Sub MOA out of box bolt action? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old September 13th, 2011, 10:03 AM
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Sub MOA out of box bolt action?

Looking for a non-taticool rifle that will shoot sub moa groups out of box. Long or short action something around 30-06 or larger. Looking for flat trajectory medium to long range

I like the look of the win model 70 super grade, dont mind paying extra for nice wood.

I own a CZ 452-ZKM ultra lux in .22 LR and love it

Id also say that above 2.5k is pushing my limits


Ah and im also in the market for an SVT40, anyone have one to sell?
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  #2  
Old September 13th, 2011, 01:43 PM
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Send a message to Gunmaker here on the forum. I am 99% he builds custom bolt guns. No first hand experience, but he owns a Defender...
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Old September 13th, 2011, 04:11 PM
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All my rifles shoot well below an inch @ 100 yards. All my rifles are Sako's

I would go for a 300 win mag, with blued barrel, and a synthetic stock.

I hand load and shoot at Davis in Goshen, NY on a regular basis. I have loads that I could help you with ranging from 150 grain up to 220 grain....


My Favorite is a Sako Deluxe in 300 win mag (shoots 3/8" when I do my part), Have take a mule deer at 528 yards, a caribou at 420 yards, and a grizzly bear at 220 yards.....
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Old September 13th, 2011, 04:51 PM
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Ha small world, I go to Davis as well. They are about 15 min from my place in greenwood lake.

I was either thinking of 300 win mag or WSM. Ive never even handled a Sako, only read about them. It is a huge issue that i want something with a wood stock?

The most accurate non 22 rifle i own is a 1944 Mosin that shoots 5 n groups with PPU factoy fmjs @ 100 yards.




Just noticed that sako is a finn brand, and they they were a retooling manufacturer for mosins...Learn something new everyday
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Old September 13th, 2011, 04:59 PM
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My kid's ruger 10/22 shoots sub MOA out of the box @ 100 yds LOL

What are you trying to achieve distance wise? are you going for the 300 - 600 - 1000 ?

When you say non tacticool are you referring to EBRs or any non wood rifle?
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Old September 13th, 2011, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Naplm00 View Post
Ha small world, I go to Davis as well. They are about 15 min from my place in greenwood lake.

I was either thinking of 300 win mag or WSM. Ive never even handled a Sako, only read about them. It is a huge issue that i want something with a wood stock?

The most accurate non 22 rifle i own is a 1944 Mosin that shoots 5 n groups with PPU factoy fmjs @ 100 yards.




Just noticed that sako is a finn brand, and they they were a retooling manufacturer for mosins...Learn something new everyday
I will be up there probably on Saturday shooting my 300 win. I am loading up 180 grain Accubonds with Rl22 powder. That is what I am taking to Montana and Kansas this year.....

Sako has a great inventory at the Beretta store on Madison Ave. Best to actually buy from Gunbroker.com or Cabelas.....

I would stay away from Weatherby. Ammo can be expensive, hard to find in certain areas and I dont trust a rifle company that seperates guns that test well and ones that don't. They then charge you more for the ones that test better.

I have met and discussed the Sako line with one of thier engineers who has been employed with them for 40+ years. He will respond to emails and give you a plethera of information regarding a gun and ammo selection. This is a nice gun http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=250972626

Stay away from the Sako's with borfers steel marked on the barrel...
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  #7  
Old September 13th, 2011, 05:29 PM
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Like Ii said im looking fro something chambered in 30-06 or larger and a bolt. Not looking to drop like 3grand on a national match m1A

Taticool = military type rifle with a shitload of rails and stupid crap all over it. I prefer wood over syn. Medium to long range for me is 200-500 yds. I not a traveling hunter and don't need canyon wall to wall capabilities, just looking for something nice.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugbier View Post
My kid's ruger 10/22 shoots sub MOA out of the box @ 100 yds LOL

What are you trying to achieve distance wise? are you going for the 300 - 600 - 1000 ?

When you say non tacticool are you referring to EBRs or any non wood rifle?
------ Follow up post added September 13th, 2011 05:31 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
I will be up there probably on Saturday shooting my 300 win. I am loading up 180 grain Accubonds with Rl22 powder. That is what I am taking to Montana and Kansas this year.....

Sako has a great inventory at the Beretta store on Madison Ave. Best to actually buy from Gunbroker.com or Cabelas.....

I would stay away from Weatherby. Ammo can be expensive, hard to find in certain areas and I dont trust a rifle company that seperates guns that test well and ones that don't. They then charge you more for the ones that test better.

I have met and discussed the Sako line with one of thier engineers who has been employed with them for 40+ years. He will respond to emails and give you a plethera of information regarding a gun and ammo selection. This is a nice gun http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=250972626

Stay away from the Sako's with borfers steel marked on the barrel...

Ill be making a trip up to cabelas in CT in the next month or so, ill let you know when i roll out. Thanks for all the insight on the sako, there weren't even on my radar, id love to join you for a shoot this weekend but im booked on sat. i let you know next time?
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  #8  
Old September 13th, 2011, 08:48 PM
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if you time cabelas right you can get a great deal. I will go up to davis about 3 more times this year.

