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  #41  
Old November 19th, 2015, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason1st View Post
...clutch master and slave cylinders. That was several thousand too.
Independent of the import sage, I feel for you, if your shop charged a couple grand to replace the clutch MC and SC. I did that last week in 2 hours in a parking lot for a couple hundred in parts that were overnighted.
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  #42  
Old November 19th, 2015, 07:42 PM
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Jason Crandall
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Originally Posted by grnrvrs View Post
Independent of the import sage, I feel for you, if your shop charged a couple grand to replace the clutch MC and SC. I did that last week in 2 hours in a parking lot for a couple hundred in parts that were overnighted.
You really have to look at my original post in this thread. I list all the issues. It's been expensive.

You can't work on things yourself and call it "free". I have a shop.

I am at a point thought where I may take on aligning my body and installing my doors myself. Seems it's an impossible task.
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  #43  
Old November 19th, 2015, 08:34 PM
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Chris
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Just my .02....


I bought my truck from Rivermike, without flying out to see it- risky , and I knew it (and my wife was polite enough to remind me daily). The overall transaction was smooth and truck was delivered as presented- though I definitely didn't pay $45K. I did a lot of homework and checked a lot of references, but in the end I knew work had to be done to it, and opted to having it done here where I could "monitor" it. Too much risk for me spending that kind of cash without seeing the final product before delivery- but that's me. I've learned the "Buyer Beware" approach- ask me how I know.


Mike's OK by me- transparent and responsive; even called me right back when I had legitimacy questions during all the CBP drama last year.


Like I said...just my .02


Good luck with resolution.
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  #44  
Old November 19th, 2015, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
If it isn't caught soon enough it can cook the clutch disc. Id assume at that $ amount it included redoing the entire clutch.

-Jeff


(image not affiliated with this truck in any way - just confirmation that Jeff may actually be correct about something not related to internet snarkyness)
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  #45  
Old November 19th, 2015, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason1st View Post

You can't work on things yourself and call it "free". I have a shop.
Can you clarify this statement?
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  #46  
Old November 20th, 2015, 12:59 AM
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Jason, you don't even read my reply .... I previously posted "" He has waited longer than he was supposed to, we had to order 2nd row high back seats in Exmoor Outlast fabric, a material which was rarely used and is now NLA by Exmoor. We have to rely on suppliers which can be a pain sometimes."" Call Exmoor, ask for Di, she will confirm my story. IF you look closely in the pics I posted you will see the 3rd row seats and fronts were installed but not the 2nd row high backs , since EXMOOR was having major problems with their supplier, we did not have any.

Remember you spend $ 7000 on upgrades ???? We had to order that and install everything.

We always test drive our trucks for at least 2 weeks prior to shipping.

WHY...WHY....WHY did you not write me or call me for over a year ...........???? And now you want to fight it out on this forum ????????

IF ... you would have picked up the phone a year ago and just called me, I would have been more than happy to send you replacement parts so your "shop" would not have charged you " Thousands" $ to replace.

It makes no sense to communicate any further here. It seems like a good learning curve , for both of us ! Maybe I am posting too many pics of the elaborate build up here on the board, including the various stages of the renovation process and give people the idea we are doing a "full" frame off restoration. My idea was it might have been good for various members here to see how we are stripping a truck and building it up again. Maybe better if I just list before and after shots so no one has a clue what we have done.
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  #47  
Old November 20th, 2015, 01:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivermike View Post
It makes no sense to communicate any further here.
Why?

------ Follow up post added November 19th, 2015 10:54 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by rivermike View Post
Jason, you don't even read my reply .... I previously posted "" He has waited longer than he was supposed to, we had to order 2nd row high back seats in Exmoor Outlast fabric, a material which was rarely used and is now NLA by Exmoor. We have to rely on suppliers which can be a pain sometimes."" Call Exmoor, ask for Di, she will confirm my story. IF you look closely in the pics I posted you will see the 3rd row seats and fronts were installed but not the 2nd row high backs , since EXMOOR was having major problems with their supplier, we did not have any.

