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  #21  
Old March 12th, 2004, 02:32 AM
tbmcneill

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.... &, why, technically, "Rover Tracks" is no longer Rover Tracks, but, instead, RT Designs ... and had to do away with our oval logo.
T
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  #22  
Old March 12th, 2004, 04:32 AM
mulesnx
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Sam Hayes
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Guys, I appreciate all of the comments. I have been considering changing the site name (and for sure the logo). Question: Ford owns www.landroverworld.com? Where is the site? It never shows up on my browser.

Chris, as far as mass emailing, I am not much good at that. I emailed every one individually, which took me quite a while. Anyone can check the properties and see where the emails came from and who they were sent to. I guess it is still spam, so I am sorry to anyone who received any emails. I think you are good guy, and have some very valid points. I just wonder why all of the hype over a enthusiast's web page.

Only time will tell if Land Rover busts me...
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  #23  
Old March 12th, 2004, 07:30 AM
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Sam, you can always check domain availability or ownership by running a "WHOIS" search on Network Solutions page. WHOIS is a tool that tells you who owns a domain name. http://www.networksolutions.com/en_US/whois/index.jhtml

Remember, just because it is not an active website doesn't mean someone doesn't already owns it. Many companies will use only the .com extension but will register all the other available domain extensions and either do nothing with them or simply park them under the .com site providing they are available.
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  #24  
Old March 12th, 2004, 11:37 AM
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Michael Slade
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Quote:
Originally posted by mulesnx
Guys, I appreciate all of the comments.
BULLSHIT.

You don't appreciate the comments. You come out being very defensive, take an 'I'll just sit back and wait' posture, and ban me w/out any explanation.

If you're going to ban me, then you ought to at least remove my profile and my singular (1) post.
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  #25  
Old March 12th, 2004, 12:28 PM
Eric Siepmann
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Sam,

You seem to be having trouble comprehending that large corporate entities can and do move quickly in defense of their brands.

Add to the fact that you foolishly admit your infringement of copyrights on a public BBS on the internet, the fact that you seem not to care that you are infringing on other's rights, and have a very foolish retort of I'll wait and see. Not a good image to project at all.

It's not time will tell, but when. I mean the more people you upset on the internet the greater chance of someone ratting you out. My perception is that you are very arrogant, foolish, and stupid. You feigned ignorance of copyright law is ridculous. And no defense.

I hope LRNA and the true Land Rover World, the publication, come knocking on your door sooner rather than later and shut you down.

EwS
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  #26  
Old March 12th, 2004, 12:45 PM
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Michael Slade
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Quote:
Originally posted by Eric Siepmann
Add to the fact that you foolishly admit your infringement of copyrights on a public BBS on the internet, the fact that you seem not to care that you are infringing on other's rights, and have a very foolish retort of I'll wait and see. Not a good image to project at all.
Eric,

One of the reasons that this is particularly interesting to me is the fact that I have been involved in a 'legal discussion' with a nationally known company about copyright infringement of my own images.

Arrogance, denial and feigned ignorance have been their defense for nearly 2 years now. What they are starting to realize is that copyright and trademark laws actually do have teeth. This case, if awarded standard statutory fines, could rise to the $750,000 mark.

FWIW, in case mulesnx is monitoring this, federal judges are required by law to award $150,000 for EACH CASE of copyright infringement. Penalties are higher when willful negligence is involved.

A single case of copyright infringement could consist of each unique image placement. For example, if I had Land Rover's logo on a page of my website and was using it as my own work, that would call for statutory damages of $150,000. If I had it on EVERY page of my website, each page is considered an individual use.

Changing it a little, as in the case of LRW.org's logo, doesn't matter.

There are VERY strict interpretations of 'fair use', and his use is not one of them.

I'd watch it if I were him.
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  #27  
Old March 12th, 2004, 01:27 PM
Eric Siepmann
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Michael,

You've got my respect and admiration. I love photography and to be able to make a decent living doing it requires a level of creativity I do not have.

I hope you're succesful in your cases and that your settlement more than makes up for your losses. 750k? New rover if it was me.

