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  #21  
Old November 25th, 2005, 03:36 PM
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Christian Shea
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I've got nowhere near that amount of cash, don't know much about gears so I'm not sure if the idea of one offs is completely out of the ballpark so forgive me if it is.
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  #22  
Old November 25th, 2005, 03:43 PM
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Dave- I can't thank you enough for taking the time to share some of your wisdom and experience. $100 per hour? Don't undersell yourself! That's some great info.

Christian- Don't give up hope. It seems to me that somewhere I read that Volvo made them with 2 different gear ratios. One was high the other was low. I was hoping that one might give us enough legs to take out on the highway on 37's. If that's the case, I'd even look into an underdrive for off road. That would be fawking cool.

In any case, I promise I will post what I find!



Thanks again for the help guys.

Rod
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  #23  
Old November 25th, 2005, 03:50 PM
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IMO, it make more sense starting with a 110. Bobtail it. Put in a 90 side mounted fuel tank. Put the portals in and just move the radius arm chassis mounts forward as needed. 39.5" Iroks would be perfect. It is too much lift for a 90 if you actually seriously offroad the thing. and why do this unless you were going to do the serious off roading. Nothing ruins your day more than back rolling your full bodied rig.
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  #24  
Old November 25th, 2005, 03:57 PM
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Christian Shea
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Rod the gears that are the "fast" gears are 5.97 if I remember right and they are as good as it gets. The other ratio is worse at 7.14. There is another ratio I think that slotted in between that was a mid range but again not the right ratio for a smaller tire. I haven't quite given this up yet, but it just seems like the ratios are the real problem here for us with d90s. Makes me sort of wish for that red 110 from ECR and slap some portals on that hog.
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  #25  
Old November 25th, 2005, 05:35 PM
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There is one other option that is worth looking into. Perhaps you could drop in a 1to1 t-case from an early RR. This would reduce your gearing 17% So, if you went from 3.73 (or whatever you have) to 5.97 thats a 38% increase. Then you go from 31s to 37's thats a 16% decrease. So if you add 17+16 you get 33% higher gearing to offset the 38% lower gearing. So in theory, your RPMs would only go up at any given time by 5%. This is some seriously ugly math but better than taking the time to actually figure it out exactly. At 5in of lift provided by the portals and 37's you would heve to trim very little and could keep all your road manners. Soooo, it might not be dead for you Assuming that anything I said here is correct. But, I did something similar with switching from a 1.4 t-case to 1.2 and running 6.20 gears. I bet Red90 might have more info on the RR t-case swap??
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  #26  
Old November 25th, 2005, 05:42 PM
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From what I understand you can buy modern 1:1 gears from Ashcroft with the proper splines, drilled input gear, etc..

5.97 / 3.54 * 1.00 / 1.22 * 32 / 37 = 120%, So 20% lower gearing from a 1.22:1 transfer case.

or

5.97 / 3.54 * 1.00 / 1.41 * 32 / 37 = 103%, so 3% from a 1.41:1 t. case.

But I hear the 5.97 axles are hard to find.
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  #27  
Old November 25th, 2005, 06:12 PM
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Christian Shea
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I looked on their site and was unable to find such gears but I'm sure you are probably right. Seems like a hell of an idea that might just work out. When I emailed xtremevehicles I was told that they were looking for the 5.97s right now and that I could be put on a waiting list. I am also planning on emailing gon2far in the uk to see what the story is there. In addition I read on the site that they were planning on creating some sort of setup to go on coilers.

Oh, thanks go out to John and David for such helpful and educating info!
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  #28  
Old November 25th, 2005, 07:17 PM
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I made a quick pit stop at xtremevehicles on my way home from work. Sure enough, there is no pile of portal axle assblys lying around like I had hoped might be the case. There were 4 C303's parked there in the yard though, and I got my first "in person" look at the axles. Pretty cool. I'm not on the list yet. Hell, I don't know which axles I want yet. It seems like I read there are differences between center axles and rear axles. Maybe one lines up with the t-case better than the other?

I need to do more research...

Yeah, your right Christian, David and Red's input is great!

Thanks alot guys.
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  #29  
Old November 25th, 2005, 07:47 PM
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Christian Shea
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I think the 6 wheel version is the one with the centered axles and I also think they were the ones with the lower gearing so probably rules them out on two counts regardless. Also I think the fast geared 4 wheel c303 axles are the ones offset to the correct side so they are also most desireable.
Rod, I'm not on the list yet either and won't go ahead with it until I could find a viable way to make my beast road worthy for everyday use.

Is it wrong I laid in bed the other night with my girlfriend and dreamed about this and 37s instead of listening to her?
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  #30  
Old November 25th, 2005, 08:08 PM
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Oh,shit.
Laughing my fawking arse off!!!!!!!

Last night my girlfriend thought I had eaten too much turkey and that's why I couldn't sleep. I got about an hour is all-couldn't stop thinking about this project.

Amazing parallel.
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  #31  
Old November 25th, 2005, 08:47 PM
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stupid. all you need is armor a tough drivetrain and a heavy foot. You suckers out there with those dry rocks couldnt do shit out here in the east with all the rain

Follow-up Post:

hell yeah 3rd page
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  #32  
Old November 25th, 2005, 09:45 PM
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Now the girlfriend is pissed at me (god knows why?)

