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  #1  
Old March 11th, 2004, 03:32 PM
Bill Jansz
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Alternative Powerplants- Chevy V-8

If your really like your Rover and plan to keep it for a long time, a conversion like this would pay for itself in a couple of years, all the while enjoying the benefits and pleasures of the Chevy. If your looking for and need extra Horsepower & Torque, reliability, longevity, low repair cost, replacement parts available at your local parts store today(not special order, next week). General Motors (Chevrolet) has spent hundreds of millions of dollars over the years developing a variety of parts for their cars that were both tremendously reliable and manufactured at a reasonable cost, why not take advantage of that??

True enough, a performance built 4.6 motor is a great way to go for some extra horsepower. A very well built 4.6 'Stage 3' motor with a good camshaft, head porting/polishing, increased compression, performance chip and anything else you might want to do to it, still may only produce 275hp and 300ftlb torque(ie:RPI Stage 3, 4.6lt motor). Where as a warmed up Chevrolet 350 motor, can easily reach(without trying) 350hp/350ftlb torque, without spending alot of money on exotic modifications. With the Chevy motor, you can keep the compression ratio down at 9:1 and still ran regular unleaded gas, saving you alot of $$$ in the long run. Also the fact of reliablity, low maintenance, readily available parts are a built in PLUS for this conversion.

I have nothing against the Rover powerplant, but as a Rover mechanic, I sure replace alot of Rover engines each year. Don't take it the wrong way, I think Rover has an excellent vehicle. You couldn't have a better box frame, front & rear differentials or transfer case, but as far as the aluminum Buick V-8(era 1961-1968)motor, it's a little out-dated. A rule of thumb," MORE POWER=MORE CUBIC INCHES", no other way around this. Why not have the best that both worlds can offer, Englands' Land Rover and Americas' Chevrolet. Considering Rover already uses a Buick V-8, it really wouldn't be to far out of the norm to utilize a Chevrolet V-8 replacement powerplant and 700R4 transmission combo.

I've been a mechanic for 25 + years, working on British/Europeon cars, and can see there is room for improvements with some of there powerplant/drivetrain systems. Why not opt for a tried-and-true system, like a GM(Chevy) drivetrain, since they have worked out all the bugs and have limitless combinations of readily available parts at such reasonable prices. It seems that over the years I've heard the frustration expressed by so many Land Rover/Range Rover owners that their 3.5, 3.9, 4.0. 4.2, 4.6 (Buick GM) engine just doesn't have the power and torque that they'd like or need. All kinds of attempted solutions have been tried, and many times the fix has ended up causing more problems and expense that anyone bargained for.

The EFI system could either be a GM factory computer which is programmable with some aftermarket programmers, or you could opt for a Accel EFI system with Laptop programming. The later system is infinitely adjustable for any engine combination, and is the most user friendly system available. All newer EFI systems incorporate Knock sensors to control the ignition timing, this is to prevent serious detonation and pinging problems, whereas 1995 and earlier Rovers have no Knock sensors(no timing control). When using a GM EFI system, you can have the vehicle serviced at almost any repair shop across the country, very convenient.

This 350/700R4/LT230 is a real cool combo, it is a total turn-key package by itself. The Chevy motor / transmission conversion incorporates an adapter plate, that mates up to the LT230 T-case. With all these conversion options available, horsepower and torque ratings, I like to approach and adhere to a "driveline protection" philosophy. This of course, would be to minimize the possibility of breaking parts in the balance of running gear (axles, differentials, u-joints and etc.) setup. An upgrading of these parts may also be addressed, if desired.

Due to the fact that most conversions require a lengthy explanation, e-mail is not always the most thorough and expedient method of communication. You can reach me at 405-790-0167, for a one on one look at your conversion needs, just ask for Bill Jansz.

It all has to do with CHOICES, and thank goodness for these different options. I'm trying to give Rover owners a broader platform to choice something that will fit their personal needs, that's all. This Chevy conversion is not for everyone, it's for those who want an alternative solution.

Thanks again for your inquiry, Bill Jansz.

E-mail at alohabill@sbcglobal.net
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  #2  
Old March 11th, 2004, 05:23 PM
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Mike Hippert
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Just curious whats the "average cost" I know it will differ greatly based on how warmed up the engine is but lets say a swap from a 94 D-90 3.9 to a 350 with like you said 350hp/350ft-lbs.
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  #3  
Old March 11th, 2004, 07:38 PM
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Johnathan Tisdale
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Your points are interesting and some are valid, but you appear to start at an engine swap and by the end it is an engine, tranny, and adapter to LT-230(all of which you need for that kind of power). What about driveshaft lengths and if the rig sees offroad action diffs, axles, and CVs are a real issue considering the stock lump can easily break those parts. My point is being that it will be quite costly up front but after that engine repairs can be made inexpensively with widely available parts.