My main peeve is that Sam is trying to play stupid. Well Stupid gets what it desevers in the end. Sam can tell the other homeless people in Utah that it wasn't drugs or mental affliction that made him homeless, but a stupid copyright infringement case gone bad.

EwS
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  #28  
Old March 12th, 2004, 01:35 PM
Kevin Baldwin
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Kevin Baldwin
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Land Rover World

As a contributor to LRW magazine, I'd just like to point out to you guys that despite its title, the landroverworld.org website has no connection whatsoever with Land Rover World magazine.

Kev
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  #29  
Old March 12th, 2004, 01:41 PM
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Michael Slade
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Eric,

Thanks for the kind words.

I share my example not to brag at how 'sucessful' I am (highly subjective BTW), but rather to point out that I actually DO know what I'm talking about.

This happens to me about twice a year. I'll see images of mine lifed from off of my site, or other sites I run, and they get put onto a third-parties site. Initially I always ask that they remove said images politely and in a cordial way. In NO case has my request been denied. Most people know that they are doing more than 'borrowing' images of mine, but I let it slide as a misunderstanding when they are humble and rectify the situation in a timely manner.

BUT, in this instance I am referring to, I open up a nationally distributed magazine, turn to the inside back cover and see a full-page 4-color ad using an image of mine. This is a company I have NEVER done work for, nor have I ever spoken to anyone in their marketing department.

I called the matter to their attention. They said I needed to prove that I owned the image and that they couldn't use it.

I explained that's not how it works, the told me to F-off.

So, two years and two sets of attorney's in two different states later they are finally starting to see the severity of the situation.

That's all the detail I want to go into, I don't want to air my dirty laundry here. Again, it's just to demonstrate that I have a history of studying and knowing the issues and laws involved very intimately.

If the owners/managers of Landroverworld.org think that copyright and trademark infringement go unnoticed, they are wrong. If they think they can ask for forgiveness and get off with a slap on the wrist and some personal embarassment, they are probably right.

My suggestion is to change the name and remove all trademarked and copyrighted images/logos off of their site immediately. Stick with their idea of having a BBS. The software they are using is good, the look of the site is nice, and it appears that there is indeed a market for yet another BBs.

To continue on their present course is reckless and negligent.
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  #30  
Old March 12th, 2004, 06:16 PM
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Nathan Hindman
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Mike,

Of course the LandRoverWorld.org site looks nice, they appear to have borrowed heavily (read: jacked) some of the design straight from Land Rovers website. Heck, he didn't even bother to change the pixel size of them. Just "download to desktop" and call it your own.

That along with the logo, the confusing naming, the copyrighted images sure makes it all seem a bit dodgy.

And Sam, when Land Rover finds out, and it is a "when, not an "if", I wouldn't be suprised if they nailed your *ss to the wall. All in all you're breaking alot of copyright and intellectual property laws over there. If it we're me, I'd start from scratch on the design of the site and write the code yourself.
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  #31  
Old March 12th, 2004, 06:37 PM
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Nathan Hindman
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From the landroverworld.org website:
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  #32  
Old March 12th, 2004, 06:37 PM
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Nathan Hindman
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And now from the "real" Land Rover site:
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  #33  
Old March 12th, 2004, 07:33 PM
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Randy Black
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Hey Michael, pass the popcorn.
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  #34  
Old March 12th, 2004, 08:33 PM
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Glenn Guinto
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I have some here Randy... this is going to be a good one...lol
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  #35  
Old March 12th, 2004, 09:09 PM
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Michael Slade
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Chomp Chomp Chomp

(needs more butter)
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  #36  
Old March 12th, 2004, 10:09 PM
Eric Siepmann
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Hey pass some of that my way. And who's got the butter?
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  #37  
Old March 15th, 2004, 01:29 PM
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Joe Pfeiffer
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A couple of comments -

First I feel like I was tricked. I didn't completely check out the site but I totally thought is belonged to LRW - the magazine. I also agree with most that there are too many forums online.

Secondly, another example of Ford coming after people is that Landrovers unlimited in Irvine, CA was forced to change it's name to West Coast Rovers.
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