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  #21  
Old September 12th, 2011, 01:28 PM
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Dr. Gonzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjf View Post
jvelador,

I still think you are full of shit. If I offered you a straight up trade a new icon Fj for your defender you would kick your defender to the curb instantly as would most people who are driving 30k defenders.
I think in his refusal of an ICON over a D90 jvelador is staking his position on the Land Rover marquee over all others. To me it's like telling a Porsche guy that you'll give him a [$100K super duper Corvette ZR1 ZO6 Cosworth blah, blah, blah] for his '69 911T.

The Porsche guy's not going to be swayed by whatever perceived awesomeness the Corvette delivers, he's a Porsche guy. I think jvelador is just a "Land Rover Guy".

Nothing wrong there.
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  #22  
Old September 12th, 2011, 01:28 PM
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barry f
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Looking around the site it looks like you can get coils

http://www.icon4x4.com/overview/fj/d...ges/old-school
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  #23  
Old September 12th, 2011, 02:16 PM
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Steve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 130Tdi View Post
When you buy an Icon vehicle the title is for an old truck but from what I can see there is no part of the original truck used.....perhaps I'm wrong.
I remember reading about TLC/the Icon a few years ago, and they mentioned that they reused the donor hood and/or the grill (if still in acceptable shape), but I heard recently that now everything is replaced. [subject to the accuracy of my bad memory]
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  #24  
Old September 12th, 2011, 02:16 PM
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kevin
1994 D90 300tdi #730, SIII 88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
Ah the Ship of Theseus paradox. The gold chainers call that a restomod.

-Jeff

Yeah, really. I will say one thing, the Jeep guys have that figured. You can create an entire truck from the Quadratec catalouge.
Other than bragging rights on the boulevard, I don't see much sense in the Icon thing. I do respect the quality of the builds, though.
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  #25  
Old September 12th, 2011, 02:32 PM
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Javier Velador
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Barry, the feeling is mutual if you think you know me. In a few sentences, Jerod Z. understood exactly what I was trying to convey. Proclaiming to know "most people who are driving 30k defenders" is a bit pretentious.

The fact of the matter is that the Icon would attract a certain type of crowd that I can't particularly relate to. Likewise with Jeeps, FJs, Broncos, etc. Hence, my refusal of the beasts.
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  #26  
Old September 12th, 2011, 03:58 PM
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barry f
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The 30k comment was not pretentious. I meant your average defender not a ECR restored truck or a mint original truck. It is what I drive and what most people have. I love land rover but if given the choice between an Icon and my truck I will take the Icon. If we are talking a ECR 90 with a tdi etc then maybe not.
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  #27  
Old September 12th, 2011, 04:05 PM
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kevin
1994 D90 300tdi #730, SIII 88
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I'd take the Icon, drive it for a week and then sell it and buy 2 Defenders. With all that expensive powder coating on the exterior, I sure wouldn't take it offroad.
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  #28  
Old September 12th, 2011, 04:21 PM
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barry f
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I honestly have never seen one in person but the pics show it off road ( I know that doesn't matter). I might be going on a limb but I would assume it is powdercoated in a way that is durable. The company seems to have thought of everything so I wouldn't think paint would be an issue.
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  #29  
Old September 12th, 2011, 05:15 PM
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Powder-coating is like Rhino Lining material. Looked very thick and easy to maintain. You don't wax it, just wash and let dry. It's nice stuff...but again I prefer my D110.
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  #30  
Old September 12th, 2011, 05:27 PM
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barry f
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Hard to compare the 110 to the icon, at least if you are comparing a 2 door soft top to a 4 door hard top. I think it is less an argument about land rover and land cruiser and more if you could have this 160k insane machine over your normal run of the mill 30k NAS 90 I would be shocked if someone would really take the 90.

I would never trade my 90 for a jeep but this thing is beyond nuts and there are maybe 20 of them out there.

For argument here is one ready to go http://www.icon4x4.com/inventory/new...on-fj40-diesel
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  #31  
Old September 12th, 2011, 05:32 PM
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Javier Velador
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OK Defender owners

Who would keep their ~$30K Defender 90 and who would opt for a theoretical $30K Icon?

Take the survey:

1. once, please.
2. only if you already own a Defender 90

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/VNDFLLJ
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  #32  
Old September 12th, 2011, 05:44 PM
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barry f
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Well don't twist it. I am not talking a 30k Icon. I am talking the 120k Icon as were you. You switched it to an FJ earlier as well.