Tis
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  #4  
Old March 12th, 2004, 01:07 AM
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Keith Kreutzer
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There is a lot to this kind of "conversion". While the promise of a big engine is really exciting Jonathan makes good... no excellent points... The rest of the driveline will self destruct if not addressed at the beginning... Things like diffs,cv's and the rest will be problematic if left stock on a truck used hard... The additional costs of drivshafts and those pesky"installation issues" can drive you crazy! Plus up here we have to pass emission tests that scare a lot of folks away from this sort of thing.

Once those issues are addressed you can go play with minimal worry...

Would I do such a thing? Well last weekend the 4.6 went into the Wifes Disco and at the same time the Adaptor for said SBC/ZF Autobox was completed at the machine shop...
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  #5  
Old March 12th, 2004, 12:09 PM
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Yousef Hamzeh
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Hmmm, why would someone tell him to remove a good thread? I was looking forward to see some good discussion as I'm looking for a new power plant.
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  #6  
Old March 12th, 2004, 12:40 PM
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Here's the original info Bill posted on a similar thread at www.sclr.org:

Anyone interested in a turnkey Chevy V-8 conversion?
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posted February 14, 2004 12:04 AM
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Anyone interested ? Complete turnkey installation. You choose the Horsepower & Torque.
Sure the Chevy V-8 and 700R-4 transmission might be a little heavier, but that's not a problem for a 350hp/350ftlb torque motor. New front coil springs, with a proper lb. rating, will take care of the cast iron. If this is the only 'con' about the Chevy V-8 conversion, I can give you 20 'pros' on this conversion. If your looking for and need extra Horsepower & Torque, reliability, longevity, low repair cost, replacement parts available at your local parts store today(not special order, next week). General Motors (Chevrolet) has spent hundreds of millions of dollars over the years developing a variety of parts for their cars that were both tremendously reliable and manufactured at a reasonable cost, why not take advantage of that??

The cost for this turnkey conversion, depends on all the different engine combinations ( engine size, fuel injection system, accessories, etc). A 'basic' turnkey conversion, starts at around $11,000.00, email for complete details of parts and labor involved. Compare this cost to a hyped up Rover 'Stroked' motor(motor only) between $10,000.00 to $13,000.00. With my Chevy motor/transmission conversion , you will get the most value for your money, there are so many 'new' parts used, it would be good for 100,000 + miles. Email info at alohabill@sbcglobal.net
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  #7  
Old March 13th, 2004, 10:51 AM
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Bill emailed me and the content from his original post and it has been placed back here in this post.

This thread is being moved to the Vendors Loft where we can continue an intellegant conversation as it is not really a single classified and he is looking to gain some possible customers.

Thanks
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  #8  
Old March 15th, 2004, 08:08 AM
Bill Jansz
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Rover- Chevy conversion

Hello Guys,
I'm glad to see the thread was posted, and thanks to Doug Walker for inserting my info from SCLR club. Anything to discuss, feel free to contact me. I'm also inserting my reply to Chris, when I emailed him my original post.
I've been reading some past tech topics and enjoy the threads concerning some problems and solutions. I try to give my input and share my knowledge to help in anyway I can.

