How do you guys feel about black boxes in your car? - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old June 26th, 2012, 01:28 PM
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Question How do you guys feel about black boxes in your car?

So last Sat, I was getting a new tire installed on the Porsche thanks to a nail in the right rear wheel ($700 tire.. luckily I bought the road hazard insurance) and while waiting/talking with my sales guy, he told me that they can now see how many times I've redlined the engine including my average and top speeds. He said they can use the information against a customer (but that they probably wont) to determine trade in value on your car or the trade in value when its time to return a lease. I understand how they'd want to know but don't you guys think thats a bit much? To what end is my question.
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  #2  
Old June 26th, 2012, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
There is even an ins co that will give you a 'discount' to add a big brother device.
Progressive "safe driving" - my D90 was not applicable. It monitored things like how often per week you slammed your brakes - allotment of once every 2 weeks I think.
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I am talking purely from an aesthetics standpoint.
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  #3  
Old June 26th, 2012, 01:45 PM
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That progressive thing screwed up a friends jeep, not sure how or what but it wouldn't start. Took it out, and it did.

I think the Nissan GTR was one of the first ones to do this. They wouldn't warranty your driveline if you used the launch control feature, and it logged each time you used it into the computer. How in the world you can provide a car with a feature, and then not warranty the car when that feature is used is crazy to me. But it had been done and many people found themselves up shits creek when they went to bring their $90K GTR in for repair.

To me, I think its ridiculous. Luckily for me it would never apply or make a difference. I drive like a pvssy on the road, dont have a cool car that will ever have that feature anyways lol.

Neil, what tire are you running that is was $700? Michilen Cups? Thats the only tire I could imagine being that much coin, and you shouldn't be running those on the street anyways?
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  #4  
Old June 26th, 2012, 01:56 PM
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Ferraris/Lambos/Porsches have been tracking engine hours/peak engine revs/max rev periods/max speeds since the early 1990s. I wouldn't buy a modern Ferrari or a Lambo without hooking up to an SD2 or LDAC to get the download - gives a good indication of how hard the car has been driven in addition to the usual PPI checks and compression/leakdown tests. I think its a good thing that these cars track these parameters.

Now as far as people other than me accessing the information, you will have to bring a search warrant to see the data on my cars.
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  #5  
Old June 26th, 2012, 02:13 PM
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My buddies 550 was blowing coolant out the overflow in Vegas due to a blown fan fuse under the hood. The dealership was able to download all of the temps and other vitals to confirm the motor did not overheat to the point of damaging anything. He was very happy they could track that info. They also flat-bedded it to LA, fixed it and returned it within 24 hours under warranty...nice.

I am not sure if they noticed a top speed of 155mph though....but I think we are discussing that in another thread...
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  #6  
Old June 26th, 2012, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bossman429 View Post
That progressive thing screwed up a friends jeep, not sure how or what but it wouldn't start. Took it out, and it did.

I think the Nissan GTR was one of the first ones to do this. They wouldn't warranty your driveline if you used the launch control feature, and it logged each time you used it into the computer. How in the world you can provide a car with a feature, and then not warranty the car when that feature is used is crazy to me. But it had been done and many people found themselves up shits creek when they went to bring their $90K GTR in for repair.

To me, I think its ridiculous. Luckily for me it would never apply or make a difference. I drive like a pvssy on the road, dont have a cool car that will ever have that feature anyways lol.

Neil, what tire are you running that is was $700? Michilen Cups? Thats the only tire I could imagine being that much coin, and you shouldn't be running those on the street anyways?

They are 20" Pirelli P-Zeros that are staggard (8.5 in the front, 11 in the rear). They said this particular tire was designed especially for the 991.
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  #7  
Old June 26th, 2012, 02:33 PM
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I am shocked about the content of this thread. The title lead me to believe it would be about something else.
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Are there shocks that I can addjust up and down like my friends LX460? That would be very cool!
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  #8  
Old June 26th, 2012, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil McCauley View Post
They are 20" Pirelli P-Zeros that are staggard (8.5 in the front, 11 in the rear). They said this particular tire was designed especially for the 991.

O didn't realize it was a 20", i thought it wasa 19

Yea - that would be some coin..... isn't that nuts, $700 for a tire that has less rubber than a trojan.
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  #9  
Old June 26th, 2012, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bossman429 View Post
O didn't realize it was a 20", i thought it wasa 19

Yea - that would be some coin..... isn't that nuts, $700 for a tire that has less rubber than a trojan.
Yes, 991 is now using standard 20" rims/tires, and so will the new boxster and probably every other pcar from now on.

One thing I have to note regarding launch control warranty is that Porsche does warranty the car even with launch control use. I was worried about that at delivery so I asked but my sales guy said "stop worrying about it, just use the launch control and drive the shit out of it". Always telling me to take it on PCH and to track it sometime. Crazy.
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  #10  
Old June 26th, 2012, 03:01 PM
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nice avatar Neil
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  #11  
Old June 26th, 2012, 06:42 PM
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The Yamaha 4-strokes on my boat have black boxes and I get a download each fall showing critical data. It's great info and I would love to see it on my car engines. As far as negative impact to valuation? Maintenance should still be the overriding factor. Heck, engines are made to run, so run 'em.
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  #12  
Old June 27th, 2012, 07:11 AM
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Porsche warranties are not what they once were. I have a 2006 Cayman S with 2000 miles over the warranty. The dealer refused to even discuss meeting me halfway on the cost a new motor when it blew. Car was never tracked. They cited five blackbox incidences of redline in 52,000 miles. I bought the car new from them and had every service done with them.
On the other hand there are certainly benefits when it comes to diagnosis of problems. I'm just pointing out some of the deficits as well. I've since learned that each dealership varies considerably in their behavior. There are many examples on Porsche forums where owners did not incur out-of-pocket expenses for similar problems.
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  #13  
Old June 27th, 2012, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjun View Post
Now as far as people other than me accessing the information, you will have to bring a search warrant to see the data on my cars.
I am not convinced this is true.

The potential Big Brother aspects of these data tracker devices seem self-evident. Times are changing...
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  #14  
Old June 27th, 2012, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwp View Post
They cited five blackbox incidences of redline in 52,000 miles.

I would have hit redline more than that on the way home from the dealer. That's what the red line is for, if they are adamant that it causes engine damage they need to lower the rev limiter.
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  #15  
Old June 28th, 2012, 08:20 AM
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That's exactly what I said, Crown14. I even kept a log of the 10+ conversations I had with PCNA. All to no avail. By the time I got done arguing with them and delaying repairs because of that it took me three months to get the car back. At least i had the Defender to drive. The Porsche has otherwise been great. But the dealer has not.

I guess it's like any new technology. It can be used for a great deal of benefit, but it can really deal you a bad hand if someone uses it the wrong way.
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  #16  
Old June 28th, 2012, 08:36 AM
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If you don't mind sharing, what is a budget to repair a "blown" 3.4L?
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  #17  
Old June 28th, 2012, 01:22 PM
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I don't mind they knowing what I do with the car, as long as nothing bad happens to the car. I just want to own it for like 3-4 years, than when I get bored, either I'll get the 991 Turbo S or the Aventador.
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  #18  
Old June 28th, 2012, 01:45 PM
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There are balck boxes on all of our new emergency vehicles. They come from the factory but only track the last 30 seconds to a minute of data. After that the memory refreshes itself.

They are really used for accidents - how fast were you goin? Brakes applied? and when? Lights on? and so forth.

This info can save your but or dig your grave....
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