plugs don't mix.
It sounds like your stop solenoid isn't opening up to allow the motor to get fuel.
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  #3  
Old August 13th, 2014, 06:10 AM
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Crack an injector line and look if fuel is coming.
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  #4  
Old August 13th, 2014, 10:21 AM
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Yeah the starter fluid wasn't me. A friend drove it from port while i was overseas working.

Ill look into the stop solenoid and crack a fuel line and make sure there is fuel and probably make sure the grounding strap is okay
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Old August 13th, 2014, 10:27 AM
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For diesels wd-40 is safer than starting fluid..if you have to use starting fluid just a very small squirt..very small. Make sure you have 12 volts going to the terminal on the injection pump when the ignition is on AND when it's cranking.. Or you can bypass that by removing the solenoid assy and take the plunger out, replace the solenoid into the pump and should start.. Then you just have to figure out how to stop it.. First gear. Foot on the clutch and brake and stall it out...

------ Follow up post added August 13th, 2014 10:27 AM ------

And in this weather you shouldn't really need the glow plugs to get it started..I never do..
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  #6  
Old August 13th, 2014, 10:31 AM
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Um do the stall in fourth or fifth gear.... Otherwise you may be replacing an axle shaft. Ask how I know!
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  #7  
Old August 13th, 2014, 11:25 AM
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Starting fluid is soooo volatile that it can melt the top of the pistons.
Never buy it and never use it.
I know it wasn't you, Lance but for anyone reading.

Check the glow plugs to see if they have (+) current when the key "says they are energized".
Pull all 4 glow plugs and check them.
They are probably burned out.
Replace where needed.
You might need to ream out the hole to clear it of carbon.

It was mentioned above to make sure you are getting fuel at the injectors, crack all while the engine is spinning and check for fuel squirting.
If you have no fuel check the shutoff solenoid (mentioned above) and make sure it has a wire attached and clicks on and off.
Replace if faulty.

Follow these steps:

If you change your fuel system to route fuel from the tank through a sedimenter to a 12V pump (that comes on when you turn the ignition on), to the lift pump, to the fuel filter, and then on to the IP, you will never have to bleed your fuel system again.

You could drive it until your tank and fuel system is dry, then fill up with fuel, switch on the key, wait a few minutes, and then start your engine WITHOUT any air left in the fuel system.
A self bleeding fuel system often eliminates hours of wasted time trying to bleed a system with a single lift pump.
It also eliminated a single point of failure, the lift pump itself.

The sedimenter will trap water and particulate leaving the fuel filter clean and water free.
There is a drain on the sedimenter to purge anything trapped like water, sediment, dirt, rust particles, what have you.
Then when you drain the sedimenter and air is introduced, no worries because the entire fuel system is self bleeding.
Reliability is paramount.

If you complete the above steps and it still won't start, the IP and injectors need to be checked.
It is possible that the IP is not capable of producing enough pressure to start the engine.
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  #8  
Old August 19th, 2014, 11:32 PM
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So an update
I replaced the fuel sender unit. We primed the system at the fuel filter and fuel injection pump, as best as we know (first time). But it still won't start seems like it's not getting fuel. Fuel sender seems operational, get's voltage. Glow plugs get power.

I do have the gauge cluster out when starting, I was messing with ignition switch and I notice the one wire gets fairly hot(I think to the glow plugs). The only thing unplugged is us the speedo.
Any suggestions?
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  #9  
Old August 20th, 2014, 12:04 AM
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when you turn the key to the "run" position can you hear the fuel shut off solenoid on the injection pump open ? If not check and make sure you have 12v to it with the key on.
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  #10  
Old August 20th, 2014, 12:07 AM
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We did crack one of the injector lines, but but we didn't see fuel coming out. This was before we primed it.
Maybe the lift pump is bad? What's the part number for it?

Also I have noticed it looks like something us leaking from either the glow plugs or possibly injectors? Would this add to starting issues?
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  #11  
Old August 20th, 2014, 12:24 AM
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How could you possibly prime it if the lift pump was bad ? The priming process is simply manually working the lift pump instead of cranking the engine over. Can you answer the questions in post 9 ?
Tying to help you from 65 miles away if you can answer the questions.
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Old August 20th, 2014, 12:25 PM
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How loud is the stop solenoid? And the injector pump?
Is there a photo of how the ignition switch is supposed to be wired? I can't find one that is exactly like mine.

Well when we primed it, we had fuel leaking out of the bolt on the fuel filter and then the injector pump. The pump was working on the down stroke and we did have to start it to get it lined up to pump.
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  #13  
Old August 20th, 2014, 12:39 PM
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check your compression, pull out the injecters and squirt some power punch in the cylinders, leave the injecters out and crank the engine over. this will re lubricate your rings and give you more compression. hope i could be of some help.
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  #14  
Old August 20th, 2014, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbee View Post
How loud is the stop solenoid? And the injector pump?
Is there a photo of how the ignition switch is supposed to be wired? I can't find one that is exactly like mine.

Well when we primed it, we had fuel leaking out of the bolt on the fuel filter and then the injector pump. The pump was working on the down stroke and we did have to start it to get it lined up to pump.
If the stop solenoid does not have 12v to it,the truck cannot start. I'd suggest running 12v to the stop solenoid and see if it starts. If you have fuel through the filter and to the IP then the issue is not the lift pump. The lift pump is worked by the camshaft and this is why you had to turn the engine over to get it on the cam lobe so it would pump. I'm outside Lynchburg and may be headed through C'ville the end of the week if you haven't figured it out by then.
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  #15  
Old August 20th, 2014, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbee View Post
I can't find one that is exactly like mine.
#9 is the stop solenoid. Should have one wire going to the top of it.

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  #16  
Old August 20th, 2014, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post
#9 is the stop solenoid. Should have one wire going to the top of it.

Hey.....I have seem this before.....way too many times!
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  #17  
Old August 21st, 2014, 12:03 AM
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Thanks. I will look into it further. I'll try the 12v to the stop solenoid and test the injectors. Will I have to replace the copper gaskets if I take them out?

I actually was looking for a diagram for the ignition switch, how the wires hook up to it. ( double check my connections)
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  #18  
Old August 21st, 2014, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elbee View Post
Thanks. I will look into it further. I'll try the 12v to the stop solenoid and test the injectors. Will I have to replace the copper gaskets if I take them out?
You should replace them but there is always this:
http://www.motoiq.com/MagazineArticl...r-Washers.aspx
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  #19  
Old August 21st, 2014, 12:24 AM
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Looks like I'll be taking a propane torch to the copper crush washers.
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  #20  
Old August 21st, 2014, 07:45 AM
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I wouldn't pull the injectors, once its starts and isn't running on all cyls or is smoking, sure. If you had puffs of white smoke coming out of the exhaust but a no start scenario, then I would check them. Until then I would assume you have no fuel passing through the IP. The injectors open because pressure pushed them open, diesel atomizes @ around 1200 psi. No fuel through the pump means zero pressure to the injectors so not only are they not opening there is no chance fuel is atomizing.
Bleeding the system just removes air it doesn't mean pressure is getting to the injectors.
If your ignition wiring is screwed then I'd highly suspect you do not have 12v to the solenoid.

Has this engine been running recently ? If you remove the valve cover and turn the engine over are the rockers moving ? If you put a wrench on the crank nut and turn it are you fighting compression to turn it clockwise (don't turn it counter clockwise ever).

I work on LR diesels for a living and my number is below if you want to send me a text.
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