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  #341  
Old July 22nd, 2015, 10:36 PM
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Chip
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Andrew
1994 NAS Defender 90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slammin_LWB View Post
That's basically the engine I had in my RRC. I sold him the 3.2 (M3) bottom and my engine, harness, and everything since my RRC is going a different direction.



If it hasn't been mentioned, look up Kassel Performance. They can delete EWS. Also pop in a EU2 tune to shut off the CEL when not running a SAP or secondary o2 sensors, in the stock BMW ecu for the M54. I'm running one in my 330i now since I have headers. Also got a EU2 tune. Works flawlessly. They also sell modified harnesses for fitting M54s into e30s and e36s, etc.
That's awesome Jeff! But actually a group from Germany just shared the MS43 EWS delete so there's no need to pay to have that done now. Link here, here, and here.

I do know about Kassel Performance. Please don't suggest people do illegal things concerning emissions laws in my build thread though. An EU tune, M54 headers without cats, and deleting or disabling other emissions equipment are all illegal. I intend for my engine conversion to be legal. I will not discuss this particular topic again and I kindly ask others not to as well. Thank you.
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  #342  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 11:21 AM
brshelton
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Ben
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slammin_LWB View Post
That's basically the engine I had in my RRC. I sold him the 3.2 (M3) bottom and my engine, harness, and everything since my RRC is going a different direction.



If it hasn't been mentioned, look up Kassel Performance. They can delete EWS. Also pop in a EU2 tune to shut off the CEL when not running a SAP or secondary o2 sensors, in the stock BMW ecu for the M54. I'm running one in my 330i now since I have headers. Also got a EU2 tune. Works flawlessly. They also sell modified harnesses for fitting M54s into e30s and e36s, etc.
The 3.2 swapped RRC is a shop car at Sarek Autowerke, where I work. It was pretty straight forward with the OBD1 conversion on it. I will be fitting a 2.8 OBD1 M52 into my D1 and maintaining A/C soonish.

You could also consider Megasquirt3 for the M54. It can control dual vanos. http://m54megasquirt3.blogspot.com/
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  #343  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 12:14 PM
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Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brshelton View Post
The 3.2 swapped RRC is a shop car at Sarek Autowerke, where I work. It was pretty straight forward with the OBD1 conversion on it. I will be fitting a 2.8 OBD1 M52 into my D1 and maintaining A/C soonish.

You could also consider Megasquirt3 for the M54. It can control dual vanos. M54 Megasquirt 3
The emissions requirements of a swapped engine must meet the emissions requirements of the car and model year it was originally installed in, not the emissions requirements of the car it's going into. Converting an OBD2 engine to OBD1 is illegal. You are also losing a significant amount of diagnostic capability. You will not be able to hook up an OBD2 code scanner to the engine.
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  #344  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 12:46 PM
brshelton
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Megasquirt has nothing to do with deleting emissions equipment and it would still be obd2.
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  #345  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 12:54 PM
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Andrew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brshelton View Post
Megasquirt has nothing to do with deleting emissions equipment and it would still be obd2.
An aftermarket ECU is illegal unless it has been approved by the EPA for use in a particular vehicle and then after that it cannot be modified. But if all of the emissions equipment could remain intact and emissions were not adversely affected then they may not consider it a violation. Of course it probably still wouldn't pass an inspection in California or other states that have similar requirements.

------ Follow up post added July 23rd, 2015 09:55 AM ------

All I'm saying is if you want to do things like that then go ahead and do them, but please don't be talking about it in my build thread.

------ Follow up post added July 23rd, 2015 09:57 AM ------

Start a thread in the "Misc. Chat-Chat" sub-forum or somewhere else to discuss this topic.
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  #346  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:53 PM
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Andrew
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My apologies if that seems rude. It's just that this is a public forum and can be viewed by anyone, including federal authorities. So I don't want anyone discussing things related to emissions laws, which includes emissions equipment and their function. So anyways, welcome to the forum Ben! Go ahead and make a build thread. I'm sure people would like to see your BMW Disco project.
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  #347  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:54 PM
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Adam
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Your engine conversion is illegal anyways so who cares?

http://www2.epa.gov/sites/production...ngswitch_0.pdf
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  #348  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:57 PM
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Andrew
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Originally Posted by transientmechanic View Post
Your engine conversion is illegal anyways so who cares?

http://www2.epa.gov/sites/production...ngswitch_0.pdf
No it is not.
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  #349  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 01:59 PM
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Adam
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Yes, it is. Read up on "certified configurations". Engines on their own are not certified by the EPA.

For light-duty vehicles, installation of a light-duty engne into a different light-duty vehicle by any
person would be considered tampering unless the resulting vehicle is identical (with regard to all
emission related parts, engine design parameters, and engine calibrations) to a certified configuration of
the same or newer model year as the vehicle chassis
, or if there is a reasonable basis for knowing that
emissions are not adversely affected as described in Memo 1A. The appropriate source for technical
information regarding the certified configuration of a vehicle of a particular model year is the vehicle
manufacturer.

A "certified configuration" is an engine or engine chassis design which has been "certified" (approved)
by EPA prior to the production of vehicles with that design.
Generally, the manufacturer submits an
application for certification of the designs of each engine or vehicle it proposes to manufacture prior to
production. The application includes design requirements for all emission related parts, engine
calibrations, and other design parameters for each different type of engine (in heavy-duty vehicles), or
engine chassis combination (in light-duty vehicles). EPA then "certifies" each acceptable design for use,
in vehicles of the upcoming model year.