Remember you spend $ 7000 on upgrades ???? We had to order that and install everything.

We always test drive our trucks for at least 2 weeks prior to shipping.

WHY...WHY....WHY did you not write me or call me for over a year ...........???? And now you want to fight it out on this forum ????????

IF ... you would have picked up the phone a year ago and just called me, I would have been more than happy to send you replacement parts so your "shop" would not have charged you " Thousands" $ to replace.

It makes no sense to communicate any further here. It seems like a good learning curve , for both of us ! Maybe I am posting too many pics of the elaborate build up here on the board, including the various stages of the renovation process and give people the idea we are doing a "full" frame off restoration. My idea was it might have been good for various members here to see how we are stripping a truck and building it up again. Maybe better if I just list before and after shots so no one has a clue what we have done.
Saved for posterity.
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  #48  
Old November 20th, 2015, 06:55 AM
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Jason Crandall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackField View Post
Can you clarify this statement?
Doing your own work is not "free". It takes your time. What's your time worth?
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  #49  
Old November 20th, 2015, 07:41 AM
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Jason Crandall
2006 LR3 2012 SC 1983 110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivermike View Post
Jason, you don't even read my reply .... I previously posted "" He has waited longer than he was supposed to, we had to order 2nd row high back seats in Exmoor Outlast fabric, a material which was rarely used and is now NLA by Exmoor. We have to rely on suppliers which can be a pain sometimes."" Call Exmoor, ask for Di, she will confirm my story. IF you look closely in the pics I posted you will see the 3rd row seats and fronts were installed but not the 2nd row high backs , since EXMOOR was having major problems with their supplier, we did not have any.

Remember you spend $ 7000 on upgrades ???? We had to order that and install everything.

We always test drive our trucks for at least 2 weeks prior to shipping.

WHY...WHY....WHY did you not write me or call me for over a year ...........???? And now you want to fight it out on this forum ????????

IF ... you would have picked up the phone a year ago and just called me, I would have been more than happy to send you replacement parts so your "shop" would not have charged you " Thousands" $ to replace.

It makes no sense to communicate any further here. It seems like a good learning curve , for both of us ! Maybe I am posting too many pics of the elaborate build up here on the board, including the various stages of the renovation process and give people the idea we are doing a "full" frame off restoration. My idea was it might have been good for various members here to see how we are stripping a truck and building it up again. Maybe better if I just list before and after shots so no one has a clue what we have done.
Mike,

Getting you to acknowledge there was an actual issue with my roof leaks and headliner was like pulling teeth. You said the following to me:

"All Defenders leak. It's completely normal. Even the new ones leak like this".

If that's the case, then what's the point in installing a new headliner in your trucks?

I'm not the type to keep asking you to make it right. You know you shipped me a hunk of junk. I'm not the type to complain in a restaurant either. I'll just write a bad review and never go back.

------ Follow up post added November 20th, 2015 07:49 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandman913 View Post
Just my .02....


I bought my truck from Rivermike, without flying out to see it- risky , and I knew it (and my wife was polite enough to remind me daily). The overall transaction was smooth and truck was delivered as presented- though I definitely didn't pay $45K. I did a lot of homework and checked a lot of references, but in the end I knew work had to be done to it, and opted to having it done here where I could "monitor" it. Too much risk for me spending that kind of cash without seeing the final product before delivery- but that's me. I've learned the "Buyer Beware" approach- ask me how I know.


Mike's OK by me- transparent and responsive; even called me right back when I had legitimacy questions during all the CBP drama last year.


Like I said...just my .02


Good luck with resolution.
I agree 100% on buyer beware. And in this day and age with the internet and forums the seller can beware also when they don't do what they say they will do.
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  #50  
Old November 20th, 2015, 11:01 AM
DailyDrivenDefende
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Michael
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason1st View Post
I agree 100% on buyer beware. And in this day and age with the internet and forums the seller can beware also when they don't do what they say they will do.
Well said.