This insert will be a intro about where my minds eye dwells:
To the D90 source, re Chris:
I've been a mechanic for 29 years, working on British/Europeon cars, and can see there is room for improvements with some of there powerplant/drivetrain systems, and as a Rover tech I sure replace a lot of Rover engines each year, usually because of oiling or overheating problems. Please don't take it the wrong way, Rovers have kept me working for all these years, I think overall, Rover has an excellent vehicle.
My expertise has been with the overall use of the Chevy drivetrain, for swapping purposes, whether it's a Jaguar, Austin Healy, Carmen Ghia, Jeeps or Range Rover. All my conversion are complete, with all the sub-systems of the car working properly(cruise control, instrumentation, a/c, etc)the way it should function. Over the years with doing the swaps in so many different vehicles, I would like to give Land Rover owners a viable option for improvement and enjoyment for there vehicles. I've worked out a complete conversion system for Land Rovers (certain models at this time and always upgrading to meet demands with other models). I guess I never really considered myself a vendor, just a enthusiast / customizer with a mind that wont stop thinking about improving whats out there(ie:building a better mouse trap). I'm just one of those people who desire something out of the norm, but can't pick-up the phone to order it, because no one has produced what I want. Well there I go.., lets fabricate it, because that's what I want. We are only limited to our imagination and I guess our abilities, damn it for wanting. I've attached some photos for example what was in my mind, and wasn't produced by any company at that time and may still not be available. I like superchagers and I like fuel injection, the photos are of my minds desire back in 1994, a fabrication of supercharger with multi-point fuel injection(laptop programmable). It was a desire, it became a fabrication, it's now a reality in my 1978 Camaro(which actually started life as a 1978 Trans-am).
I guess, if I was not in the right forum on the D90 Source, please modify my classing according to club rules, as you see fit.
It's been a pleasure communicating with you, thanks, Bill Jansz.
PS. Chris if you'd like to talk some more, give a call on the phone 405-790-0167, I'm a great mechanic, but a lousy typist.
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  #9  
Old July 15th, 2006, 10:00 PM
gearco
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James T. Johnston, Jr.
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I think youse guys have forgotten a couple of motors that beat the crap out of the Chevy V8. the 4 litre BMW and Jaguar. The bellhousings of both motors fit the ZF 4HP 22 automatic transmission. And both are 4 valve per cylinder high torque fuel efficient motors. Wrecked Jags and BMWs make a good source for Rover conversions. Why not consider these?
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  #10  
Old December 3rd, 2006, 05:33 AM
RoverC
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Cliff
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Well I will bet you cant source parts as cheap!
For tq look at any used LQ9 chevy engine and it will put out over 370lbs of tq stock. Play with the ECU via a diablo sport and that will go over 420 stock.
Not sure a zf4hp22 will handle all that, but a 24 may?
That engine can be had tuned for about $2800.00 total and includes everyting but a/c.
The LQ4 is similar but is a 5.3 instead of a 6.0 I think. The lq4 vortec 5.3 can get up to 25 mpg in a jeep on the highway. So 20 can be possible in a rover.
Me I went with a 4L80e GM's most HD auto and had it built by MonsterMotorsports to handle 900hp. the also mated it to the lt230 with an adaptor from Mark4x4 in aus. The t/c is an Ashcroft custom job with 1:1 high range and their newest design underdrive. Adding a disc brake instead of the drum.
Marks provided the motor mount adaptors too.
W/o an underdrive you can do it all for under $6k easy, alot less than buliding a rover or a diesel.
Now if Keith has that adaptor and you can use a zf.... that will make it super cheap. I have to adapt the D/s too. but its all time not expensive really.
When I started mine none of that existed and the engine I chose puts out 419+lbs of tq, so I wanted to be sure the tranny could stand it in the long run. I set out to overbuild it so I wont break anything.
As to breaking things, I ran my D90 w/ Supercharger and 35" SSRs and never have broken anything on any of my trips from FL to UT, CO, WY and back nor while wheeling there. Now with this setup its different and portal teks may be going in.

Follow-up Post:

Oh and by the way, there is a shop locally that will make the wiring harness for these engines a truly plug and play design. No trying to figure out what wire does what and where.
Sounds like a group buy of chevys is in order... John?
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  #11  
Old December 20th, 2007, 10:14 AM
Wakeboarder2MD
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Byron Stephens
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B U M P


Just curious if anyone has actually done this sort of thing and how it turned out?

I am looking to buy a D90 for daily driving purposes and *mild* trail use... I realize these rover engines are all gonna be old & was wondering how possible it would be to do an economical swap to a chevy powerplant. How much it would cost, can you find people to do it locally - or do you have to ship it somewhere.
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  #12  
Old December 20th, 2007, 04:15 PM
RoverC
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Cliff
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Byron,
Mine is still in the works, but mine has taken on a life of its own!
Now has a 6.2L L92 engine putting out an estimated 450hp/490tq, with the new GM 6L80e (yes a 6 speed auto!)
Really if you look around, you can find parts relatively inexpensive to do a Rover engine rebuild.
What I would do is find a used block, do a good rebuild and leave it alone.
You can put in a chevy, IF you have the adapters for the motor mounts, tranny etc, but will take some fabbing.
Find a used 4.6 Rover engine and do a rebuild, then swap if need be.
My engine at 85k+ miles was immaculate (if only the shop had put oil in the engine!) when I took it apart.
Leave it stock and enjoy the hell out of it unless youre a real motorhead and love custom work (and have the time and $$ to do it)

Follow-up Post:

Oh by the way, IMHO, you should buy it for the other way around. Get an econo for daily driving and use this on the trail. Most dont like how they ride, handle, slow, brake etc, as they are a true work vehicle and NO luxury.
Hate to see you buy one and then have to resell it once you see they arent anything like a jeep
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  #13  
Old December 20th, 2007, 04:35 PM
Wakeboarder2MD
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Byron Stephens
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Thanks for the info. As I had an Fj-40 for many years as my daily driver, a D90 would actually be a step up in terms of luxury. A/C, PS, etc.

I plan on buying one, having it as a dd for the next 4-5 years, then 'retiring' her as a weekend & trail rider. When I am out of my residency (I'm a medical student). I hope the engine I'll get will last, then I'd probably look into throwing a TD5 or 300Tdi into it.

