Why the non-NAS defender market is not necessarily a great idea - Page 2 - Defender Source
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  #21  
Old November 7th, 2015, 04:20 PM
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Shops - this thread can do without the sales pitches.
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  #22  
Old November 7th, 2015, 04:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenmountainrover View Post
I been importing them for 5 years now. I swear it's getting harder every year to find a good example. I thought every year it would get easier and it has been the exact opposite
+1

Importing a Defenders is a lot of work. AND, since they have to be mostly original to import them, you need someone to upgrade them once in the States. This is difficult and expensive and time consuming.

Fewer and fewer Defenders will be imported every year.
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  #23  
Old November 7th, 2015, 04:27 PM
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Somebody just please put me a new 110 in storage in the UK. When it's eligible to import holler at me. I'll sell or trade my NAS for it. What a great retirement gift.
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  #24  
Old November 7th, 2015, 05:21 PM
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Land Rovers have never qualified as investments.
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #25  
Old November 7th, 2015, 05:56 PM
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Not true. I know a couple guys using Rovers as long term investments. Mainly with Pinkie's, Shorlands, and series 1's
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  #26  
Old November 7th, 2015, 07:25 PM
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Having read through the op's original post, I have no idea what the op is even asking. He actually isnt even asking a question.

It sounds a bit like, "I can't afford a NAS. I don't want to buy a ROW. Let me give a totally speculative reason why I am justified in not buying a ROW truck. Really I am just frustrated at how expensive defenders are."

I recommend he buys a 1998 corolla for $500. It will never depreciate since the supply is fixed.
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  #27  
Old November 7th, 2015, 07:38 PM
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For sure prices of Defenders are ricing, in Europe and in US. Two years ago I used to sell nice LHD 5 door 110's in the high teens. No way, this is possible anymore. Prices in Europe are going up really fast and mainly due to demand in US. Every original 110 5 door, LHD, which comes up for sale , sells within hours, just to show up a few weeks or months later in US.

There are hardly any 110's left anymore and I wouldn't be surprised if there are more LHD Defenders from the 80's in USA then in Europe at this moment. For sure there are more for sale in US then in Europe.

Also there will hardly be anything more availably in the next coming years. Yes, every year the 25 year rule moves on. Remember though that Land Rover hardly sold any Defenders in the early 90's. The Discovery was the car to go for and Defender sales really were poor. I remember I bought my first new car back in 1995, a brand new 110 300Tdi. This was one of only 15 sold that year in The Netherlands....
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  #28  
Old November 7th, 2015, 08:48 PM
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While Defenders may not go up in value, in my decade+ of owning a ROW 110 my sense is that if nothing else it has held its value. I could sell it for what I paid for it. That alone is pretty impressive methinks.

But the best way to own a D is to never have any plans to sell. It is like a Swiss watch (ahem). Pass it down to your kids.
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  #29  
Old November 7th, 2015, 08:52 PM
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I love mine. Never worked so much on a truck and couldn't be happier. I'll find someone worthy to give it to when I can't drive anymore... But I ain't never selling it... Too attached...
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  #30  
Old November 8th, 2015, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoronos View Post
Having read through the op's original post, I have no idea what the op is even asking. He actually isnt even asking a question.

It sounds a bit like, "I can't afford a NAS. I don't want to buy a ROW. Let me give a totally speculative reason why I am justified in not buying a ROW truck. Really I am just frustrated at how expensive defenders are."

I recommend he buys a 1998 corolla for $500. It will never depreciate since the supply is fixed.
Correct, not asking anything. Simply sharing a thought/theory I have to my fellow LR enthusiasts.

Correct, I cannot afford a NAS 110 :/ , well not without denying my family food and college And if I could, I wouldn't buy one for several reasons. ... Mainly because of the below point. I would/will get a ROW truck.

Incorrect, never said I didn't like ROW defenders. Not sure where you got that.

Only saying that ROW defender market value in the U.S. could remain relatively flat as next year importables ones come online. Unlike for example a 944 turbo S which is the equivalent of a NAS defender in that it's a U.S. car of limited production and high demand in the U.S. A ROW 944 turbo market value would be similar to a ROW defender. Relative market value in the U.S. is lower and will remain lower than a NAS. So I wouldn't give up my turbo for a ROW. But I would save and outright buy a ROW. I would also sell my 951 for a NAS D90.
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  #31  
Old November 8th, 2015, 02:45 PM
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The clean unmolested original ROWs will do fine. The run of the mill ones are scary. The NAS market is probably at its peak. But as people become disenchanted because they cant bring themselves to spend $60k on a 20 year old truck, prices will ease off again but not much.
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  #32  
Old November 8th, 2015, 03:12 PM
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Why are Ex Mil LR's scary?

