Power Steering for a Series IIa 109 - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old December 10th, 2013, 07:11 AM
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Ben Goodwin
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Power Steering for a Series IIa 109

Anyone got a sure fire upgrade? I don't know anything about the Series other than the one my dad just bought needs power steering in the worst way!
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  #2  
Old December 10th, 2013, 07:48 AM
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There's a lot of info out there already. There's no "easy" option. It's major surgery.
I wouldn't do it unless it's part of an engine swap project.
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1966 109 5 door wagon 300Tdi "spermaceti fueled"
1994 RRC LeWiB "ruining the air behind me"
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  #3  
Old December 10th, 2013, 08:45 AM
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J. Michael McCaig
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I'm installing a diesel in my series 88 and because of the lack of clearance around the turbo and the fact that the engine came with a power steering pump, I decided to convert it to powersteering. I used a Range Rover P38 steering box and the only modification to the frame was the addition of a mounting plate welded to the outside of the frame. You will have to modify the steering column and draglink. My build thread is here though I haven't updated it in a while.

http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ad.php?t=45133

I'm not too far from you in central VA. PM me if you want to swing by sometime.
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  #4  
Old December 10th, 2013, 12:14 PM
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Ben Goodwin
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I will definitely take you up on that. Thanks! I think the first project is going to be to figure out why all the snow that was outside Sunday night ended up as water inside Monday afternoon. Every seam on the roof has been bondo'd over so I don't know where it is getting in.

I will read the thread tonight and I am sure I will have questions. Thanks
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  #5  
Old December 10th, 2013, 12:28 PM
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Ben Goodwin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o2batsea View Post
There's a lot of info out there already. There's no "easy" option. It's major surgery. I wouldn't do it unless it's part of an engine swap project.
I can figure out just about anything to do on a car with no training but searching for a topic in the threads in a chat room from the mobile app drives me nuts!

I am restoring a D90 and trying to keep my Disco crawler running so this 109 project with my dad might be the straw that broke the rover's back.

My hope was that I could pull the steering parts from a classic as I am going to try to find a rusty old donor for axles, brakes, etc.
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  #6  
Old December 10th, 2013, 12:41 PM
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Ben Goodwin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRover View Post
I'm installing a diesel in my series 88 and because of the lack of clearance around the turbo and the fact that the engine came with a power steering pump, I decided to convert it to powersteering. I used a Range Rover P38 steering box and the only modification to the frame was the addition of a mounting plate welded to the outside of the frame. You will have to modify the steering column and draglink. My build thread is here though I haven't updated it in a while. http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ad.php?t=45133 I'm not too far from you in central VA. PM me if you want to swing by sometime.
That would figure that P38 parts would work for this as I just dropped off my old 97 in the cover of night as trade at the Mercedes dealer. After rebuilding the top half and not being able to get rid of the check engine light and being let down by that wonderful viscus locker one too many times I gave up.

I still have a spare wire harness, all the spare ecu's, tranny and tcase linkage, cowls, air suspension junk, but the power steering was one of the few things that I never had a problem with.
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  #7  
Old December 10th, 2013, 12:42 PM
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RR Classic steering will require extensive modifications. You'll have to cut the fender and the radiator panel. You will need to figure out how to mount a steering pump on the engine. You'll have to find a reservoir. You will have to engineers new steering tube, steering shaft and u joint shaft. You will need a new custom track rod.
The steering box will require a welded on mount plate
You can find teriann's site that has a pretty good write up of a couple different approaches.
It's not really worth the bother unless it's included in a comprehensive refit.
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1966 109 5 door wagon 300Tdi "spermaceti fueled"
1994 RRC LeWiB "ruining the air behind me"
1968 2A 88

All my troubles are Rover
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  #8  
Old December 10th, 2013, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockShow View Post
I think the first project is going to be to figure out why all the snow that was outside Sunday night ended up as water inside Monday afternoon. Every seam on the roof has been bondo'd over so I don't know where it is getting in.
Sounds like a long term project.
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  #9  
Old December 10th, 2013, 06:13 PM
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Ben Goodwin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o2batsea View Post
RR Classic steering will require extensive modifications. You'll have to cut the fender and the radiator panel. You will need to figure out how to mount a steering pump on the engine. You'll have to find a reservoir. You will have to engineers new steering tube, steering shaft and u joint shaft. You will need a new custom track rod. The steering box will require a welded on mount plate You can find teriann's site that has a pretty good write up of a couple different approaches. It's not really worth the bother unless it's included in a comprehensive refit.
Yeah so it sounds like a classic is not the place to scavenge for steering parts! I haven't really had the chance to do any research on the 109 project yet. Working on trying to track down a cheap source for all the little plastic trim rivets and nylon grommets for my 90 resto.

Any idea on the address for "Teriann's" site? I know maybe 3 people on here.

Thank you for the guidance
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  #10  
Old December 10th, 2013, 06:39 PM
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http://www.expeditionlandrover.info/PowerSteering.htm

For me, power steering V1 was a Saginaw steering box from an International Scout, along with a Saginaw steering pump. I added a reenforcing plate and bolted it all the way thru the chassis rail.
Had to trim away the radiator support tins and the LH fender. I sourced the steering u joints and D shaft from Flaming River. I was able to cobble up a steering shaft from a scout shaft and booger welded the Series end on it so I could use the old steering wheel. It all worked but boy it was an ugly bodge.
Power steering V2.0 is part of a comprehensive resto-mod in which the chassis is already set up for a RR Classic type steering box. Since my stuff was already cut up it wasn't really too much to fit the panels. Actually, the steering has turned out to be the least of my issues, but it does look like it was made that way from the factory and not like a hack job.