If you have a defender that is average like most (30k) and someone offered you a straight trade for the 120k average Icon, that was the argument.
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  #33  
Old September 12th, 2011, 06:04 PM
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Javier Velador
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Wrong again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bjf View Post
greatest lie I have ever heard. You chose your 25k 90 because it was 25k. There isn't a person on here who if given the choice would choose a 25k 90 over an icon if they were both 25k.
------ Follow up post added September 12th, 2011 03:07 PM ------

Wrong again, sure we bumped it to 30k, but the argument has always been "all things being equal".

Quote:
Originally Posted by bjf View Post
I thought you were talking the choice between an icon and a defender not a fj cruiser and a defender. If you meant the cruiser obviously the defender every time. If we are talking the difference between a defender and an icon at the same price I can't see how you would want a defender.
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  #34  
Old September 12th, 2011, 06:07 PM
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barry f
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Fine you are correct but just so it is clear it is the same truck just at a 100k discount and there are still only 20 of them.
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  #35  
Old September 12th, 2011, 07:12 PM
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kevin
1994 D90 300tdi #730, SIII 88
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A much better and revealing survey would be;
What would you choose a $125k Icon or an $125 ECR Defender?

Yet another survey ( and even more revealing) would be;
What is it that attracts you to a $125k 4x4?
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  #36  
Old September 12th, 2011, 07:29 PM
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barry f
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For me it would depend on how both trucks were set up. I would assume we are talking an amazing 90 or a beach runner vs an Icon 2 door or 4 door soft top. No point in comparing a NAS 110 restore to a Icon four door soft top. Both cool but very different.
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  #37  
Old September 12th, 2011, 07:51 PM
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john
97 D90 ST / 1957 S1 109/ 1983 LS110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jvelador View Post
OK Defender owners

Who would keep their ~$30K Defender 90 and who would opt for a theoretical $30K Icon?

Take the survey:

1. once, please.
2. only if you already own a Defender 90

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/VNDFLLJ
I guess im not qualified to vote even though ive owned both Defenders and FJ40s?
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  #38  
Old September 12th, 2011, 07:57 PM
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barry f
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You are definitely not qualified to vote.
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  #39  
Old September 13th, 2011, 12:04 AM
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Christian
1993 Defender 110
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There is no such thing as a $30,000 Icon.
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  #40  
Old September 13th, 2011, 01:22 AM
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John
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I've owned an Icon CJ3B for a few months. I've also had my hands on their FJ44 (110 beachrunner equivalent).

I also have a fully restored D90 with 2.8 transplant and appreciate the work and expense that goes into a restoration.

First, it's somewhat difficult to argue "style" as it is simply preference. But if you want to compare "apples to apples", the best comparison is an ECR 110 beachrunner with an Icon FJ44.

Understand however that ECR strives to truly "restore" the vehicle to stay "true" to the OEM model. While they can and do upgrade certain aspects, ie galvanize chassis, high quality prep/primer/paint, high quality accessories, etc. For the most part it is the OEM vehicle "warts and all". They also have some very nice improvements and innovations but all staying very true to the LR OEM design.

Icon essentially takes the nostalgic portions of the truck, ie the lines, but essentially replaces/remans all the other parts. They are essentially ground up engineered trucks. Examples, coil sprung, diesel or GM vortec powerplants, CAD chassis, aircraft gauges and parts, very unique paints, etc, etc. There are significant "upgrades" and redesigns compared to the OEM. These are NOT restorations just using new panels, etc., not even close.

They are essentially different vehicles altogether. Both trucks would cost approximately $165K with basics. If you were to truly "value" price Icon versus ECR there is no question the Icon is a better "value". This means you are not simply paying for the labor and parts of hand assembling a vehicle (both Icon and ECR do this), but you are also getting the "bottom up" redesign of a vehicle thought completely through.

Ultimately it is a matter of taste but IMHO there are few if any people that would pass on an Icon if you really had you hands on one and saw what truly went into them. They are really a work of art. I also appreciate the thought and skill that goes into the ECR trucks, also a work of art.

Have to be careful comparing ECR to Icon as they are both excellent at what they do. They are both the pinnacle of what they do but they do two DIFFERENT things.

Compare instead the design, and engineering aspects of Icon versus Land Rover, ie powerplant, drivetrain, suspension, body and trim.
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