Nothing scary with good old basic honest Ex Mil Land Rover Defenders.The civvy one's are the one's to be scared of!!! They can be bodged up with a host of problems.And they only have a bit of extra trim bolted on to make them visually more comfortable,-they are still the same vehicle.ExMil are better looked after in service, and have a heavy duty chassis,with no expense spared on servicing.
How do you view a Willys MB against a CJ5/6/7 = scary? Both are crude and basic,but good.
LandRover Defenders are basic simple old trucks.Not Range Rovers.-Sure you can improve them.
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  #33  
Old November 8th, 2015, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
I know people in Europe buying new LHD 110s with AC and storing them.
When production ends next month the demand for new Defenders will be the same.
In a year or more those who stored them will be able to double and triple their investment.
Having spoken to people that will or have made sure they traded theirs in before the warranty expired I would respectfully disagree with this statement. The real investment I feel is in the "forever" truck, as in pre 2007, galvanised chassis, bulkhead and B/C pillars, then you know what you have and will have in the future.
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  #34  
Old November 8th, 2015, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broadstone View Post
Having spoken to people that will or have made sure they traded theirs in before the warranty expired I would respectfully disagree with this statement. The real investment I feel is in the "forever" truck, as in galvanised chassis, bulkhead and B/C pillars, then you know what you have and will have in the future.
Chris:
Let me state this again, believe it or not, I actually know of 2 people in Continental Europe warehousing LHD 110 5 door vehicles with AC.
They will get double or triple what they paid for them after December when there is none to be had.
It may take a year or so, but it will happen.
The demand outside UK is there and it will continue to be there regardless of who traded in what where.
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  #35  
Old February 6th, 2016, 08:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDN38 View Post
There are more potential buyers in the US, the Canadian market for these is pretty small.

Add the fact that if you want a Defender, you can get a 15 year import for less than a 22 year old NAS truck. It further reduces the marketability of the NAS model in Canada. But there are still a few NAS purists north of the border.
That's going to be an interesting point for the US market when the NAS hits 25 years old.
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  #36  
Old February 6th, 2016, 09:13 AM
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The 25 year old series import market never seemed to me to be as lively as the 25 year old Defender /110 market. It existed but smaller.

There are too much price speculation in Tarted up 25 year old Defenders right now. If I wanted to spend six figures on a Defender I'd call ECR or buy a used ECR built one.
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #37  
Old February 6th, 2016, 09:14 AM
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In about 8-10 years there will be plenty of trucks available when the td5's came in high demand in continental Europe after some crazy american's danced around a yellow d90 in some music videos the Europeans caught on. I see plenty of trucks that are LHD that are available but the effort it takes to collect them is what keeps my collection from expanding. As for prices yes they are going up very very fast and the stronger dollar isn't helping. 50th Anniversary V8s are now already going up years before being eligible. I need a warehouse over there to be able to buy them 2 years before.. and you age them like good cheese.
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  #38  
Old February 6th, 2016, 09:35 AM
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The number of companies importing and rebuilding trucks will eventually force the newer non-established companies to have to reduce price to attract business. This should bring the prices of imports/rebuilds down to real world. You can already see that happening to some extent. Johan offers vehicles at very competitive prices. A 10-15k Johan truck was a GB4x4 25-30k truck from what I've seen over the years based on pictures and descriptions.

Eventually the only trucks that hold value will be the factory galvanized chassis ones, special edition(e.g. Tomb Raider 90, Tomb Raider 110 double cab, 50th V8 edition, Fire & Ice, etc.), and top of the line Td5 & Puma 5 doors.

The desire for rebuilt Defenders will also decrease when LR releases the Defender replacement. All the folks who find them "special" because of the rarity will lose that desire when their desire to be the first kid on the block with the "new" toy overwhelms them. Especially if it enters the market at a price point of $55k like some articles have said. Ohhhh it looks tough and adventurous but is more expensive than the most expensive Jeep Wrangler Unlimited... I must have it.
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  #39  
Old February 6th, 2016, 09:52 AM
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Thats assuming the new defender doesnt look like an FJ.
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  #40  
Old February 6th, 2016, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by phoenix37 View Post
Thats assuming the new defender doesnt look like an FJ.
I don't think it'll matter.
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