Unfortunately, the buyers are taking a big risk buying from overseas and it is near impossible to rectify if any deviation occurs from the promised transaction. Buyers need to be aware of that. Even in US, even if contracts were written and signed, you have to fight for it. Time and money invested doing that could be more than what may have paid and they know it too well. Without means to enforce the promised result, it is all the more likely some of these disreputable companies (not pointing fingers at any particulars) will try to walk away.

I believe when problems are clearly communicated and understood I think the seller is being fair. But in this case, it seems as though, either it was miscommunicated or omitted/disregarded.

If this can be resolved in the public forum, the seller can salvage whatever reputation he has and you get what you paid for.

I bought a 2 defenders not too long apart and looked at many. Sadly, all the sellers have dealt with were quiet about significant problems I saw until I approached them about it. They never came up front with it themselves. What is even sadder is that they were ALL seasoned owners.

I suppose the lesson here is, assume the worst and see if you are willing to put up with it, if not don't go through with the deal.
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  #51  
Old November 20th, 2015, 11:23 AM
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I think it will progressively get worse over time. Almost half the trucks on EBay are currently priced over $50k which will net a new crop of rookie purchasers thinking spending that much money insures quality/collectibility all while not doing a hands on inspection. I fear this board will morph into something bad when the pissed off non mechanically skilled owners find it. I do see a future for whoever wants to start a third party traveling pre purchase inspection service specializing in Defenders.
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  #52  
Old November 20th, 2015, 11:56 AM
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Michael
2008 LHD Tdci 110 Keswick Green
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason1st View Post
Mike,

Getting you to acknowledge there was an actual issue with my roof leaks and headliner was like pulling teeth. You said the following to me:

"All Defenders leak. It's completely normal. Even the new ones leak like this".

If that's the case, then what's the point in installing a new headliner in your trucks?
After delivery you called me and told me the mats and carpets were wet, it must be leaking somewhere. My reply was : " I am not surprised, it is a long trip, almost 2 months from door to door, almost all defenders leak".

Leak from where ?? doorseal, windshield frame, bulkhead flaps or 30 other places. I am not sure if you are aware but Landrover launched a special booklet for their dealers and main agents throughout Europe , how to keep the water out. More than 30 pages .... see below.

As you see the factory made that many mistakes during the build and construction of our favorite truck, we try to solve those problems, many are simply design issues....

It wasn't until later you told me the water was coming from the headliner.

I never told you we were putting a new headliner in your truck, I gave you the option, choose between a black headliner or the original type .... you either don't understand my English or you just don't listen.
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  #53  
Old November 20th, 2015, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post
I think it will progressively get worse over time. Almost half the trucks on EBay are currently priced over $50k which will net a new crop of rookie purchasers thinking spending that much money insures quality/collectibility all while not doing a hands on inspection. I fear this board will morph into something bad when the pissed off non mechanically skilled owners find it. I do see a future for whoever wants to start a third party traveling pre purchase inspection service specializing in Defenders.
I wonder if a younger generation of buyers that experienced the brand thru LR3's and L322's are buying Defenders and thinking they will be the same?

Any one who grew up in the 70's and 80's and helped the old man work on cars (because even new off the dealer floor they were shit) will understand a Defender. If your only auto experience is with a later model Honda you might wonder why a Defender leaks, smells like oil, is underpowered and has electrical issues.

I have found in my build that $50k doesn't go all that far. The nickel and dime stuff kills you and there are a lot of a little differences over the years. Doors are the same over the years but then again they are not. Same with the seatbox, the dash, etc, etc. Add that to a design where many of the body panels are pop riveted together - easy to put together but nothing is ever straight. They are very simple vehicles but then again they are not.

I joke that I could have rebuilt my Suburban 3x over for the amount of "work" into my 110.
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  #54  
Old November 20th, 2015, 02:22 PM
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45k for a ROW 110...At a minimum I'd expect it to run down the road properly at safe speeds, stop, start and steer...It doesn't sound like this one is quite there.
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  #55  
Old November 20th, 2015, 03:13 PM
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El ignorante ataca con la boca ....

