rover motor heritage? - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old April 2nd, 2006, 06:08 PM
GeoParth's Avatar
GeoParth
Status: Offline
George Parthmer
1995/d-90 #2715 yellowST
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: York, PA, USA
Posts: 193
rover motor heritage?

Ok - I am going to have to admit that i dont know much about old motors. however, i have a friend that is into this kind of things and claims that the 3.9 motor that land rover has in the defenders is based on a circa 1950-1960-ish buick motor. i was wondering if the dude is just totally full of BS or if anyone has ever heard of this. it seems plausible, since a lot of the parts on the defender can be sourced elsewhere anywhere --- like the dodge oil filter, and stuff like that. just throwing that out there ...
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old April 2nd, 2006, 06:15 PM
kellymoe's Avatar
kellymoe
Status: Offline
kevin
defender 130
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: burbank california
Posts: 967
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoParth
Ok - I am going to have to admit that i dont know much about old motors. however, i have a friend that is into this kind of things and claims that the 3.9 motor that land rover has in the defenders is based on a circa 1950-1960-ish buick motor. i was wondering if the dude is just totally full of BS or if anyone has ever heard of this. it seems plausible, since a lot of the parts on the defender can be sourced elsewhere anywhere --- like the dodge oil filter, and stuff like that. just throwing that out there ...

Ha, Ha, your buddy knows more about Rovers than you do

Seriously though, he is right. It is the old Buick 215. Land Rover or British Leland bought from Oldsmobile way back when and the rest is history. By knowing this bit of trivia you have now greatly expanded the number of resources for motor parts.

Kevin
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old April 2nd, 2006, 06:48 PM
mjekogian's Avatar
mjekogian
Status: Offline
Michael Jekogian
1997/ Defender ST
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Ventura CA
Posts: 551
Registry
Is that still true of the 97 since it is the 4.0 under BMW owneship at that time?
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old April 2nd, 2006, 06:51 PM
kellymoe's Avatar
kellymoe
Status: Offline
kevin
defender 130
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: burbank california
Posts: 967
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjekogian
Is that still true of the 97 since it is the 4.0 under BMW owneship at that time?
I think it is true up to the 4.6
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old April 2nd, 2006, 08:02 PM
Hans's Avatar
Hans
Status: Offline
Hans Haase
The D-90.com Lab Rat
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 2,381
Yep, that is fully true. Rover/Land Rover paid GM for the rights to use the design a long time back, well before the BMW or Ford ownerships. I think that Rover actually bought the design ownership outright, and not just licensed it.

The old rover 3.5 is almost a direct copy of the Buick 215 and most parts are compatible between both. The 3.9 and 4.2 are a slightly larger bore, but still uses most similar parts as the 215. Lots of guys here have used 215 Buick performance camshafts in their 3.9's.

The 4.0 and 4.6 are BASED on the the old Buick design, but was a major in-house update to the design that Land Rover did. It has a totally new oiling system, larger crank bearings, revised head bolt pattern, different crank shaft and a number of other updates to it. Very few parts on the 4.0/4.6 interchange with the 215 Buick.

-Hans
__________________
My oil line fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
My 100k stopped odometer fix

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Brace for impact, I'm in a "modifying mood". Massive thread count inbound.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 07:56 AM
GeoParth's Avatar
GeoParth
Status: Offline
George Parthmer
1995/d-90 #2715 yellowST
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: York, PA, USA
Posts: 193
damn - now i guess i owe my buddy a 6-pack. i guess that will teach me to doubt the truely bizarre histroy of the rover!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 09:12 AM
smenzel's Avatar
smenzel
Status: Offline
Sandro
1967 Series IIA
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 330
I heard the story from a slightly different point of view ...

Buick spent a fortune designing a light-weight, aluminum engine back in the mid- to late fifties. Everyone thought they were crazy for using something other than steel for their engine -- so much so that Buick thought they were getting a deal by selling off the engine (and engine production stuff) to Rover in the early sixties.

BTW, I'm fairly certain that it was Rover (the car company) that purchased the engine. In certain British car cicles, the engine is known as the Rover V8. This very engine has seen service is a number of British cars. Rovers and Triumphs (Stag, TR8) are the only ones that come to mind right at the moment. I'm sure there are others.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 10:13 AM
JackW's Avatar
JackW
Status: Online
Jack Walter
1966 109 SW Diesel
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Roswell, GA, USA
Posts: 929
Also used in Morgans (+8 models) MGB-V-8 models and many English kit cars. The TR-8's used the Rover V-8 but the Stag used a SOHC V-8 that was basically two Saab 99 engines mated together in a common crankcase - terrible engine - run away if someone ever tries to sell you one of thes POS's.

Buick and Oldsmobile both had slightly different versions of this engine - I think the Olds version used different cylinder heads. Olds also produced a turbocharged version of the engine with a water/alchohol injection system to prevent detonation in the F-85 Cutlass. My parents had a 1963 F-85 Cutlass with the 4-barrel carb and Turbohydramatic automatic when I was 15 - neat little car but a leaking fuel pump caused it to self-immolate in a neighbors driveway. GM sold the aluminum version of the engine to Rover after deciding to discontinue it in their cars - they continued to build a cast iron version of this engine in the Buicks.

Rover was looking at trying to get a lighter more powerful engine than their 3.0 liter six for the P5 and upcoming P6 passenger cars - they heard the engine was being discontinued by GM so they bought it. GM had been trying to cast the block around the cylinder liners but Rover revised the manufacturing process and used inserted liners - much more accurate and less chance of a liner shifting. Rover redesigned the block in 1980 - adding stiffeners - in preparation for an aborted attempt at building a diesel version of the engine (called the Iceberg project). They couldn't get cylinder head gaskets to live long so they abandoned the iceberg but kept the strengthened block.

The 4.0/4.6 engines have four bolt mains with larger diameter main bearings and no distributor drive.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 10:28 AM
snuffer's Avatar
snuffer
Status: Offline
Randy Black
'95 D 90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tulsa Ok USA
Posts: 753
Is the 4.0 a four bolt main?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 11:35 AM
JackW's Avatar
JackW
Status: Online
Jack Walter
1966 109 SW Diesel
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Roswell, GA, USA
Posts: 929
Yes - 3.9/4.2 engines are just bored/stroked 3.5's

The 4.0/4.6 was an all new block with 4-bolt mains (2 from the bottom - one from each side) but more signifigant is the revised main bearing diameter and oil pump.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old April 3rd, 2006, 03:11 PM
snuffer's Avatar
snuffer
Status: Offline
Randy Black
'95 D 90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tulsa Ok USA
Posts: 753
Ok, gottcha, thanks Jack.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat

Tags
motor

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Famous Land Rover owners Lindy Misc. Chit-Chat 4 June 15th, 2009 08:49 PM
Any Proud Rover Owner needs to read this WCURoverD90 Misc. Chit-Chat 12 July 30th, 2008 06:13 PM
Good Bye Ford, Hello Tata... It's done. JFD Misc. Chit-Chat 46 April 3rd, 2008 02:49 PM
Land Rover family tree D901619 Defender Technical Discussions 9 July 5th, 2007 04:34 PM
Oil Info XD90 Defender Technical Discussions 5 September 7th, 2004 10:07 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:45 AM.


Copyright