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  #1  
Old January 11th, 2015, 05:51 PM
Roverlab
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Trevor Griffiths
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Tech discussion- not Series or Defender

I received a call from a customer with an issue on his LR3. The brake pedal is rock solid with nearly 0 travel and subsequently no braking!
Took it for a test drive and confirmed the symptom, an then suddenly had full brakes available. Confirmed that the vacuum line from the engine to the tee for the booster and the EGR was intact. When the brakes were working, turning off the engine and pumping the brake pedal yielded about 2 pumps before the boost was gone.
Next day, same symptoms, same result.


I did find the problem, but was curious what sort of diagnosis you guys will come up with!
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  #2  
Old January 11th, 2015, 06:15 PM
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Not moving at all? My first guess would be something obstructing the brake pedal such as the brake light switch or some trim maybe. My second guess would be a bad master cylinder or brake booster.
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  #3  
Old January 11th, 2015, 07:41 PM
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Moisture in vacuum lines froze denying vacuum assist?
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #4  
Old January 11th, 2015, 08:11 PM
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Moisture in brake fluid freezing.
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  #5  
Old January 11th, 2015, 08:15 PM
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Not enough free travel in pedal-to-master push rod? Presuming these newnfangled things still have such a thing.
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Old January 11th, 2015, 09:09 PM
Roverlab
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Trevor Griffiths
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When I pulled the vacuum line from the booster and peered in, I could see rust on the surfaces. Popped the rubber bung out, stuck a hand operated vacuum pump hose into the reservoir and pulled out nearly 3 oz of water.
It was freezing overnight and not allowing booster internals to move until temp in the engine compartment came up.
So problem identified, but I do not know where all the water came from. customer mentioned this happened once last winter when the temp dropped into the single digits then as well. They've owned this Rover just a little over a year, so not a lot of detail about service history prior to their ownership.
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  #7  
Old January 11th, 2015, 09:20 PM
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How did the water get in..... Found the problem, but not the root cause
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Old January 11th, 2015, 09:45 PM
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Wow, that's a new one for me!
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  #9  
Old January 11th, 2015, 11:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy View Post
How did the water get in..... Found the problem, but not the root cause
So I answered the first question right. Being a vacuum any leak in the pipe will invite moisture in.

Once enough accumulates and freezes bingo.
Now replace the pipes!
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #10  
Old January 12th, 2015, 11:11 AM
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Agreed, the issue now is how did the moisture get in there? No evidence of staining around the booster or master cylinder. engine performance is good and no fault codes. No evidence of repairs that might have damaged the pipes. Will have a new booster here Wednesday: maybe we'll see something as we dismantle.
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  #11  
Old January 12th, 2015, 11:20 AM
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The guy at Pepboys topped it off with water?
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  #12  
Old January 15th, 2015, 11:48 AM
Roverlab
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Trevor Griffiths
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Replaced the booster yesterday, left the Rover outside- around 18* F, no issues today as expected.

Found no evidence of any compromised seals on the booster, or the joint between the master and booster. The original booster had a block of ice inside and had melted overnight on the radiant heat shop floor.
So far, we have drained over 8oz of dirty water.
Stumped.
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