Will the drop in fuel prices have a measurable affect on Defender prices? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old November 11th, 2014, 08:10 AM
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Will the drop in fuel prices have a measurable affect on Defender prices?

I noticed an article in the Post this morning that says the Hummer H1 is making a comeback in TX due to the drop in fuel. This will be interesting to watch.

Clay
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  #2  
Old November 11th, 2014, 08:21 AM
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yes the market will be overwhelemd due to folks upgrading to hummers
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Old November 11th, 2014, 08:42 AM
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People have really short term memory eh?
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  #4  
Old November 11th, 2014, 08:44 AM
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That's kind of odd, yesterday I was thinking to myself that I've seen a lot of H2 and H3's on the road and I've only been home for 24 or so hours...I believe I saw 5 yesterday.
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Old November 11th, 2014, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover4x4 View Post
yes the market will be overwhelemd due to folks upgrading to hummers
Ha! Sorry, I see now my post was poorly written. My first thought was the fuel prices might cause a new draw to Defenders again. Back in the early 2000's gas prices were about half what they have been recently and we had close to 400 trucks at some events. Those numbers are way off these days.

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Old November 11th, 2014, 09:35 AM
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I wonder if bumping the Section 179 depreciating deduction threshold to $102k in 2004 helped kill this >6,000 lb beast as well.
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Old November 11th, 2014, 09:37 AM
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Old November 11th, 2014, 10:09 AM
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I thought the drop in gas prices was coincident with the midterm elections, and will go up coincident with some other political event.

The death of the H1 had, in my opinion, little to do with fuel, and everything to do with its price tag:

1992: $ 40,000 ($67k in 2014 money)
2006: $140,000

My theory, and this is just a theory - is that people who can afford $140,000 cars share the following traits:

1. There aren't too many of them.
2. They can absorb high gas prices.
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  #9  
Old November 11th, 2014, 10:48 AM
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gas prices usually have very little to do with the "classic car" market. Wealth and perceived wealth usually have a much larger impact than a momentary 20% decrease in fuel prices.
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  #10  
Old November 11th, 2014, 11:15 AM
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Aviation fuel is $6-6.50 a gallon. Hasn't really affected the price of aircraft much at all. Small jets are still cheap, but they have been for about 4 years now. Still bunches of people in the pattern every time I need to fly. Lots of planes are staying on the ground from the fuel prices. My insurance buddies say claims are way off, about ╝ of what they had been before 2008. There is the problem of america's pilots greying. The average age has been climbing, since younger folks are not learning to fly. Most of the student pilots we have in this area are from abroad.
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  #11  
Old November 11th, 2014, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rijosho View Post
gas prices usually have very little to do with the "classic car" market. Wealth and perceived wealth usually have a much larger impact than a momentary 20% decrease in fuel prices.
Good point. I guess too one can look also at the housing market as a reference. Ultra-low interest rates don't sell houses like they once did. Current credit practices are level setting one's perceived wealth pretty drastically.

------ Follow up post added November 11th, 2014 11:50 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by down_shift View Post
I wonder if bumping the Section 179 depreciating deduction threshold to $102k in 2004 helped kill this >6,000 lb beast as well.
Yep, also a good point. s179 as well as 100% and 50% Bonus Depreciation back then had to help convince the wives it was a good buy. There's actually serious talk of bringing back 100% bonus depreciation permanently. But we're still behind the eight ball if you compare us to Singapore where they provide 400% depreciation on all new Pumas (as well as all other capital asset purchases).

Clay
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Old November 11th, 2014, 12:11 PM
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Will the drop in fuel prices have a measurable affect on Defender prices?

In boating it's been my observation that high gas prices help push people to sell their boats, but low gas prices don't entice new boaters. That's more a function of the state of their overall individual finances.
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  #13  
Old November 11th, 2014, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1of40 View Post
But we're still behind the eight ball if you compare us to Singapore where they provide 400% depreciation on all new Pumas (as well as all other capital asset purchases).

Clay
Good that Singapore offers some backend incentives as the total cost of car ownership is absurdly high -- starting with "bidding" on the limited number of Certificate of Entitlements that is a prerequisite to purchasing a car (expires after 10 years), then a 41% customs duty, 150% registration fee, .... the list goes on. Here is Puma 90 I saw there last year. The SPF drives Pumas as well. Even the cool all blacked out and armored ones. I was careful not to spit my gum on the sidewalk.....
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  #14  
Old November 11th, 2014, 12:45 PM
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DOW 17,000 has pushed the collector car market up all across the board.
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Old November 12th, 2014, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover4x4 View Post
yes the market will be overwhelemd due to folks upgrading to hummers
Last I checked H1 burn diesel anyway.
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Old November 12th, 2014, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crown14 View Post
Last I checked H1 burn diesel anyway.
some had petrol
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  #17  
Old November 12th, 2014, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
DOW 17,000 has pushed the collector car market up all across the board.
Buy high...sell higher?!? seems to be the NAS D90 way anyhow...
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  #18  
Old November 12th, 2014, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by down_shift View Post
Good that Singapore offers some backend incentives as the total cost of car ownership is absurdly high -- starting with "bidding" on the limited number of Certificate of Entitlements that is a prerequisite to purchasing a car (expires after 10 years), then a 41% customs duty, 150% registration fee, .... the list goes on. Here is Puma 90 I saw there last year. The SPF drives Pumas as well. Even the cool all blacked out and armored ones. I was careful not to spit my gum on the sidewalk.....
And after 10 years of ownership, you have to surrender the vehicle and go through the lottery again for another vehicle or face doubling of taxes on the vehicle. That's my understanding anyway.
The government in turn, sells the vehicles in Malaysia.
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  #19  
Old November 12th, 2014, 10:10 AM
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Sounds about right. You also have to like the casino entry levy assessed on Singaporeans. Built to cater to and grab a share of Chinese $$, entry is free for visitors and expats. http://www.ifaq.gov.sg/CRA/apps/fcd_...spx#TOPIC_6370


"The entry levy system is one of the casino safeguard measures put in place to protect Singaporeans and Permanent Residents (SCPRs). It is meant to remind SCPRs that gambling is an expense and not a way to make a living."

"The $100 entry levy is valid for every consecutive 24 hours and the $2,000 entry levy is valid for a consecutive period of 12 months."
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  #20  
Old November 12th, 2014, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crown14 View Post
Last I checked H1 burn diesel anyway.
Lots of the civilian ones were gas.
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