12j vs 19j - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old April 6th, 2016, 03:02 PM
bnoonan
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12j vs 19j

Can someone post photos of these that will help me be able to ID them from pics?

If a turbo is added to 12j, does it go in same place as it does on 19j?

How hard is it to add/remove a turbo from 12j?

Thanks
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  #2  
Old April 6th, 2016, 03:05 PM
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They are the same externally except one has a turbo.... Putting a turbo on a 12J will be a short lived exercise.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:14 PM
bnoonan
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How can you look at an engine and differentiate the 2 then? Just the presence or absence of a turbo? Are there identifying markings on the engine itself?

How can I tell if the engine in the vehicle that I'm looking at is a 19j or a 12j with a turbo added?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:15 PM
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A turbo will be the best way to tell. There is a serial number on the left side if you're looking at it
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:31 PM
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Just the serial number, but that could be changed very easily.... I think the only external difference is the turbo oil ports, but later 12Js have them as well.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:31 PM
bnoonan
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To be clear, the serial number is on the engine right, not the turbo?
Is there an online tool I can use to search the serial on the engine?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:36 PM
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It is on the engine block. The serial number will be 12Jxxxx for a 12J and 19Jxxx for a 19J.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
It is on the engine block. The serial number will be 12Jxxxx for a 12J and 19Jxxx for a 19J.
Are you sure?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:43 PM
bnoonan
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Can someone post a photo with and without a turbo please? Not a gearhead myself (yet) and not sure what to look for.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:46 PM
FlyersFan76
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Is there any reason to steering clear of either of these engines? Aside from high mileage of course.

Example less than 100k miles.
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  #11  
Old April 6th, 2016, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnoonan View Post
Can someone post a photo with and without a turbo please? Not a gearhead myself (yet) and not sure what to look for.
Ummm. Let me suggest that if you do not know what a turbo looks like, you need to get someone else to inspect the vehicle. I'm not trying to be difficult, but there are a lot of things that need to be looked at and you really need someone knowledgeable on Defenders to look.

12J


19J
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan76 View Post
Is there any reason to steering clear of either of these engines? Aside from high mileage of course.

Example less than 100k miles.

Besides the fact that the 12j has zero power and the 19j is an awful engine? No, not really
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnoonan View Post
Can someone post a photo with and without a turbo please? Not a gearhead myself (yet) and not sure what to look for.
Doh! Red beat me to it.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:56 PM
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!!!!!!!
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Old April 6th, 2016, 04:57 PM
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......
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Old April 6th, 2016, 05:13 PM
bnoonan
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Thank you Red. I agree, I'm simply hoping to whittle down the options before handing off choices to the person doing this for me. Trying to learn and do some of the legwork myself.
I really appreciate the input of everyone.

This link is the engine in question: Whatchacallit?
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B_...UpXa1llQ1NUSlU
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Old April 6th, 2016, 05:16 PM
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a 19j
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  #18  
Old April 6th, 2016, 07:25 PM
bnoonan
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I'm told it is a 12j that has an added turbo unit.
True or False?
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Old April 6th, 2016, 07:35 PM
javelinadave
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Brice,
Here is the answer to your question. You may also want to Google stuff before throwing it out here.

From Wiki:
Diesel Turbo (Engine Code 19J)[edit]

A late Diesel Turbo engine, incorporating all the design changes.
Land Rover's global sales collapsed during the early 1980s.[47] This was mainly due to foreign competition offering larger, more powerful, more comfortable vehicles. Land Rover suffered from poor build quality and materials during the 1970s and by 1983 the then-current Series III model was distinctly outdated, despite recent improvements.[48] Land Rover decided to focus the sales of its Ninety/One Ten/127 range on the UK and Europe, for which it required a diesel engine with significantly better performance than the 68-horsepower 2.5-litre type then in production. Project Falcon was started in 1984 to develop a turbocharged version of this engine.[49] The resulting engine was Land Rover's first production turbodiesel and their first engine to be given a marketing name- the Diesel Turbo,[50] a name given to differentiate it from the VM Motori-built turbodiesel then being used in the Range Rover, which was sold as the 'Turbo D'.[51] The Diesel Turbo, although essentially the same as the 2.5-litre diesel, had numerous additions and modifications to allow it to cope with the stresses of turbocharging. New pistons with Teflon-coated crowns and Nimonic steel exhaust valves were used to withstand higher combustion temperatures. The crankshaft was cross-drilled for improved strength and cooling. The block was modified to allow an oil feed/drain system to the turbocharger, and the cooling system was improved with an 8-bladed viscous fan and integral oil cooler. The engine was fitted with a high-capacity breather system to cope with the greater volumes of gas flow through the engine.[12][52] Despite the inherent age of the design, it performed well in tests against its rivals and provided the vital blend of performance and economy the Land Rover had needed for many years.[48] It was the first diesel model to match the petrol engine's 4-ton towing limit and the first to be able to exceed the UK national speed limit of 70 mph (112 km/h).[53] However, early engines suffered several failures. Most serious were failed main and big-end bearings and splits or cracks in the block.[54] In 1988 a new block and an improved design of bearing and bearing cap was fitted which solved these issues. The engine's higher internal temperatures meant that the cooling system also had to be maintained to a much higher standard than the earlier engines. Further changes were made in 1989, this time to the breather system to prevent oil being drawn into the air filter. Despite these issues, the Diesel Turbo was a strong seller. It was the standard engine for the UK and European markets and Land Rover's sales increased after its introduction.[44][55] Time has shown that these engines can turn in long service lives if maintained as required—like many early turbodiesels, a lack of maintenance causes failure.[54][56][57]

Layout: 4-cylinder, in-line
Block/head: Cast iron/cast iron
Valves: OHV, belt-driven camshaft, push-rod operated
Capacity: 2,495 cc (152.3 cu in)
Bore stroke: 90.47 mm 97 mm (3.562 in 3.819 in)
Compression ratio: 21:1
Fuel injection: Lucas-CAV DPS rotary pump and CAV Pintaux injectors
Induction: Garrett T2 turbocharger
Power: 85 hp (63 kW) @ 4,250 rpm
Torque: 150 lbfft (200 Nm) @ 1,800 rpm
Production: 1986–1989
Used in: Land Rover Ninety/One Ten/127 and Land Rover Llama prototype.

------ Follow up post added April 6th, 2016 11:44 PM ------

The bottom line is they are both painfully slow, underpowered engines. The 12J has less to break but it is less powerful. Ultimately you won't be happy with either one if you have to drive somewhere far, up a hill, on a freeway or with your wife.
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Old April 6th, 2016, 07:44 PM
javelinadave
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The bottom line is they are both painfully slow, underpowered engines. The 12J has less to break but it is less powerful. Ultimately you won't be happy with either one if you have to drive somewhere far, up a hill, on a freeway or with your wife.
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