All the pieces of the puzzle are falling into place for an epic build.



Ah Phil........ You are a treasure.
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  #33  
Old November 27th, 2005, 07:46 PM
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Christian Shea
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David,
I was searching for the pictures and description of that 3 link alternative you were speaking of, I searched and searched but didn't come across it. At any rate if you could repost pics and/or description that would be great. I was going to go with the 3 Link over the winter but if I can do this cheaper and more simply I would consider it.

Also, anymore progress or comments from anyone on the portal dream/nightmare
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  #34  
Old November 28th, 2005, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtg067i
David,
I was searching for the pictures and description of that 3 link alternative you were speaking of, I searched and searched but didn't come across it. At any rate if you could repost pics and/or description that would be great. I was going to go with the 3 Link over the winter but if I can do this cheaper and more simply I would consider it.

Also, anymore progress or comments from anyone on the portal dream/nightmare

Huh? I don't know why you could not find it. Here are the picts. In a nutshel, its just the two bolts moved closer together on one side to limit the binding effect on the axle. This allows the front end to travel about 13.5in on the shock. With 14in coilovers I could compress each side to .5in of shaft showing with the other side extended all the way. I do not know if this is better than a 3 link, but it runs about $100 worth of fab time and drives on the road perfectly. I would def recommend this on the portals as it does not suffer from the increased stress of the center link on a 3 link design.

They are just on top of the axle for clearance.

edit: Please forgive the primitive and disgusting rover outers. These were pre D60 pics
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  #35  
Old November 28th, 2005, 12:47 AM
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Christian Shea
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Sorry I realized where it just was, I must have skipped over the page or something so many apologies. Forgive me for not quite following, when you say you made the bolts closer do you mean you made it so the radius arms are closer together on the axle now or that the curved part of the arm is shortened so that the bolts are nearer one another? If you modified the arms do you think it affects strength? I read something to that effect about the RTE castor corrected arms. I think if I went this way it only set me back 100-200 for the mod and gets similar results as the 3 link I would go coilovers instead of external shock mounts...seems about the same investment
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  #36  
Old November 28th, 2005, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtg067i
Sorry I realized where it just was, I must have skipped over the page or something so many apologies. Forgive me for not quite following, when you say you made the bolts closer do you mean you made it so the radius arms are closer together on the axle now or that the curved part of the arm is shortened so that the bolts are nearer one another? If you modified the arms do you think it affects strength? I read something to that effect about the RTE castor corrected arms. I think if I went this way it only set me back 100-200 for the mod and gets similar results as the 3 link I would go coilovers instead of external shock mounts...seems about the same investment

No need to be sorry about anything! The curved part of the arm is shortened so that the two bolts are closer to eachother. I think if the arm is modified well it will not effect strenth at all, the shorter distance between the bolts actually lowers the stress. The arm is real stout. One thing to consider though, the coilovers are sweet. They net me 22in of tire movement, but if you wanted to mount 14in with no lift (assuming you get 5 from the portals) they would probably have to be through your hood. I had 3in of lift and about 1.5-2in of room that I could move the shock up without going through the hood.
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  #37  
Old November 28th, 2005, 02:47 PM
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David, I need to see a picture with those 39's on.
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  #38  
Old November 28th, 2005, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckon37s
I think if the arm is modified well it will not effect strenth at all, the shorter distance between the bolts actually lowers the stress. The arm is real stout.
But moving the connection points closer together increases the forces at the bushings from braking and acceleration. This must increase stress. Also putting the arms on top increases the loads. This is probably OK, but if it were me I'd check the numbers before trying it on a portal.
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  #39  
Old November 28th, 2005, 06:03 PM
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Johnathan Tisdale
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David, I need to see a picture with those 39's on.
Will he change his name to Buckon39s?
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  #40  
Old November 28th, 2005, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Red90
But moving the connection points closer together increases the forces at the bushings from braking and acceleration. This must increase stress. Also putting the arms on top increases the loads. This is probably OK, but if it were me I'd check the numbers before trying it on a portal.

Your probably right. But keep in mind that the change is minimum and only on one arm. I run on top of the axle because I can, but it does not give any advantage other than clearance of the arms under the axle. I would be willing to bet that this is way stronger than the center link on the 3-link. I would feel safer with this than a 3-link on a portal, but in the end, it's all how you build it. You can make a 3-link beefy, but if your building all from scratch, then a 4 link would be my choice.

As to the portals, I made a call today and the only other option as I see it is to swap center sections. If you bought the axles for whatever you are going to buy them for, you could have a Ford9in center jigged and welded in for $450 an axle. Then you have to fill it with guts. So add $$ for whatever locker you would want and gears. Lets say $150 for gears, $400 for Detroit, $250 for install. So basically $2500 for the pair of axles finished to your specs (included sand plast and repaint, ready to drop in). So if you drop $4000 on the axles thats $6500 total. Still damn good for two axles like that. But, your starting to get a little expensive.

And with the 9in you would flip the diff so there would be some serious drive shaft clearance. Maybe even too much if you keep the stock height minus the portal lift. If I am not mistaken, the 9 has gears as high as 2.84. Hope that help (but probably not!).

"David, I need to see a picture with those 39's on."

Who said I was running 39's??? I sold my 37x15's to go to 35x24's Bling bling baby.
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