Most new guns will shoot under an inch if you hand load specifically for that rifle.

That being said you need about 3 lbs of poowder and probably 4 different bullets to try all the possible combinations to get it to shoot that well...... That is why my 300 win mag is not for sale....
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  #9  
Old September 13th, 2011, 08:56 PM
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  #10  
Old September 13th, 2011, 10:53 PM
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Maybe a progressive loader would be a better buy then at this point. A a whole lot a research
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  #11  
Old September 13th, 2011, 11:22 PM
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You guys ever been to The Trading Post in Kittery Me. ? I spend hours in their huge used gun dept everytime I go.
Looks like the have six sako's. Just accross the river from Portsmouth NH and just down the road from MB's shop.

http://www.ktpguns.com/interior.php/pid/28
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Old September 13th, 2011, 11:36 PM
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Quote:
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You guys ever been to The Trading Post in Kittery Me. ?
Small world -- family friend is the lead gunsmith there. Their used selection is amazing.
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Old September 13th, 2011, 11:51 PM
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Small world -- family friend is the lead gunsmith there. Their used selection is amazing.
yeah despite the fact we went to arch rival colleges we seem to have a lot in common.
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Old September 14th, 2011, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Naplm00 View Post
Maybe a progressive loader would be a better buy then at this point. A a whole lot a research

I assume you mean realoader.

The RCBS Rock Chucker is a fine loader. Once I am set I can load about 50 cartridges in about 2 hours. I weigh each charge with a digital scale and measure every casing and final cartridge with a caliper.

The easiest way to get a gun to shoot well is finding the Maximum Overall length of the cartridge it will take. You will need to do this with every type of bullet you load for the gun (a round nose will be different than a partition or accubond). Watch this vid.

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Old September 14th, 2011, 12:04 PM
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Remmington 700 is the bolt gun to get.

I am partial to the VS (a PSS with a lighter stock), but I would get a 5r (if you can live with .308 and synthetic).
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Old September 14th, 2011, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
I assume you mean realoader.

The RCBS Rock Chucker is a fine loader. Once I am set I can load about 50 cartridges in about 2 hours. I weigh each charge with a digital scale and measure every casing and final cartridge with a caliper.

The easiest way to get a gun to shoot well is finding the Maximum Overall length of the cartridge it will take. You will need to do this with every type of bullet you load for the gun (a round nose will be different than a partition or accubond). Watch this vid.



nice info here, I took out the lyman reloading manual from the library some time ago and read through it

------ Follow up post added September 14th, 2011 03:06 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
Remmington 700 is the bolt gun to get.

I am partial to the VS (a PSS with a lighter stock), but I would get a 5r (if you can live with .308 and synthetic).


My buddy has one in .308 that ive never liked. I also prefer the safety to be the on bolt type instead of the in the stock type.

EDIT: I guess im pickier that i previously thought
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  #17  
Old September 15th, 2011, 08:00 AM
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Seems like you can't swing a dead cat these days without hitting a sub m.o.a. bolt gun. That part won't be a problem. I share your fondness for the model 70 Winchester. In my opinion it is the perfect design for a hunting rifle.
You might want to obtain an up to date reloading manual. There are a lot of new powders and bullets these days. The powder manufacturers also provide data for all of their powders on line now, too.
I never did hear what you intend to hunt but there are lots of sporty new chamberings out there to choose from in addition to the old standbys.
I always enjoy putting a new rifle on the rack. Have fun!

Rod
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  #18  
Old September 15th, 2011, 10:37 AM
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I think the version of the manual i was reading was from the mid-90s, I should just buy a new version.

hunting will be limited to whitetail and boar, so in reality i don't need a magnum cartridge, but i don't own one and would like something around there. Mostly target shooting.


Last time I actually bagged a deer I was using my Marlin 1894 in 44 mag. It was a lucky shot
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  #19  
Old September 15th, 2011, 10:50 AM
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Not trying to start a debate....


1. Get a 300 win mag or 7mm, you can load them light or heavy.
2. Get the Nosler reloading manual (#6). I am partial to Nosler and their data.
3. Put the most expensive scope you can afford on top of it (Zeiss or similar).
4. Have somebody who mounts scopes for a living put it on for you.


If you want custom ammo call Nosler up and they will make it for you. It is custom ammo that is only slightly higher than factory pricing.
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Old September 15th, 2011, 10:50 AM
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I've got a lot of time behind bolt guns, everything from milsurps, classic winchesters, and modern stuff such as Ruger 77, Remington 700 and such.

If I were to buy a new hunting rifle, out of the box, looking for pure accuracy... I'd go with a new Savage model 11 with the accu-trigger and accu-stock. I love the Winchester 70, particularly my pre-'64, but you spend a lot more going with a Remington or a Winchester to get the same performance as the Savage. This is money you can spend on good glass, and reloading gear.

For white tail and boar I'd lean toward a .243 Winchester. Though .308 would also be fine as well, just that .308 can be too much for varmint and predator if you also want to go that route.

-Hans
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