Mercedes OM617 Powered 110 Build Up - Page 17 - Defender Source
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  #321  
Old May 8th, 2016, 11:23 AM
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The OM617 is a big improvement over the 2.5. I'm sure you'll be much happier once you make the switch to the 1.4.

I lived with the 1.2 behind my 300 Tdi for the past 5 years in both Colorado and the Blue Ridge Mountains and it sucked. Recetly I switched to a 1.4 (with a Roamerdrive) and am very satisfied with the result. The truck feels much lighter and the motor is happier. No more sustained 3.5K+ revs on long 45 mph hill climbs just to lug down and lose momentum on the upshift. And with the overdrive it's easy to stay in the "sweet spot".
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  #322  
Old May 8th, 2016, 11:59 AM
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Are you running 235/85-16s or something taller?
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  #323  
Old May 8th, 2016, 12:18 PM
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Thanks for the updates...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheway View Post
It still struggles off the line - due largely to the 1.2 XC. I've learned to manage this, but my methods are probably hard on my clutch.
- If you lose boost (choose wrong gear, stop on a hill, etc) good luck! The boosted vs. non-boosted power ration on this engine is absurd. I can't imagine driving the completely NA version of this engine.
The MW-IP is tuned to meet USA pollution standards, not performance.
If you adjust the Alda, install an intercooler, and use a manual boost controller like I did, it will go off the line much faster.
Howard will be in VA this summer, so it will be interesting to see how his 110 goes with the M-IP, a full length inter cooler, and manual boost opening the waste gate at 14 PSI instead of 7. He had to install a heavy duty clutch and R380 Stumpy to handle the extra performance the OM617 puts out with the M-IP.
We are actually swapping a 1.2 for a 1.4 in a 200TDI powered 110, because it is too slow off the line and slows down on hills.
The 1.4 is a better option unless you have the M-IP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheway View Post
- My particular OM617 is very smokey... especially on startup. In fact, it is getting worse! I may save up some money and take it to a local tech to have the timing done properly this winter
- Its a perfect match for a Land Rover ...

Overall I'm still very happy with the swap and will continue to recommend it. It isn't an LS swap, and I mean that in the good way. It is incredibly simple, near-bolt in, and maintains the rugged efficiency and adaptability of the original land rover diesel engine.
Have you had your injectors tested?
If you have one that sticks and is dumping fuel in a cylinder, it will smoke like crazy.
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Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #324  
Old May 8th, 2016, 01:48 PM
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Don Bunnell
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Great write up and I agree with Dave and what I have experienced with my OM617 swap.

Right now I am running stumpy R380 to 1.2 LT230Q to 4.1 Toyota diffs. Motor is stock but I have fresh 315# injectors. Running 255's tires.

Off the line just like Dave said - I have to work the clutch a little bit to get going. But after that I feel like it moves along pretty good. What I like about the 1.2 is that I am not in 5th gear so quickly above 40MPH. Fastest I have gone is 65MPH and I haven't hit any inclines.

According to Scrubs a modded M-IP makes a world of difference. I just got one from Barrotte on STD using Goran's parts. I also have a Holset HX30 coming in from China (genuine Holset). This summer I want to install that setup along with hooking up the plumbing to the 200tdi IC I have in the radiator shroud.

I am hoping that will give it enough power increase to make the 1.2 gearing work well.

I also agree with it leaving oil deposits like the 2.5NA. But as I go around fixing things like the valves and injectors that the leaks have been less. I feel like the IP has a good sized one and that will be fixed with the IP swap.

Dave - LMK if you want that 1.4 TC shipped up. And any pics of info on how you did the EGT prob and gauge?
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  #325  
Old May 8th, 2016, 02:48 PM
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M-pump & 411's, 255's, R380 with Ashcroft lower 5th, & 1.2case, she's crusin ok,
Egt's 875-1k at 63-70 mph
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  #326  
Old May 8th, 2016, 03:16 PM
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The OM617 is a high revving engine.
The one thing you don't want to do is under gear it if it has the M-IP.
If you rev pretty high you could see the EGTs climb.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #327  
Old July 19th, 2016, 03:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
Here is a picture of 13 adapter castings and 9 oil pan castings that went to the machine shop months ago. The second batch of oil pans for the 90 & 110 conversions is in the final stages. If you do the simple addition, the other 4 pans are almost done which are part of a 13 unit production batch which will come out in chunks through the fall and winter. Dropping these 4 off at the welding shop this morning, see second picture. Then after they are welded will go to the machine shop for the final finishing. In a few weeks we should have 4 more oil pans ready for anyone wanting a kit. In summary, have sold 1 kit from this second batch, so will have 3 complete kits for the 90 - 110 available shortly if anyone wants one. Bringing the OM617 110 to the Cove this weekend if anyone cares for a test drive. The OM617 is federalized and completely approved by all applicable US agencies, so there should be no issues with converting a 90 or 110. We also have some transmission mounts for the Short Belhousing "Stumpy" R380 and LT77 if you need these for your conversion shown in the last picture. And we still have 3 kits left for the Series IIA and III available as well. We won't run another IIA - III batch until next year. Then that should end the production run of the OM617 conversion.
hi
I have a Defender 110 with a 300 TDI with a R380 and LT230,
I have found 2 X OM603 Mercedes engine, 1987
Is your transplant kit will work for this engine, or its only for the OM617
If so, do you still have it available
And how much do you charge for the kit,
Do you have any recommendation