It should be noted that while EPA's policy allows engine switches as long as the resulting vehicle
matches exactly to anv certified configuration of the same or newer model year as the chassis, there are
some substantial practical limitations to performing such a replacement. Vehicle chassis and engine
designs of one vehicle manufacturer are very distinct from those of another, such that it is generally not
possible to put an engine into a chassis of a different manufacturer and have it match up to a certified
configuration.
Therefore, practical considerations will generally limit engine switches to installation of
another engine which was certified to be used in that same make and model (or a "twin" of that make
and model, e.g., Pontiac Grand Am and Oldsmobile Calais). In addition, converting a vehicle into a
different certified configuration is likely to be very difficult, and the cost may prove prohibitive.

------ Follow up post added July 23rd, 2015 02:03 PM ------

That's not to stop you from doing it. Just know that you are not on legal high ground as you imply.
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  #350  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 02:20 PM
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Andrew
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My engine conversion is legal. This has already been discussed in other threads. But I'll go over it here for your satisfaction. My engine is going to retain the certified configuration of a USA 2006 BMW X5 "with regard to all emission related parts, engine design parameters, and engine calibrations." The new engine is smaller displacement, from a newer model year, is the same class (light duty), uses the same fuel type, and will produce lower emissions than a 94 D90 with the original V8 (and more specifically not higher than a 2006 X5). Therefore, the EPA does not consider my engine conversion to be a violation of federal law. Read that line of their memo again you forgot to highlight Adam, "or if there is a reasonable basis for knowing that emissions are not adversely affected as described in Memo 1A." Anyways, if people can't refrain from turning my build thread into an emissions law discussion then I will ask the moderators to delete my entire build thread.
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  #351  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 02:23 PM
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Jeez... let the guy build his landy! I'm not the only one eagerly waiting for this beast to be on the road! ( eagerly waiting to mimic everything that is )
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  #352  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 02:43 PM
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Did you call the EPA to confirm that it's legal or are you assuming?

Because a D90 with a 2006 X5 engine is not the same configuration as a 2006 X5. The 2006 X5 is certified, as a vehicle (complete configuration) as EPA compliant.

Generally, the manufacturer submits an
application for certification of the designs of each vehicle it proposes to manufacture prior to
production. The application includes design requirements for all emission related parts, engine
calibrations, and other design parameters for each different type of engine chassis combination (in light-duty vehicles). EPA then "certifies" each acceptable design for use,
in vehicles of the upcoming model year.

Sorry Andrew but you're outside the lines. Like I said, build it. Who cares. Just know you are doing the same thing every other engine swapper does - violating federal EPA law. Chance of this being enforced? Essentially zero. Dont act like you're above it all somehow though.
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  #353  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:02 PM
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Andrew
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Whatever Adam. I don't know if I'll post more updates.
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  #354  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:15 PM
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Living here in the peoples republik of californiastan where the emissions standards regarding any sort of engine mod are regulated beyond belief they have a procedure if you do an engine change. You do your swap and you make the engine perform in it's as delivered OEM state with all original emissions systems intact. As long as the engine is going into the same class of vehicle (light duty/light duty) and the engine is the same age as the chassis or newer you are good to go. You take it to the CA ARB referee station and they verify that everything is there and working as designed and they sign off of on it. They give you a sticker like this that states what the car is and what the donor motor came out of and what emissions stuff the smog guy needs to check for.



You think if it were illegal as far as EPA goes that CA would have any part of it? The power train is certified as a unit including emissions components. The mfg gets an engine family certified and then installs that engine family in X, Y & Z vehicles in it's product line..
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  #355  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:18 PM
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What the hell Adam? As your reading the board you say to yourself "That BMW conversion thread needs some douchiness"?

-Jeff
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  #356  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:22 PM
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Andrew
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Thank you Jake. That's good to know. So we now have proof that it's legal to swap an engine in California, which is also bound by the federal Clean Air Act. I'm very sorry I told Jeff and Ben that what they did or plan to do is illegal. Perhaps those things are also legal as I am not an authority. I feel terrible now. I won't accuse anyone of doing anything illegal from now on. That's very rotten of me.
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  #357  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:22 PM
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Jim Cheney
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Dudes, most hot rods out there violate EPA policy. Private citizens can do stuff. Motor vehicle registrations are a state issue. EPA regulations are aimed at commercial enterprises, and the enforcement power comes from the government's right to regulate interstate commerce. Many states even have procedures for documenting your re-power on the state-issued title. Sometimes states actually decide things related to this, like a few years back when Wisconsin or Minnesota or some place decided to stop issuing title docs for Pinzgauers, but that is pretty unusual. I'm not a lawyer, and my advice is worth nothing, but you all can all keep building hot rods in relative confidence and peace of mind.
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  #358  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:25 PM
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Oh, and my WA state title for my NAS 90 says "diesel" on it. I had to fill out a little slip of paper certifying that I had changed out the engine.
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  #359  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:44 PM
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Andrew
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I shouldn't even be on the computer today. It's so nice outside. Let's all go do something fun.
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  #360  
Old July 23rd, 2015, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chip View Post
Whatever Adam. I don't know if I'll post more updates.
Seriously? Someone disputes you with facts and this is how you respond?

Freaking cry baby...



Like I said, whether it is or isnt dont let that stop you from building it, its cool. But when you jump on a moral high horse and poop on others you should probably make sure what you are preaching is correct. Call the EPA and ask if youre so confident... thats the only real answer.
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