El sabio se defiende con el silencio....
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  #56  
Old November 20th, 2015, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivermike View Post
El ignorante ataca con la boca ....

El sabio se defiende con el silencio....
Olé!
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  #57  
Old November 20th, 2015, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by sonoronos View Post
Somebody needs to start a business where they just take apart entire defenders, sandblast everything to bare metal, throw in a $500 bag of stainless fasteners, and sell all the pieces in a 12 foot container. That's about 50% of a resto right there.

You could call it "truck in a box"
You'd prob have importation issues if it was an "Assembly of parts" constituting 100% of a vehicle. It isn't entering as a vehicle, then would need to get a custom State VIN, which throws up all other sorts of problems if its accused of masquerading as a kit car, replica, of its real marque/model.

Quote:
Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post
I fear this board will morph into something bad when the pissed off non mechanically skilled owners find it.

Nailed it.
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  #58  
Old November 20th, 2015, 05:00 PM
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Jason Crandall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rivermike View Post
After delivery you called me and told me the mats and carpets were wet, it must be leaking somewhere. My reply was : " I am not surprised, it is a long trip, almost 2 months from door to door, almost all defenders leak".

Leak from where ?? doorseal, windshield frame, bulkhead flaps or 30 other places. I am not sure if you are aware but Landrover launched a special booklet for their dealers and main agents throughout Europe , how to keep the water out. More than 30 pages .... see below.

As you see the factory made that many mistakes during the build and construction of our favorite truck, we try to solve those problems, many are simply design issues....

It wasn't until later you told me the water was coming from the headliner.

I never told you we were putting a new headliner in your truck, I gave you the option, choose between a black headliner or the original type .... you either don't understand my English or you just don't listen.
The first email I sent you after receipt of the truck was of the wet headliner sagging. The same pics I posted in the beginning of this thread. There was never any question the roof was leaking.

You still aren't answering the questions regarding the $3K AC I paid you to install. Look at the pictures of that crap hose you cobbled together. That's supposed to be new equipment that you spent months installing right? Answer the question.

------ Follow up post added November 20th, 2015 05:09 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by DailyDrivenDefende View Post
I bought a 2 defenders not too long apart and looked at many. Sadly, all the sellers have dealt with were quiet about significant problems I saw until I approached them about it. They never came up front with it themselves. What is even sadder is that they were ALL seasoned owners.
"You can shear a sheep many times but you can only skin it once".

Rivermike isn't a "seller". He's not "a guy in Europe with a 110 he'd like to sell". Rivermike runs a business restoring Defenders and advertising his products on websites like this. If he want's to stay in business then all he has is his reputation.

Let's say I'm completely wrong about what I should have expected from the condition of this old 110 (I'm not wrong. All you have to do is read his FOR SALE thread to know what I should be expecting). But let's assume I'm wrong........

Explain the A/C hose I posted a picture of in the beginning of this thread. I paid for a NEW AC system and new installation of that system. Does that look like a new hose? Does that even look like an old hose? That hose is a spot on representation of this truck as a whole. Complete garbage.

Rivermike can hide behind his "no habla ingles" all he wants. We know that trick over here Rivermike. You're not fooling anyone.
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  #59  
Old November 20th, 2015, 08:12 PM
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AC aside, I agree with previous poster about being able to drive the damn thing upon arrival. I mean address these issues Mike. Maybe Jason had higher than expected expectations and clearly there is some sort of communication issue but 45k for an early 80's rig better run me down the road no matter how much water is dumping in or doors that don't line up with body, that should be understood across all language barriers. All the shiny flair doesn't mean anything to me, but it looks like what these builds are exactly. If that's your clients' desires fine, nothing like a pretty truck sitting in the yard for decorations. Keep throwing out this foreign language bullshit and it won't help you sell anymore trucks from this board bud.
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  #60  
Old November 20th, 2015, 08:36 PM
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Originally Posted by jason1st View Post
So I ordered a new engine from Cannibal
I think you will be disappointed with the engine after a year when it is leaking like a sieve.
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