Can I contact you by phone
(514) 953-3218
Thanks
Claude
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  #328  
Old July 19th, 2016, 03:44 PM
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Robert Davis
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Claude:
The kits will NOT fit the OM603 engine.
The OM603 has 6 cylinders compared to the 5 of the OM617.
The OM603 is configured very differently from the OM617.
Starters and oil filters are on opposite sides.
The flywheel housing on the OM617 is completely removable.
On the OM603 the flywheel housing is cast one piece with the block making adapting to an R380 stumpy much more difficult if not impossible.
If you still want to discuss a Mercedes Conversion, I can give you a call.
Robert
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #329  
Old July 19th, 2016, 04:28 PM
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Robert- What do you think the optimal highway cruising RPM on a OM617a is?
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  #330  
Old July 19th, 2016, 05:03 PM
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High, very high.
In 1976/77 Mercedes put them in race cars and set more world records than any engine before or after.
There are people installing an M IP with external ALDA that claim 250 HP, although I haven't seen dyno results that prove this.
The USA versions have an MW IP that is adjusted to not put out any black smoke, but these can be tweeked for better performance.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #331  
Old July 19th, 2016, 05:12 PM
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Like cruising at 3k rpm, 4k rpm...?
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  #332  
Old July 19th, 2016, 05:54 PM
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It will cruise at any RPM you want.
Like 80 MPH with a 1.6 T-Case, less RPM at the same speed with a 1.4.
Unless you tune the engine, a 1.2 T-Case is a little high.
The OM617 is as smooth as a V8 off idle, but there is no real optimal crusing RPM where the engine is happy like other diesels.
It's just as happy at 5K as it is at 2K.

The revs are determined by the vehicle gearing, but the Mercedes W123 tachs go up to 6K.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #333  
Old July 22nd, 2016, 10:04 AM
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steve
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Thanks!
Only reason I ask is that I picked up an 85 300gd with an om617a. Feels a little strung at 3500 rpm at 70mph... But also seems happy with it.
Flys up hills compared to my 200 and 300tdi. I want an om617 in everything now!
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  #334  
Old July 28th, 2016, 09:16 PM
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Robert give me a call this weekend
Or I can call you
I was so busy with work
Sorry for the later reply
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  #335  
Old August 1st, 2016, 07:27 AM
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These two guys were at C&C this weekend in Great Falls VA. They look like they're having fun beating the shit out of their 300D.
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  #336  
Old August 1st, 2016, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skygrip View Post
Robert give me a call this weekend
Or I can call you
I was so busy with work
Sorry for the later reply
I PMed you my number.
Don't have yours anymore.
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RDavisinVA

Uncle "Richard" Douglas has a Land Rover with big wheels that never gets stuck... until he breaks something so it won't go. Uncle Douglas always breaks something. - Anna Crowther at the Conclave 2012 (AKA Carburetor Neck)

"What's with this death wobble, Uncle Douglas, I can't keep it in 1 lane?"
UD: "Just Power through it man!"
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  #337  
Old September 22nd, 2016, 08:12 AM
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Don Bunnell
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Updating this thread with some mods that I have done and planning on doing.

I bought an M pump from Barrote from SuperTurboDiesel earlier this year. From what I understand the M pump was fitted to euro OM617 engines. It is different than the stock MW pump and seems to be easier to modify with larger plungers. Stock size is 5.5mm and he built this one with 7.5mm

Swapping pumps was a little out of my league so I had the local garage do it. They had a bunch of experience with MW pumps and OM617 so it was doable but it took them longer with the little changes between them.

Issues that came up:
- fuel injector lines needed to be bent to fit M pump
- oil filter canister had to be removed - it's a little tight on the LR install. On the plus side they replaced the gasket which had some dripping
- motor mount had to be trimmed to fit lower valve.
- timing an M pump is a little different in it has different DV (delivery valves). We are still figuring this part out. But once we can get the valve spring out we can use the drip method to dial in timing.

The garage got the M pump installed and it ran pretty well even tho timing was little off. I took it this past weekend and the increase in power when it gets on boost is nice! And this was without the IC and the stock turbo.

On Monday I backed the 110 out of the garage and turned it off. I popped the good to look around the pump and see how we could time it.

Go to start it and it wanted to run away! I hit the stop lever and was worried as hell. I've been emailing the pump builder the last few days and trying to figure this one out.
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  #338  
Old September 22nd, 2016, 08:13 AM
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Pics (I have to do one at a time as the app is crashing on my phone):

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M Pump
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  #339  
Old September 22nd, 2016, 08:14 AM
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Mid swap

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  #340  
Old September 22nd, 2016, 08:14 AM
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Installed

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