6-speed auto. Holy shiit! 450 hp!! Wow.







Quote:
Originally Posted by RoverC
Byron,
Mine is still in the works, but mine has taken on a life of its own!
Now has a 6.2L L92 engine putting out an estimated 450hp/490tq, with the new GM 6L80e (yes a 6 speed auto!)
Really if you look around, you can find parts relatively inexpensive to do a Rover engine rebuild.
What I would do is find a used block, do a good rebuild and leave it alone.
You can put in a chevy, IF you have the adapters for the motor mounts, tranny etc, but will take some fabbing.
Find a used 4.6 Rover engine and do a rebuild, then swap if need be.
My engine at 85k+ miles was immaculate (if only the shop had put oil in the engine!) when I took it apart.
Leave it stock and enjoy the hell out of it unless youre a real motorhead and love custom work (and have the time and $$ to do it)

Follow-up Post:

Oh by the way, IMHO, you should buy it for the other way around. Get an econo for daily driving and use this on the trail. Most dont like how they ride, handle, slow, brake etc, as they are a true work vehicle and NO luxury.
Hate to see you buy one and then have to resell it once you see they arent anything like a jeep
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  #14  
Old December 26th, 2007, 02:44 PM
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Well, our adaptor is due any day. We sourced a Chevy to ZF adaptor through AA from Australia ( Scotty's), with a twist. The Chevy 4.3 V-6 is the same bellhousing as a 350( different adaptors- be specific when ordering). While not the power and torque of the 350- nor the weight, it is very close to a 4.6 in terms of output- in stock form. We are hoping for 20+ mpg on reg petrol. Rover Automotive is doing the work as kind of a joint venture of sorts, as if this is succesful, it is a tremendous option for all the Defenders, as well as Discos, RRC, etc. It is very popular in other markets, and should blend in well w/ the rest of the drivetrain w/o overloading it. Lastly, the cost should be greatly lower than the Tdi route, as a friend just completed his at a cost over $15k- just for parts.....although that does include a ZF diesel autobox, plumbing, etc.
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  #15  
Old December 26th, 2007, 06:16 PM
RoverC
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I agree about the tr5/tdi engine being way too expensive, unless you are planning to drive it 10k miles a year for 20 years.
Swapping in that smaller chevy would be a much smarter idea.
Sure you can get 28+mpg off roading, but the cost of the swap will negate any gas savings for a loooong time.

I am one of the few I know who actually drives my D90 from FL to WY, CO, UT, MT and back over and over.
For that I need a more powerful engine than a tdi, since I am loaded down and want to run 75-80 mph most of the way. I know they put out allot of tq, but I"m not confident my truck at 4500+lbs, into a headwind, uphill in the mountains would be able to maintain 70mph with any of the tiny diesels. With my 4.0 supercharged it was barely ok for me.

Here the cost of diesel is almost .75 per gallon more than reg fuel as well.
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  #16  
Old December 26th, 2007, 09:44 PM
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Cliff,

Was your D90 up for sale recently? After reading you post, I remembered seeing a web page with a white 90 built up with a SBC and I want to say if was for sale. I am really trying to chase down that page to re read the specs and check out the photos, not so much in the market for a new vehicle.
Thanks,
Matt
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  #17  
Old December 26th, 2007, 10:04 PM
RoverC
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Matt,
Let me know if you find it. I would like to see the specs too!
But mine is a 1997 BRG ST.
Matt at RW had always talked about putting in a SBC, dont know if it was his?
I can send pics if anyone wants.
How do you post pics here?
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  #18  
Old December 26th, 2007, 11:16 PM
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Cliff,
I would love to see pics of what you have going on. I did finally find what I was looking for, only it is no longer there, so to speak as the link is no good. http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...&highlight=350.

Matt
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  #19  
Old December 26th, 2007, 11:43 PM
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jim pendleton
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I think you guys are thinking of James Pierces old truck. It sold. Can't remember who ended up with it.
Vortec chev V-8 to NV 4500 trans to LT 230. He did a good job with it.

JP
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  #20  
Old December 26th, 2007, 11:59 PM
RoverC
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Maybe you could email him direct? Or Pendy seemed to know the truck as well.

Follow-up Post:

what timing....

Follow-up Post:

Here is a pic of my old setup before I swapped the 4 speed for a 6 speed auto

Its a built 4L80/85e (for sale by the way, pass the word)
Ashcroft built LT230 w/ 1:1 high range and no electronics
Ashcroft new design (as of '06) crawler box
Marks 4x4 (Australia) adapters.

I will take some of the new setup, which is the same except a 6L80e, and a custom adapter (part Marks, part mine)
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