Your best source for parts is Rovahfarm.com
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1966 109 5 door wagon 300Tdi "spermaceti fueled"
1994 RRC LeWiB "ruining the air behind me"
1968 2A 88

All my troubles are Rover
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  #11  
Old December 11th, 2013, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockShow View Post
Any idea on the address for "Teriann's" site? I know maybe 3 people on here.
My web site is here: http://www.expeditionlandrover.info

The current hot set up is the P-38 box, pitman arm and lower steering shaft. The earlier coiler steering boxes are a poor choice for a verity of reasons. The hot set up before the P38 was the optional power steering box from the Scout II. They have become hard to find.

The conversion does take some fabrication and welding. For instance you need to cut the worm gear off the upper steering shaft and weld on a connector to the lower steering shaft.

An experienced fabricator should be able to look at conversion pictures and figure out a successful conversion.

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1961 Triumph TR3A. Life is too short not to drive a classic British roadster.


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  #12  
Old December 13th, 2013, 04:02 PM
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Ben Goodwin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeriAnn View Post
My web site is here: http://www.expeditionlandrover.info The current hot set up is the P-38 box, pitman arm and lower steering shaft. The earlier coiler steering boxes are a poor choice for a verity of reasons. The hot set up before the P38 was the optional power steering box from the Scout II. They have become hard to find. The conversion does take some fabrication and welding. For instance you need to cut the worm gear off the upper steering shaft and weld on a connector to the lower steering shaft. An experienced fabricator should be able to look at conversion pictures and figure out a successful conversion.
Wow, your site is impressive! I think that should have everything I need to figure out which way to go on the steering, brakes, and just about everything else! Thank you!

I am sorta stuck on one thing though maybe you have seen it before but I can't figure out why any one would cut the top section of a safari roof off. Then cover the hole with steel sheet metal and seal it up with aluminum rivets and top it off with about 100lbs of bondo? A pleasant surprise to find indeed!
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  #13  
Old December 13th, 2013, 04:31 PM
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i bet the vents in the top were leaking - and PO got too annoyed with leaks bummer dude
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Old December 30th, 2013, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeriAnn View Post
My web site is here: http://www.expeditionlandrover.info

The current hot set up is the P-38 box, pitman arm and lower steering shaft. The earlier coiler steering boxes are a poor choice for a verity of reasons. The hot set up before the P38 was the optional power steering box from the Scout II. They have become hard to find.

The conversion does take some fabrication and welding. For instance you need to cut the worm gear off the upper steering shaft and weld on a connector to the lower steering shaft.

An experienced fabricator should be able to look at conversion pictures and figure out a successful conversion.

I have done both saginaw (on 88" w/200tdi) and P-38 on 109 with 5.3 vortec using TeriAnn's site for much of my research and IMO the p-38 is a much smooother box and if paired with flaming river parts an relative easy upgrade.
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  #15  
Old January 1st, 2014, 05:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockShow View Post
I am sorta stuck on one thing though maybe you have seen it before but I can't figure out why any one would cut the top section of a safari roof off. Then cover the hole with steel sheet metal and seal it up with aluminum rivets and top it off with about 100lbs of bondo? A pleasant surprise to find indeed!
Maybe someone tried to drive the truck under something that did not have quite enough vertical clearance? Something that started to peel the sunscreen off?

I would hate to think what would happen if I tried to drive my 7'4" tall Dormobile through my 7"0" tall garage door opening.

What size and shape was the hole? Located in the front sloping area or he rear flat area? You got me curious.
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  #16  
Old January 1st, 2014, 09:27 AM
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You can see where about a 5" wide section of the left side top of the windscreen was built back up with weld like a tree landed on it. The top is taller all the way through than a standard hard top would be. It has alpine windows made with plastic or Lexon and the openings are slightly irregular throughout. Plus there is a ton of bondo covering all of the seems in the roof.
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  #17  
Old January 1st, 2014, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RockShow View Post
You can see where about a 5" wide section of the left side top of the windscreen was built back up with weld like a tree landed on it. The top is taller all the way through than a standard hard top would be. It has alpine windows made with plastic or Lexon and the openings are slightly irregular throughout. Plus there is a ton of bondo covering all of the seems in the roof.

It does sound like a calamity stuck your roof and that it is a time for a visit to the used roof top store.
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  #18  
Old January 1st, 2014, 02:12 PM
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I think it could be easily fixed. I just don't want to have to redo the bondo!
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  #19  
Old October 8th, 2014, 07:53 AM
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I know this is an old thread but I came across this in my web travels. http://www.heystee-automotive.com/parts/pas/pas.htm I had a similar setup in my 1958 GMC p/u and it worked well. The nice thing is that it is easy to return to stock and if PS fails you just disconnect and drive on. I would be curious if anyone here had any experience with the Heystee PS mod.
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  #20  
Old October 8th, 2014, 08:24 AM
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Thanks for posting. I'd like to talk to them about possible ROW110 app.
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