110 XS puma white for sale in Manhattan - Page 3 - Defender Source
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  #41  
Old December 1st, 2012, 05:08 PM
Ben01
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Find a place and I'm in.

------ Follow up post added December 1st, 2012 05:10 PM ------

I think the white puma was for sale in nj a few months ago.
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  #42  
Old December 1st, 2012, 06:21 PM
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what model year is this Puma?
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  #43  
Old December 2nd, 2012, 12:05 AM
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Will Hedrick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golden747 View Post

Still doesn't explain the time stated or fine amount. Also, I would imagine if it were a really big deal rovers north wouldn't be able to supply you with parts or a new 300tdi engine for that matter considering they're land rover authorized parts dealers...
Since this discussion seems to be taking a turn towards the legal, as an attorney, I'd like to try and shed some light on the subject. There are two separate violations that happen, 1) FMVSS, & 2) EPA.

First, see below:

"Title 49 United States Code

Chapter 301 Motor Vehicle Safety (FMVSS)

Sec. 30165. Civil penalty
PENALTY A person that violates any of sections 30112, 30115, 30117-30122, 30123(d), 30125(c), 30127, 30141-30147, or 30166 of this title or a regulation prescribed under any of those sections is liable to the United States Government for a civil penalty of not more than $1,000 for each violation. A separate violation occurs for each motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment and for each failure or refusal to allow or perform an act required by any of those sections. The maximum penalty under this subsection for a related series of violations is $800,000."

So, read as each non-compliant component of the vehicle is or may be considered a separate violation. Add-up all of the non-compliant components on an imported vehicle not entering the US under an exemption (e.g., 25 year rule), and your tab will be considerably more than $1K.

Also, when EPA or CBP (I.e., US Customs and Border Protection) determines that imported motor vehicles do not meet the EPA emissions certification requirements, CBP detains or seizes the motor vehicles. EPA then contacts the importer to address the Clean Air Act violations. The statutory maximum penalty under the Act is $32,500 for each illegal motor vehicle, although penalties may be reduced for first-time violators and for importers who disclose and remedy the violation and all prior violations. CBP or EPA may also initiate a criminal action against an importer who knowingly makes false or fraudulent statements, or who omits material information required in CBP entry documents. Persons who commit these crimes are subject to a fine of up to $250,000 or imprison- ment for up to two years, or both (I.e., it's a felony)(see 42 U.S.C. 7413(c)(2)).

And importing a PUMA as a late '80's model Defender doesn't cut it either, because the 25 year exemption rule only applies to components originally manufactured for that particular model year in that particular vehicle. PUMA's were not being installed in those model years, so a late '80's model Defender with a PUMA fitted, is just as illegal as if it were being imported as a 2013 Defender (which as we all know, it probably is). And by calling it something other than what it is, you are back to committing a felony.

So, it goes without saying, illegally importing a non-compliant motor vehicle is no joke. The truth is that there are some hefty consequences that can be levied against you should you decide to "take your chances". Let me be clear, I'm not casting judgment on anyone. I'm just merely stating what the law is.
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  #44  
Old December 3rd, 2012, 11:12 AM
RoversNorth
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RN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
$1, one minute ... Who cares. I'm more concerned at the principle of breaking the law ... Not by how much I break it or how large the consequence for this particular action.

RN aren't authorized parts dealer ... They have an agreement to supply parts for vehicles that LR does not want to carry in their dealerships. They also source current and pattern parts.

The EPA regs are clear, no non EPA engines.
Greetings Jason,

We currently hold two authorized licenses with Land Rover UK. The first is for parts sales in North America, which has been in effect since 1989, and the other is for Vehicle Sales.

Regards,
RN
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  #45  
Old December 4th, 2012, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by RoversNorth View Post
Greetings Jason,

We currently hold two authorized licenses with Land Rover UK. The first is for parts sales in North America, which has been in effect since 1989, and the other is for Vehicle Sales.

Regards,
RN
Thanks for the clarification
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  #46  
Old December 6th, 2012, 01:21 PM
Michael
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post

I assume by this comment that you are in a qualified legal position to interpret the laws of this country differently from the way they are written down.

Just because they are here doesn't mean they will stay. See all the nissans that the Feds confiscated last year.

Doesn't mean I would have one. I'd just accept the risk associated.
Please elsborate on confiscated nissans.

------ Follow up post added December 6th, 2012 01:22 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post

Please elsborate on confiscated nissans.
Please elaborate too.
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  #47  
Old December 6th, 2012, 01:23 PM
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skylines..... the "real ones". the older versions.
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  #48  
Old December 6th, 2012, 01:25 PM
RoversNorth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael View Post
Please elsborate on confiscated nissans.

------ Follow up post added December 6th, 2012 01:22 PM ------



Please elaborate too.
http://zilvia.net/f/nissan-news/2819...l-imports.html

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/10/03/n...sible-illegal/

http://wot.motortrend.com/feds-begin...#axzz2EIVuTZlb

http://ca.autoblog.com/2012/05/29/wi...issan-skyline/
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  #49  
Old December 6th, 2012, 01:30 PM
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Yeah, If you search this exact topic you will see the skyline sob stories. If I owned this truck I wouldn't post it here, most of the guys on here have dealt with importation at one point or the other and know the risk associated with grey market vehicles.

Beating the system might be a thrill but having the EPA impound your new puma defender might cause you to shoot up a post office or something...

That said if I could afford this truck I would just have an english fellow buy one, bring it over with his visa and drive it like I stole it until they made me send it back.

Wash, rinse, repeat :P
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  #50  
Old December 6th, 2012, 01:32 PM
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The only Skylines that people wanted to import were the R32-R34 RB26-DETT powered GT-R's.

The problem is that the oldest RB26DETT GTR was a 1989, making it illegal to import until 2014.

Hence the seizures by the feds.

That said, in a little over a year, the first R32 GTR's will be legal to import. Collectors and importers probably stand to make good money on legal grey-market R32 GTR's - as they are extremely rare to begin with.
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  #51  
Old December 6th, 2012, 02:12 PM
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the circumstances with the nissans were different ... they used legal means to register the vehicle and did not conceal the original identity. The puma trucks have a VIN number related to a 25 year old vehicle ( with he exception of dealer trucks that they can import under their own exemptions ) ... I'm sure the feds wouldn't be at all concerned to discover the chassis VIN plates didn't match the VIN number produced by the ECU.
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Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
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  #52  
Old December 6th, 2012, 06:17 PM
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barry f
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
the circumstances with the nissans were different ... they used legal means to register the vehicle and did not conceal the original identity. The puma trucks have a VIN number related to a 25 year old vehicle ( with he exception of dealer trucks that they can import under their own exemptions ) ... I'm sure the feds wouldn't be at all concerned to discover the chassis VIN plates didn't match the VIN number produced by the ECU.
With the skylines one issue was that they were floating around on fake VINs. One of the guys busted was making them up so that is a different story. Not sure what an ECU produces VIN wise but I don't see why that matters. Forgetting the EPA rules on engines, if you could buy a puma engine on ebay with the ECU and stick it in your NAS truck who cares what VIN it produces.

I guess you can argue it will prove it isn't a 25 year old engine but this isn't rocket science. Looking at it or a 300 tdi, or td5 will tell you that.
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  #53  
Old December 23rd, 2012, 08:33 AM
budzny
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Still available! Buyer never pay the seller!
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  #54  
Old December 23rd, 2012, 08:47 AM
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Sal, please send me some info on this truck.
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  #55  
Old December 23rd, 2012, 08:56 AM
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Fred, Will call you later after biking!

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